We don't "make" things anymore ...

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MartyMart

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 28, 2006
Messages
2,340
Location
Berlin for a while
I've been reading how the UK will be hit quite hard during the "recession" -
which isn't news to me, I was aware of that problem almost 18 months ago !

The reason being that the UK's "wealth" or lack of it - is based these days on
the money market / investments and being a player with our precious
"British pound" in the world.

We stopped "making things" over the last 20 years that provide us with cash
from exports :

No car industry to speak of
No more shipping industry
No more steel industry
No more coal industry
We don't have enough oil/gas to use for ourself, never mind to export !!
( we rely on those huge pipelines from Russia which I find quite scary )

OK we have always had a good income from sucessful UK Rock/Pop bands and
we sell a few nice Jams and HP Source, but this is not enough to keep us going.

With the financial mess that the world is in, it looks like some very tough times
for the UK.

Who the heck thought that "not making anything that we can export" was a good
idea ????

:roll: :roll:

MM.
 
I agree wholehartedly with your sentiments.

I recall the phrase 'a nation of shopkeepers' being used back in the Thatcher regime. Shopkeepers and bankers!
 
Yes I remember that phrase too, now it's more like "a nation of wannabe celebrities and WAGS" !!

WAGS = "Wifes and Girlfriends" - of famous footballers etc



....hmm where did the "Great" in "Great Britain" go I wonder .....
 
[quote author="MartyMart"]I've been reading how the UK will be hit quite hard during the "recession" -
which isn't news to me, I was aware of that problem almost 18 months ago !

The reason being that the UK's "wealth" or lack of it - is based these days on
the money market / investments and being a player with our precious
"British pound" in the world.

We stopped "making things" over the last 20 years that provide us with cash
from exports :

No car industry to speak of
No more shipping industry
No more steel industry
No more coal industry
We don't have enough oil/gas to use for ourself, never mind to export !!
( we rely on those huge pipelines from Russia which I find quite scary )

OK we have always had a good income from sucessful UK Rock/Pop bands and
we sell a few nice Jams and HP Source, but this is not enough to keep us going.

With the financial mess that the world is in, it looks like some very tough times
for the UK.

Who the heck thought that "not making anything that we can export" was a good
idea ????

:roll: :roll:

MM.[/quote]

But you guys have James Bond. He will rescue you for sure. :green:
 
Best option would be resurrect the Morgan! A wooden car made with out a production line by twice as many people as necessary :grin: Screw efficiency!
 
SSL, Maselec, AMS, ATC, PMC, Prism, Cedar....Admittedly it isn't Toyota but I'm sure the work and pay is better.
 
MM, good point. I feel America is in the same position. We have a huge trade decifit, which clearly indicates we make less at home. And note that much of our imports are financed with short term T-Bills. We now largely have a service based economy, not manufacturing based.

America, as a nation, is in debt up to our eyeballs. As Peter Schiff (Dr. Doom) often articulates, we went from the worlds largest creditor to world's largest debtor in a matter of 50 years. And, as a nation, we don't save money, in part because of terrible Federal Reserve monetary policy keeping interest rates way too low.

If I were smart I'd learn how to farm or start manufacturing something. :green:
 
One place where Canada gets the shaft is for softwood exports ,
where U.S. companies buy from us because we have allot and it is
cheaper but congressmen claim it unfairly subsidized and add tariffs
none of which they give back to us [ we've won this ruling several times ]
there are more examples ............................
when everybody is going for the bottom line economy
it becomes a little penny wise i think

Of course it's not always easy to buy locally , but even tough
trying to buy within one's country , sometimes the stuff that is not
worth it to ship [ building materials , heavy goods ]

How is the chinese to other ratio of junk in the U.K. ?

we should start a survey , What cool or Good value items
Don't come from China ?
 
I don't think we can blame central bank interest rates for our low personal savings rate. Rampant consumerism is a cultural shift, programmed into our children by popular culture and not offset by conservative parenting.

re: decline in manufacturing, as discussed before, GB was buying cheesy cheap goods from the US a few hundred years ago because we were the cheap provider. That day has long passed.

Wealth creation has shifted from weaving cotton into cloth, to designing high fashion in the west, and making those designer dresses where ever is cost effective. The operative point is that a significant portion of the wealth created is captured where the design was done, low level jobs will continue to move around the world, chasing cheap labor and most effective use of capital. If we increase taxation on capital it will move to friendlier climes.

If we were only shop keepers and bed pan changers we would just be cutting up a shrinking pie. So go out and create something... make a hit record (MM), you know it's in you somewhere... That is the modern manufacturing, selling movies and music to the world. Creating stuff...

BOE just executed a record one day drop in interest rate as Euro zone is discovering that inflation is not the worst thing that can happen. Good luck to us all. This is far from over. In the short term that will strengthen the dollar vs pound, but we're probably not done cutting.

JR


.
 
Federal Reserve policy indeed does have an impact on US savings rates. Also, the government encourages spending... i.e. stimulus packages.

One short example - Putting my money in a CD at even 5% is a waste. With our highly inflated fiat currency... let's assume 3% inflation, I get a net 2% on my money. With a realistic 5%+ inflation, I'm really not making any money in a CD. If short term interested rates went to 10%+, people would start to save money and stop wasting it on flat screen TVs and granite countertops.

However, if that were to happen, our national debt would baloon because China, Japan, and other countries hold our debt in short term T-Bills.

And I do not, in any way, think that a serviced based economy, in the long run, can outperform a manufacturing based economy.

And also, do not measure the value of the dollar against other fiat currencies... they are flawed as well. Measure the value of the dollar against precious metals and commodities and you will see just how inflated it is.
 
I guess I'm just ignorant since I managed to bank money while I was pulling down a fair paycheck. I put most of that in the market, which at the moment doesn't look very smart. The market movement since the election doesn't look promising, but the down volume is lighter than the up volume was just before, so I continue to ride this sick pony. I am tempted to dip into my working capital to buy more stock at these stupid low levels, but I'm not smart enough to declare market bottoms, and I have other things to do with my capital that better beat inflation, or I'm really a fool..

Even this market or a zero interest savings acct, is better than buying wall sized projection TV amd new cars every few years.. Ironically I just bought my first new TV in almost 20 years. Half the price of the old one, not counting inflation. Now I can actually read the scores and stock ticker on the screen. The car is 11+ and I'm not ready to replace, even in this buyer's market.

I don't trust the general public to act in their own best interest, when they demonstrate over and over that they are more about short term gratification. YMMV

JR
 
[quote author="MartyMart"]Who the heck thought that "not making anything that we can export" was a good idea ????

:roll: :roll:

MM.[/quote]

After the United States, Britain is the world's second biggest arms exporter.
 
John, don't get me wrong... I actively invest and trade in US equities. I've made some nice money this year shorting the financial sector (which I covered last week). I also lost a good bit in some material stocks. Nevertheless, my savings & retirement (IRA) is nearly all in cash currently because, well, it helps me sleep at night.

But long term I see inflation as a serious problem... this is why I don't want to be in US dollars or US equities. I have been watching many currency and commodity ETFs, and just a handful of US equities. I totally agree that trying to call a bottom is risky business. I am a young investor and learned early on picking bottoms is a sure way to lose money.

And even if I have a change of heart and buy many US stocks, I will probably always continue to keep gold as a hedge against inflation.

And I don't want you to feel like I'm trying to call you ignorant or anything remotely close to that. I've read many of your posts and think you are well read and quite intelligent. Cheers.
 
[quote author="peter purpose"][quote author="MartyMart"]Who the heck thought that "not making anything that we can export" was a good idea ????

:roll: :roll:

MM.[/quote]

After the United States, Britain is the world's second biggest arms exporter.[/quote]

Yes, we also export much of our electronic waste to China, however, we import other countries nuclear waste.

What worries me is how much food we import. I was buying some vegetables in Tesco the other day & most of the stuff is grown anywhere but here. I was trying to buy stuff grown here, but many of the runner beans etc are grown in places like Kenya.
 
[quote author="peter purpose"]
After the United States, Britain is the world's second biggest arms exporter.[/quote]
Really? I thought it was all those nice neutral Swissies and Scandanavians? Must look it up!
 

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