capitalism vs Socialism. Which is better?

I agree these polls are usually nonsense and often the questions lead to specific answers so the pollster can sell the poll. I was getting repeat calls from one pollster, but I found the questions too frustrating. The issues were too complex for simple yes/no answers. I tried to get in touch with the person crafting the questions and they stopped bothering me. This fits my model of human nature where we think we understand more than we do, so our brain function doesn't freeze up under the weight of unresolved questions. These pollsters like people to answer without thinking about the questions.

On the subject of economic systems, I may be over simplifying this but IMO the important distinction between chaos and stability or economic growth is property rights. Simply put people must be allowed to own stuff. If they work hard and earn more stuff, they need to keep most of that or why bother.

Of course we need rule of law to protect property rights, otherwise warlords or whatever will just take what they want from those who have.  A central government is needed to provide this rule of law to protect individual property rights. The cost of this central government must be paid for by the people who are protected by the rule of law.

There are alternate views on how to "fairly" extract this support for the central government. Simply taking wealth from people who previously "earned" it is not a long term strategy since this wealth will run out. Charging people based on the cost of supporting them would never work, because they simply don't have the money to pay their way. A progressive income tax has so far proved an acceptable way to extract more money from the higher earners to subsidize the lower earners. Unlike some perpetual caste system, these low earners have the opportunity to rise above their humble means and become major contributors themselves.

The $64T question is "not" how do we extract the maximum revenue from earners to redistribute (ala Laffer curve, etc), but what is the proper role of central government. I submit that beyond protecting our property rights all else is secondary. Nobody disputes the value of a safety net to prevent abject poverty and to help people who are situationally challenged.

Our current administration is messing with the recipe which has worked so well for the last few hundred years and while not a long time in the grand scheme of history, I don't consider it a failed experiment quite yet. From where I sit it looks like the current credit /banking situation is being manipulated to suggest a deeper flaw in the economic system.

Of course opinions vary....

JR

I believe in a system where the government can't redistribute wealth by taxing folks to death, and giving it away to people here illegally . I believe in a system where the have-nots are motivated to go out and work for their goals, rather then demand their wants from the masses. If someone earns or is given money fairly, it's no one else's business, and no one else is entitled to that money.

Every government program is a failure, especially in the US. Some people think that government healthcare will work, fine. But then don't whine when the service is poor and your taxes are high. A free market fosters competition. It's that competition that keeps prices in check and quality high. The exception to this, as seen in the oil industry, is collusion, where multiple vendors align to raise prices.

The founding fathers of the U.S. did not expect people to be dependent on their government. I do not expect my government to save me, care for me, get me a job, or give me a place to live. That's my job.

Friends and family are to care for those who are down-trodden, poor, etc. The problem is we have a breakdown in the family resulting in children with no parents, no respect for the family they do have, and a subsequent lack of self respect! So now we have a segment of the population dependent on the government.

This gets me so angry because we are all brainwashed into thinking that this must be a left/right thing! IT'S A SCAM.

We have gone mad. Markets need some regulation. Yes it's true. People should not be allowed to speculate on commodities for instance. But that doesn't mean we need a government-run economy. It doesn't mean we need a welfare state, and it certainly doesn't mean that any of us on this planet are guaranteed anything out of life.

Look at the healthcare in Canada versus the US. There are tradeoffs. Sure, everyone in Canada has it, but at the same time the hospitals are not as good; and you can't always get in. People from Canada regularly come to the US for operations.

I have a friend from Ireland telling me that we in the US have it all wrong. I think that if we in the US were to live MORALLY, with respect and dignity, the free market would work, prosperity would be widespread, etc.

Does that mean everyone would be rich? No. My father in law told me about Washington Heights in New York. He told me that most people there grew up on the poorer side, but the people there had pride. Apartments were kept clean, people said hello to each other, neighbors cooked for one another. And then he said a lot of people moved in to Washington Heights during the late 60's and trashed it. The apartment buildings were trashed, crime went up, and that's when he left. Yes, the people that moved in were from different countries, but that's not the point. (After all, we all came here from different countries). A lot of them didn't work and collected.

But it's the CULTURE OF LAZINESS that ruins people. The notion that "I'm entitled to..." and that's where socialism sucks my friends.

As much as capitalism will results in crooks when we remove moral conscience, socialism easily results in a government class dictating the population's behavior and life expectations. This is what is happening in the US right now. Minorities are basically told they can't make it without the government. If you're poor, you're told that your disenfranchised.

But look at this board. Imagine if all the mods here said each one of you will get a Mackie 1604 mixer. For that mixer, we'll take $400 from your paycheck. No more DIY projects, we've determined that the 1604 meets your needs and it will be more cost effective to have everyone using the same mixer.

Regardless of whether or not you want or need that Mackie, you're getting it, and they are taking their money from those that have it. Now, you have no control over the price of that mixer, who makes it, etc. Let's say the moderators on this board set that price, as well as choose the mixer we all use. You might say, "well, I've done pretty good this year and I'd like to get a little nicer mixer". They will not give you your $400 back so you can use it towards the mixer of your choosing. Someone else might say, "Wow, I couldn't afford to get any mixer this year, this is great! I love the moderators!!"

...and so it works with the hospitals and insurance companies, if you get my drift.

Me? Keep me as financially disconnected from everyone else as possible. I'm responsible with my money and I can do a better job managing it than the government surely can. Look what they did to social security!! Look at the PORK in Obama's bailout blunder.
All garbage... Would YOU spend YOUR OWN money that way? Every DIME the government has comes from us. (Well now they just print more dollars....)

So tell me what socialism would do for me:

1.) I make a moderate salary, with insurance. The insurance is okay. About 27% of my check goes to taxes.
2.) No one smokes, drinks, does any drugs in my household.
3.) My wife and I work. (She goes back to work this fall - kids old enough now)
4.) We don't waste our money on junk and have saved what we need --- by working -- me working 2 jobs -- to have a down payment for a house with a low interest rate on the mortgage.
5.) We'd like to send our kids to a parochial school, but we still pay for the costs for our kids to go to a public school, even though they won't go there. So we don't know if we will be doing that right now.
6.) My car has 190,000 miles on it, but I change the oil and take care of it myself and it is still going. I am not someone who wants a new car every couple of years. But maybe I deserve a better car.

So, please tell me where I need socialism in my life? How does it help me??

Didn't mean to stir the pot too much...