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General Discussions => The Lab => Topic started by: roginator on March 10, 2010, 05:18:23 PM

Title: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: roginator on March 10, 2010, 05:18:23 PM
whell this small beast have great sound... and since i keeped one of few I had.... i spend some time using it in studio.

I notice that channels are actually very different in color and volume also noise level was different on each channel..
in studio I use it as preamps, expander for more channels to my MCI 500 and FX returns since my MCI have only 4 //

Studer is in use as 12 ch desk!!!

after some time I decided to do complete restauration of console

- For all channels recaping of electrolytic caps and tantalums is MUST!!!
after I open console and notice that 80% of FRAKO caps are lets almost dead i ordered panasonic and elna caps

almost all frako caps looked like this!!!
(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4027/4423530992_c18b31fef8.jpg)

SCARY!!!!!


I/o Module Caps list is:

100uf/25v x8
220uf/25v x5
47uf/16v Tantalum x1
10uf/25v Tantalum x4

Cleaning faders is MUST !!! top end is in 90% dirty and make crackle while useing it ..so I cleaned that too

also I notice that poor made trim pot is used in I/O module for Fader Buffer calibration RUWIDO 4k7 ... I relpaced it with multiturn Bourns one!!!  
(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4005/4423550448_4d4b5dedec.jpg)
(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4056/4422785847_e2d8e02c53.jpg)

still have to demagnetize transformers on modules and mod it for direct output!!!!!

STUDER 169 i/o module after restauration!!!!
(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4061/4423564646_18d0be6e9e_b.jpg)
 


Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: roginator on March 10, 2010, 05:33:44 PM
169 MASTER MODULES!!!

List of recaping of each summing module !

100uf/25v x5
220uf/25v x3
1000uf/6,3v x1
1000uf/16v axial x2
0,47uf/35v Tantalum x1
3,3uf/25v Tantalum x2
6,8uf/25v Tantalum x1
10uf/25v Tantalum x3

also cleaned faders and thinking of replacing trim pots and recalibrating modules!!!!
(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4038/4423584980_083decf10c_b.jpg)


Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: pippo64 on March 10, 2010, 07:26:07 PM
thanks Damir will do recapp and other things in the future, one question: using reverbs units or other hardware as inserts on the 169 channels, is not clear to me how to do it, on the manual says connect the output of reverb unit to the hi level input (xlr)
is correct or there is a better way?

ciao filippo
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: roginator on March 10, 2010, 07:28:47 PM
on i/o modules REPLACE R47 trim !!!!!!!!!!!!
it make big difference on REV SEND, and output of each module in db!!!!!!!!!!!

that RUWIDO are BAD!!!!!!
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2792/4423029963_b8e54ab0da_o.jpg)
(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4044/4423794508_1b6d04d8fe_b.jpg)
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: roginator on March 10, 2010, 07:37:27 PM
thanks Damir will do recapp and other things in the future, one question: using reverbs units or other hardware as inserts on the 169 channels, is not clear to me how to do it, on the manual says connect the output of reverb unit to the hi level input (xlr)
is correct or there is a better way?

ciao filippo

Hi Filipo

whell you can connect 2 ways!!!

If you wanna use pre fader send ...use FB if you want post fader eq use SEND REV....

connect input of your reverb to talk back module .... on back of that modules is FB and SEND REV summing output (XLR out balanced) ... on talkback module also is MASTER send control for FB and SEND REV.
return output from your reverb into master section modules (XLR balanced inputs)... on top of that modules are line inputs balanced to use as FX return.. select pan and level and go!!!! :)

or you can return signal from reverb to 2 of channels and use them to color reverb with fx :)
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: echorec on March 10, 2010, 07:43:20 PM
Hello, great job and thanks for sharing with pics. I had one of these before and it sounded quite good but I bet yours sound even better now after the restauration.
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: roginator on March 10, 2010, 07:49:10 PM
This is bit crazy...

I have few modules from different revisions of 169 in my console... on 2 modules I dont have that BUFFER FADER TRIM.. and output on modules are different..removed factory trim and recalibrated all modules!!!!!

BINGO!!! INPUT MODULES ARE PERFECT!!! still to demagnetize tomorrow!!!!!! and route direct outputs from preamps!!!!!

bunch of I/o Modules ... you can see different revisions by different XLR colors on back of modules
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2766/4423796006_3d0b6107bd_b.jpg)


Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: roginator on March 10, 2010, 08:13:45 PM
ok here are Talkback module and Control room module
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2761/4423871296_0556efcb30_b.jpg)


Recaping list for talkback module:

100uf/25v x4
220uf/25v x2
1000uf/6,3v x2
1000uf/16v axial x4
47uf/16v Tantalum x3
1uf/25v Tantalum x2
3,3uf/25v Tantalum x2
10uf/25v Tantalum x5

Recaping list for CTRL room module:

100uf/25v x2
220uf/25v x5
100uf/16v Tantalum x6

on CTRL room module remove RC 4136N from IC socket and clean pins ..they are heavy oxidated.

Recaping list for bridge meter:

220uf/25v axial x8

Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: roginator on March 10, 2010, 09:15:23 PM
Modification for direct out :

I used idea that Dualflip explained in his racking design
....

Remove pins from patch bay that is on back of modules from connection points 95, 96, 97 on PCB .... and keep 98 yellow wire (on my modules) in place
that way you free patch points for use as unbalanced out!!!!

PBC is top mid connection point of patch bay on back of module (red wire)... extend wire and connect to connection point 14 or 15 on PCB under fader. (SIGNAL OUT)
PCM is lower left patchbay point (if looking from back)  (blue wire) ... extend it and connect it to ground point anywhere on module where you like it...my module have ground point above connection point 98.. so i used that one!!!

leave PBL white wire patch point free...(maybe for future use)

thats it you have unbalanced exit from each i/o module !!!! thanx Dualflip!!!!
(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4058/4423989548_9947c371ca_o.jpg)

Before modification:
(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4016/4423397985_8a1c484bee.jpg)

After modification...follow red extended wire:
(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4069/4423397661_9c3f923989_b.jpg)
(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4034/4424161076_8fc1f9e47c_b.jpg)
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: roginator on March 10, 2010, 09:27:15 PM
recaping of DC/DC converter in front of frame

how it looks original
(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4027/4320571616_4e10d6bae5_b.jpg)

Recaped
(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4025/4423280265_8259ca9cbe_b.jpg)


Recaping list of DC/DC converter:

47uf/50v x1
220uf/25v x1
220uf/63v x2
1000uf/25v x6
2200uf/40v axial x2

Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: roginator on March 10, 2010, 10:04:27 PM
OK now de-magnetizing!!!!!!!!

some time ago I found on this forum  THANK you 1954U1

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
quickly done the de-magnetizing procedure suggested:
sine wave at 30 Hz, 30 secs sweep 0V-3V [point of saturation], 30 secs sweep 3V-0V.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
so now 28 input transformers to de-magnetize :o
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: snipsnip on March 11, 2010, 05:05:28 AM
Good job, I always wanted a 169...
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: SIXTYNINER on March 12, 2010, 10:12:02 AM
 :o  incredible!!!!!

big work done!

6t9r
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: gemini86 on March 12, 2010, 04:06:14 PM
!!!
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: sodderboy on March 13, 2010, 09:06:06 AM
That is great work on a great console.
What happened to all the wiper legs to those old pots?
And you might consider replacing those RC 4136's, at least in the mix/monitor section with something like a LT1359 or LM49740.  Jim Williams is big on this type of swap, and eliminates the coupling caps at the output.  I am going to try it on a certain British console that just don't sound good because it is loaded with TLO74's.
Mike
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: roginator on March 31, 2010, 08:28:11 PM
OK .....

cleaned frame.... looks like new.... ready to be loaded!!!!
(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4039/4479829193_693c9751a6_b.jpg)
(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4027/4480473666_c3ff1bd580_b.jpg)

whell ... after that tried to recalibrate all trims on master modules and realized that allmost all are scratchy and no good to be used....

whell more work replacing trim post!!!!!! not just RUWIDO on i/o channels ... I replaced em all on console!!!!

.. well ok I want studer in perfect shape!!!!

example BEFORE change of trim potentiometers  ... BAD, DIRTY, OLD....
(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4069/4479847619_40d695af0f_b.jpg)

and after .... NEW, FRESH.....
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2735/4479844679_323308cf9b_b.jpg)

weekend is finish!! ..I will recalibrate and test console
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: roginator on March 31, 2010, 08:30:11 PM
GOOD

hahahhahaa I just realized I forgot to replace 1 ..... 22k .... hehe thanx to camera!!! .... I go fix that too..
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: roginator on April 29, 2010, 08:34:49 AM
OK UPDATE .. some new pictures..EXTENDER are FINALLY in function!!!

diddlydoo

(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4061/4562482301_3bb3e1cfe3_b.jpg)
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3345/4563116522_1488d9b53f_b.jpg)
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: W DeMarco on April 29, 2010, 12:49:55 PM
Wow, that is some piece of gear,  Good luck with your restoration!
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: AK79 on April 29, 2010, 03:40:17 PM
i like the extender

can you give me a hint where to get the connectors ?

thanks
arne
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: Mike Cleaver on April 29, 2010, 08:43:35 PM
Beautiful job!
Your work looks excellent.
I love old Studer stuff, used to do a lot of work on their tape machines and cd players.
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: roginator on April 30, 2010, 04:29:07 AM
i like the extender

can you give me a hint where to get the connectors ?

thanks
arne

in your console... if you use only 2 bus!!!!! you have 4 spare connectors in it that you will never use!!!for quad !!!

so 4 connectors are there
......latter if you want you can return them to console!!!!!!!

:)
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: smallbutfine on April 30, 2010, 05:39:38 AM
Excellent how-to with excellent photos!
I did not realize there is a simple 'de-magnetizing' procedure for transformers!
Is it really a hearable improvement or do you do this just to be sure that nothing is sub-optimal?
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: roginator on May 08, 2010, 01:54:12 PM
yes .. in 2 of cca 26 transformators i heard a big difference in bass !!!!!

:)
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: roginator on May 08, 2010, 01:54:46 PM
Calibration of Studer was easy ... only problem was calibration of limiter

1. calibrate DC - DC converter

2. Calibration of Input modules was very easy to set 10db on fader amp..(with multiturn trimpots its very easy heh )

3. calibration of outputs x4 ..2 for stereo out, 2 for sends... THD calibration, easy by the book

4. CALIBRATION OF LIMITER WAS PAIN!!!!

5.calibration of talkback module and monitor module went great BY THE BOOK!!

6. still have to calibrate meter bridge!!!


--------------------------

ok lets get back to limiter calibration.... problem of calibration was to get identical levels in master modules..

HERE IS WHAT WAS A PROBLEM .... there are few zener diodes 7,5v and few 1N4448 diodes..
CHANGE THEM ALL and then do calibration of limiters!!!



they were leaking and voltages were not correct .. old diodes out , new in!!!!!!
hope that will help few of you guys who do calibration of your studer 169 consoles!!!!
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: isophase on May 08, 2010, 02:29:45 PM
Wow
excellent, thank you for sharing
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: mono-poly on May 21, 2010, 01:21:52 PM
Does anyone know a source for the knob colored caps?
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: mono-poly on May 21, 2010, 01:55:53 PM
I think i found them.
ELMA makes them now let's see if i can buy some.
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: radiance on May 22, 2010, 04:03:57 AM
what colors (size's) do you need mono?

Might have some left ...
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: livingnote on May 22, 2010, 04:11:22 AM
Yeah haaa so cool!
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: roginator on May 31, 2010, 07:22:44 AM
OK one note!!!!

I realized that all faders are not same in my console

and that took me cca 3 inspections of all modules to realize all mess!!!!

1. all faders have same part nr in studer service manula 1.169.550.00 BUT they are not all same!!!

2. in my desk i have 4 different values of faders!!

3. having that mixed I didnot like how my 169 behave!

so I service manual is pointing to only 2 values of faders in 169
2Kohm in input channel (mono) and 5Kohm in master... after a resears i realized!!!!

studer marked faders with their code (i think so heh )

and

markings on faders:

926 = 2K
902 = 3K
944 = 5k
104 = 10k 
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: roginator on May 31, 2010, 07:23:35 AM
IM LOOKING FOR 2x 926 2K studer faders for 169
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: 1954U1 on September 29, 2012, 08:18:40 AM
I'd add to this really useful topic some things I've done in the last years:

1] cleaning pushbuttons
All you need is a syringe and some contact cleaner fluid.
There are small linear openings at the rear top of the switches.

(http://yhr95gdcd.com/studer/pushbuttons/syringe0.jpg)

(http://yhr95gdcd.com/studer/pushbuttons/syringe1.jpg)



2] Transformers repair
I've had a faulty line transformer in an input module:
the primary's connections [6 and 8 are the interesting ones in input module] to the pins
were lost.
Repairing them is really easy, all you need is a little tip on your iron,
positioning the transformers so the solder will flow, thanks to gravity law, towards the wire, and a firm hand.
[as you can see, I've also cut/melt some of the plastic on pins 6 and 8, to have the wires nearer to the pins]
After that, the transformer started to works perfectly, measured also its winding DC resistances, completely in specs.

(http://yhr95gdcd.com/studer/transformers/repair/repaired0.jpg)

(http://yhr95gdcd.com/studer/transformers/repair/repaired1.jpg)



3] Adapting a 961/962 meterbridge
In this (http://www.groupdiy.com/index.php?topic=49982.0) topic I've documented how to 100% use the features of a 961/962 meterbridge in a 169/269 console.

(http://yhr95gdcd.com/studer/meterpanel/working0cropped.jpg)
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: jans on February 21, 2013, 02:31:55 PM
hi roginator,
i like the project. i own and use one as well. only i use the insertion out to go to my convertors. what is the difference in your mod? and where is the physical output then?
thanks,
jan
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: Cosmonaut on September 22, 2014, 07:32:44 AM
I have just the same problem with one of the line transformers in my Studer 169, I have opened and I can see the wires coming to the pins in number 6 , 7 and 8, but I can not measure nothing between 8 and whatever other pin.

 I should have a low resistanve between 6 and 8, no? am I missing something or just I have to solder it again?
Title: Re: Restauration of STUDER 169 console
Post by: Cosmonaut on September 22, 2014, 10:06:53 AM
I can see the wire on pin 8...but should be shorted inside the winding, my component tester and multimeter couldnĀ“t measure any resistance on this pin.