sonicmook56
Well-known member
I almost fell out of my chair!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdW30AefDF0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdW30AefDF0
Bush Comes Under Shoe Attack in Baghdad
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clintrubber
Well-known member
This also made it to the Dutch TV this evening. Was expecting some semi-witty reply from him, but he remained silent.
CroatianSensation
Well-known member
A coupla mayo filled balloons and better aim would have made things a bit more interesting.
;D
;D
abby normal
Well-known member
I love how he just ducks and comes back up. No one does anything for what seems to be forever. Ha, ha, ha! ;D
Thanks god somebody did this
Shoes have an extra pejorative (unclean) significance in that culture. It's insulting to even show people the bottom of your shoes.
That looked like he was trying for more than a symbolic insult.
I can just imagine what kind of response the shoe hurler would have enjoyed under Saddam.
I'm sure it will make many smile on the Arab street, and apparently here : but is embarrassing for the Iraqi leadership.
It does feel a little like freedom, but they need to stick to protest signs and chanting.
JR
That looked like he was trying for more than a symbolic insult.
I can just imagine what kind of response the shoe hurler would have enjoyed under Saddam.
I'm sure it will make many smile on the Arab street, and apparently here :
but is embarrassing for the Iraqi leadership. It does feel a little like freedom, but they need to stick to protest signs and chanting.
JR
solder_city
Well-known member
yawn, jr, youre so predictable.
soon your boy will be GONE and we can begin the hard task of cleaning up all his messes.
soon your boy will be GONE and we can begin the hard task of cleaning up all his messes.
CroatianSensation
Well-known member
I would have sent Lance in...http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=fbDDtnFbBcc&NR=1
He'd have known what to throw! ;D
He'd have known what to throw! ;D
solder_city said:
I thought some of you might take extra pleasure at learning of shoes extra symbolism in their culture, and actually learn something en passant.
If I'm so predictable I don't need to respond to your personal comment since you can probably guess what I'm thinking.
JR
Ptownkid
Well-known member
Yeah, I'm not sure what the point of your comment was solder...JR was pointing out the extra irony that is on YOUR side of the coin.
I think the best part is that Dubya said "I don't know what the guy's cause is..." really though, you don't know why an iraqi would dislike you...wowsers
I think the best part is that Dubya said "I don't know what the guy's cause is..." really though, you don't know why an iraqi would dislike you...wowsers
Eric H
Well-known member
Quick reaction time on the first shoe; he damned near caught the second.
You want him to say something sporty, too?
You want him to say something sporty, too?
strangeandbouncy
Well-known member
he did attempt a whitty response, he quipped that "they were size 10, if anyone wanted to know . . ."
Twot . . .
Twot . . .
SSLtech
Well-known member
Hey Solder City, there's no need for that really...
John is a pretty smart bloke, and we all have different beliefs.
...He just happens to believe a lot of wrong stuff, that's all!
(Only joshin' Jonn!)
Anyhow, I did happen to know that, but only because I read a book called "East of Wimbledon" (by Nigel Williams) about 15 years ago. -In it, the "twenty-fourthers" (devotees to the 24th Imam) repeatedly took off one shoe and waved it at the book's central character, a London-born convert to Islam, who only 'converted' (or rather pretended to convert) so that he could get a date with a girl... and of course he's blissfully ignorant to why these people are waving their shoes at him, which he considers a little odd.
So it was my first reaction that this was almost certainly a particularly insulting act, more so than most westerners might appreciate.
For my part, I'm not surprised. -Apparently there are now lots of demonstrations calling for the reporter's release (he's being held in custody) and he's grown rather quickly to hero status among many Iraqis, particularly the Mehdi Army and insurgents... This may yet assume rather significant overtones.
Frederick Forsyth (a former diplomat turned author, whos books are researched with meticulous detail) wrote in his book "the Fist of God" (which was a fictional story, written after -but set within- the first Gulf war) about a memo to the secretary of state or defense -I forget which- (this is all from memory, so forgive me) that Iraq would seriously risk breaking up into three distinct fractured 'nations' if the stabilizing 'police' setup under Sadaam Hussein were to be removed from power... Mr. Forsyth is a stunningly well-informed stickler for accuracy, and so this was indeed known.
-In fact it was known by no less a personage than Mr. Dick Cheney. -He knew this back at the end of the first Gulf war. -How do I know this? Because he went on live television and said so. -He just seemed to conveniently "forget" this a dozen years later.
They completely buggered up the country, tens of thousands of people are dead, Thousands of American troops are dead, the previous contempt for America has now been stirred up into a festering hatred.
For this, the present administration DESERVES what they get. They're a castle full of rascals. Self-serving, scheming bastards, fronted by an outwardly amiable, incompetent fool.
Nathan Hale said: "I regret that I have but one life to lose for my country." ...My personal regret is that the reporter only had two shoes.
Keith
John is a pretty smart bloke, and we all have different beliefs.
...He just happens to believe a lot of wrong stuff, that's all!
(Only joshin' Jonn!)
Anyhow, I did happen to know that, but only because I read a book called "East of Wimbledon" (by Nigel Williams) about 15 years ago. -In it, the "twenty-fourthers" (devotees to the 24th Imam) repeatedly took off one shoe and waved it at the book's central character, a London-born convert to Islam, who only 'converted' (or rather pretended to convert) so that he could get a date with a girl... and of course he's blissfully ignorant to why these people are waving their shoes at him, which he considers a little odd.
So it was my first reaction that this was almost certainly a particularly insulting act, more so than most westerners might appreciate.
For my part, I'm not surprised. -Apparently there are now lots of demonstrations calling for the reporter's release (he's being held in custody) and he's grown rather quickly to hero status among many Iraqis, particularly the Mehdi Army and insurgents... This may yet assume rather significant overtones.
Frederick Forsyth (a former diplomat turned author, whos books are researched with meticulous detail) wrote in his book "the Fist of God" (which was a fictional story, written after -but set within- the first Gulf war) about a memo to the secretary of state or defense -I forget which- (this is all from memory, so forgive me) that Iraq would seriously risk breaking up into three distinct fractured 'nations' if the stabilizing 'police' setup under Sadaam Hussein were to be removed from power... Mr. Forsyth is a stunningly well-informed stickler for accuracy, and so this was indeed known.
-In fact it was known by no less a personage than Mr. Dick Cheney. -He knew this back at the end of the first Gulf war. -How do I know this? Because he went on live television and said so. -He just seemed to conveniently "forget" this a dozen years later.
They completely buggered up the country, tens of thousands of people are dead, Thousands of American troops are dead, the previous contempt for America has now been stirred up into a festering hatred.
For this, the present administration DESERVES what they get. They're a castle full of rascals. Self-serving, scheming bastards, fronted by an outwardly amiable, incompetent fool.
Nathan Hale said: "I regret that I have but one life to lose for my country." ...My personal regret is that the reporter only had two shoes.
Keith
rob_gould
Well-known member
SSLtech said:
Amen to that
As I've said before we can revisit this debate years from now when we have some historical perspective. My views of Viet Nam, during the '60s were far different than my later views after years of reflection.
I was only trying to inform about the cultural significance of the shoe thing... I have been paying attention to the middle east for years and it is far more complex than people grasp from the superficial and often polarized news coverage.
I hope the journalist does not get severely punished, despite the appearance of more than symbolic intent in his action. He looks like he really tried to bean him, not just show him the bottom of his shoe. I fear the Iraqi government is embarrassed by this. It would make Malaki appear stronger and demonstrate free speech in Iraq if this guy gets off relatively easy.
FWIW this is a case of a journalist trying and largely succeeding to be the story instead of just report it... I'm glad he did it with shoes and not a suicide vest. We just lost 48 people up in Kirkuk to a bomb.
If interested in what Iraqi people actually think about it here are some quotes from NYT, not known to be friendly to Bush.
http://baghdadbureau.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/12/15/iraqis-pick-up-their-shoes-reaction-from-around-the-country/?pagemode=print
JR
I was only trying to inform about the cultural significance of the shoe thing... I have been paying attention to the middle east for years and it is far more complex than people grasp from the superficial and often polarized news coverage.
I hope the journalist does not get severely punished, despite the appearance of more than symbolic intent in his action. He looks like he really tried to bean him, not just show him the bottom of his shoe. I fear the Iraqi government is embarrassed by this. It would make Malaki appear stronger and demonstrate free speech in Iraq if this guy gets off relatively easy.
FWIW this is a case of a journalist trying and largely succeeding to be the story instead of just report it... I'm glad he did it with shoes and not a suicide vest. We just lost 48 people up in Kirkuk to a bomb.
If interested in what Iraqi people actually think about it here are some quotes from NYT, not known to be friendly to Bush.
http://baghdadbureau.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/12/15/iraqis-pick-up-their-shoes-reaction-from-around-the-country/?pagemode=print
JR
> the cultural significance of the shoe thing...
Who admits to remembering Khrushchev and his shoe at the UN?
(If you only read it in the running-dog lackey western press, be sure to read his grandaughter's exploration of the event.)
And there were shoes in the Marcos' rise and fall from power.
We need a book: Shoe Diplomacy.
Who admits to remembering Khrushchev and his shoe at the UN?
(If you only read it in the running-dog lackey western press, be sure to read his grandaughter's exploration of the event.)
And there were shoes in the Marcos' rise and fall from power.
We need a book: Shoe Diplomacy.
I recall... though I was a young lad...
JR
JR
bcarso
Well-known member
Me too---no problem. And I also remember Adlai Stevenson showing the hole in his sole...
