analag

Ni core vs. M6 core
« Reply #20 on: February 16, 2006, 08:40:53 AM »
Tell us about M6 vs M4 cores.
Audio engineering suffers from misinformation, disinformation, and downright lying more than most fields of endeavour.


edcorusa

Ni core vs. M6 core
« Reply #21 on: February 16, 2006, 09:09:40 AM »
Quote from: "analag"
Tell us about M6 vs M4 cores.


I am sorry, I have not herd of M4. I have check my suppliers and books and could not find any referance to M4. If any one has information on it I would be thankful in you could let me know. I would be interest in finding out about it.
----------------------------
Brian Weston
EDCOR Electronics
www.edcorusa.com
[url=http://www.facebook.com/pages/Carlsbad-NM/EDCOR-Electronics-Corporation/15595133818

Gus

Ni core vs. M6 core
« Reply #22 on: February 16, 2006, 09:41:38 AM »

alk509

Ni core vs. M6 core
« Reply #23 on: February 16, 2006, 02:26:42 PM »
That's a nice link, Gus. Thanks!

Peace,
Al.

Lest laziness get the best of you!

CJ

Ni core vs. M6 core
« Reply #24 on: February 16, 2006, 02:41:55 PM »
Don't forget the 4 mil stuff, like the cool C cores found in the Langevin outputs.
If I can't fix it, I can fix it so nobody else can!
Frank's Tube Page: www.mif.pg.gda.pl/homepages/frank/vs.html
Guitar Amps: http://bmamps.com/Tech_sch.html

rafafredd

Ni core vs. M6 core
« Reply #25 on: February 16, 2006, 06:42:08 PM »
here in Brazil most of what we get is M4.

analag

Ni core vs. M6 core
« Reply #26 on: February 16, 2006, 08:04:49 PM »
http://www.alphacore.com/cores.htm

I get most of my cores from here.
Audio engineering suffers from misinformation, disinformation, and downright lying more than most fields of endeavour.

AnalogPackrat

Ni core vs. M6 core
« Reply #27 on: February 16, 2006, 08:47:59 PM »
Cool link.  Thanks for sharing...
If it is to be, it is up to me.

analag

Ni core vs. M6 core
« Reply #28 on: February 18, 2006, 06:05:10 AM »
So how does the Edcor transformers sound. Something like the XSM10K/150 as a line level output trannie. I also wish more data was available on these things.
Audio engineering suffers from misinformation, disinformation, and downright lying more than most fields of endeavour.

Larrchild

Core Values
« Reply #29 on: February 20, 2006, 02:57:47 AM »
How bout them powdered cores?  They ever gonna sound good?   :?


mr coffee

Ni core vs. M6 core
« Reply #30 on: February 22, 2006, 12:21:38 AM »
Great Thread folks.

Edcor said
Quote
Ni and M6 have real different saturation and distortion characteristics. Forgive me, but M6 saturates at about 17,000 gauss and Ni about 5,000 gauss. The 1% distortion levels are at about 14,000 gauss and 4,000 gauss. Now what do you suppose one of the key ingredients is in the determination of primary turns? Walla,
it is the flux density and so as the flux goes down the turns must go up in a direct proportion. The saturation curves look really different on the scope and I am sure they sound really different, like sharp to smooth.


There seems to be a great deal of hype for big expensive Ni transformers and yet many highly respected classic transformers (line level) seem to use modified gap soft iron cores.

Can your share any more about your findings about the saturation behavior of transformers using M6 cores ?

And Thank You for your excellent essay addressing this issue! :thumb:

CJ

Ni core vs. M6 core
« Reply #31 on: February 22, 2006, 04:13:49 PM »
Powder cores are rapidly relacing laminations. At least, according to one shop down the street.
Al values are going up.
Two piece design, if not brittle, is a time saver.
If I can't fix it, I can fix it so nobody else can!
Frank's Tube Page: www.mif.pg.gda.pl/homepages/frank/vs.html
Guitar Amps: http://bmamps.com/Tech_sch.html

mr coffee

Ni core vs. M6 core
« Reply #32 on: February 22, 2006, 06:51:17 PM »
Hi CJ,
Quote
Powder cores are rapidly relacing laminations.


For audio apps? :shock:

CJ

Ni core vs. M6 core
« Reply #33 on: February 22, 2006, 07:51:19 PM »
I hope not.
Stock up just in case!
If I can't fix it, I can fix it so nobody else can!
Frank's Tube Page: www.mif.pg.gda.pl/homepages/frank/vs.html
Guitar Amps: http://bmamps.com/Tech_sch.html

analag

Ni core vs. M6 core
« Reply #34 on: February 23, 2006, 07:45:38 AM »
http://www.audiotransformers.net/tech_notes/tn41.htm
http://www.audiotransformers.net/tech_notes/tn12.htm

Well I ordered a couple transformers from EDCOR today. They will be featured in my next project
Audio engineering suffers from misinformation, disinformation, and downright lying more than most fields of endeavour.

Bauman

Ni core vs. M6 core
« Reply #35 on: February 23, 2006, 01:04:19 PM »
Dont be afraid, try some M4, it not that bad!!!  :thumb:
cheers!
Fabio
_____________________
www.thediypill.com/store

alk509

Ni core vs. M6 core
« Reply #36 on: February 23, 2006, 02:56:20 PM »
Actually, shouldn't M4 be better than M6? Less losses and such?

Peace,
Al.

Lest laziness get the best of you!

rafafredd

Ni core vs. M6 core
« Reply #37 on: February 23, 2006, 04:14:42 PM »
I do think so. We only have M4 in Brazil. I do like transformers made out of those lams by Lynx audio a LOT!

He is currently winding a 5116b based output transformer in a M4 C core for me. If it works nice, I´ll have many made, as I bought a lot of twelve M4 C cores.

This core is a little larger than the original Langevin.

analag

Ni core vs. M6 core
« Reply #38 on: February 23, 2006, 04:17:45 PM »
I have wound transformers with both M4 and M6 laminations, these things actually have a sound, in that I mean the way they go into saturation. Nickel don't saturate gracefully at all.
Audio engineering suffers from misinformation, disinformation, and downright lying more than most fields of endeavour.

edcorusa

Ni core vs. M6 core
« Reply #39 on: February 23, 2006, 05:36:34 PM »
Quote from: "Bauman"
Dont be afraid, try some M4, it not that bad!!!  :thumb:


 :sad: I have check with a few steel lamination companies about M4 vs. M6 steel. The M4 is a M6 steel that has been rolled down to 0.011? apposed to the standard M6 that is 0.014? thick. The M6 has a 5% more efficient stacking factor. The M4 is also more expensive and harder to get in the US. Because it is a thinner lamination you can not use stacking machines with it. This increase the price of the transformer final cost and is not any better. I have not tested the performance, but have looked at the curves and data prodived to me by the steel lamination companies. They do carry it, and I might see about getting a sample and try it out in the future. :idea:
----------------------------
Brian Weston
EDCOR Electronics
www.edcorusa.com
[url=http://www.facebook.com/pages/Carlsbad-NM/EDCOR-Electronics-Corporation/15595133818


 

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