line level to mic level passive box

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this is a schematic of a line to mic box just designed

Pier Paolo

 

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ppa said:
Men !, the D.W. Fearn LP-1 Line Pad cost 150 US $ !

Yes but I figure if I can make the same box for $25 it's worth it! A few XLRs, resistors. Some wire and an enclosure. If it was more complex I'd go for DW Fearn since I like their stuff, but anyone can build one of these.

Pier Paolo: thanks for the schematic!
 
DW Fearn states their box provides 45dB of attenuation. Any idea as to what R1 & R3 have to be for that?
 
> DW Fearn states their box provides 45dB of attenuation.

So? Is that the only right-answer?

Many mic-amps can choke down 1V without coughing. Few studio sources are over 10V. 20dB pad can work. 36dB pad will output 0.15V, which I'm sure your preamps can handle. Given a more sane 2V level, -36dB outputs 30mV, which even my old Langevin could digest.

> Any idea as to what R1 & R3 have to be for that?

"Bigger", obviously.

You want numbers? Take the number you have taken: 45dB. Convert that to voltage ratio: 178. Since this is much greater than "1", it is near-enough the ratio of big series resistor(s) to little shunt resistor.

The obvious shunt is the 150r. But this may have a 2K preamp in parallel, 140r. Multiply by 178: 24,837 ohms. You want that in two pieces, 12,419 ohms. A sharper pencil says 12,348.6 ohms. IAC: Use two brown-red-orange-gold against a brown-green-brown-gold.

Input impedance is over 24K, but under 25K, a happy zone for most sources.

Impedance shown to preamp is a hair under 150r (149r), and preamps should be very tolerant 50r-500r since mikes come all different Z.

If your resistor-box is VERY skimpy: 10K-100-10K gives 46.5dB 99r, which is same-as 45dB 150r for any musical purpose.
 
PRR said:
> DW Fearn states their box provides 45dB of attenuation.

So? Is that the only right-answer?

Many mic-amps can choke down 1V without coughing. Few studio sources are over 10V. 20dB pad can work. 36dB pad will output 0.15V, which I'm sure your preamps can handle. Given a more sane 2V level, -36dB outputs 30mV, which even my old Langevin could digest.

> Any idea as to what R1 & R3 have to be for that?

"Bigger", obviously.

You want numbers? Take the number you have taken: 45dB. Convert that to voltage ratio: 178. Since this is much greater than "1", it is near-enough the ratio of big series resistor(s) to little shunt resistor.

The obvious shunt is the 150r. But this may have a 2K preamp in parallel, 140r. Multiply by 178: 24,837 ohms. You want that in two pieces, 12,419 ohms. A sharper pencil says 12,348.6 ohms. IAC: Use two brown-red-orange-gold against a brown-green-brown-gold.

Input impedance is over 24K, but under 25K, a happy zone for most sources.

Impedance shown to preamp is a hair under 150r (149r), and preamps should be very tolerant 50r-500r since mikes come all different Z.

If your resistor-box is VERY skimpy: 10K-100-10K gives 46.5dB 99r, which is same-as 45dB 150r for any musical purpose.

Wow. Thanks PRR for all that info. I'm not very big on "tech talk" as you can probably imagine. I'm an artist, not a technician. No, 45dB attenuation may not be "the only right answer" but it's what I want. I like to crank the gain a little on the mic pres, therefore more attenuation is better. I don't think in numbers, I think in terms of what comes out of the speakers, and a couple steps of gain on the mic pres sound better to me.
 
I opened the DW golden box, but don't remember the value , an H pad wired point to point, 150$ is a good deal for DW  ;)
 
When running a line input into a mic pre, as well as headroom, you need to think about noise. Above gains of 30dB or so, most mic pres start raise the noise floor. For this reason I normally use a 33dB attenuator. You makes it with a couple of 3K3 resistors and a 150 ohm resistor. A +4dBu input becomes -29dBu which most modern mic pres will have np problem handling and to which they will add minimal noise.

The only downside of this solution is that the input impedance of the pad is abut 6K6. This is lower than the 10K bridging 'standard' but not a problem for most _4dBu sources.

Cheers

Ian
 
I carry the Switchcraft XLR tubes exactly for this purpose. 3 resistors, a few inches of cable and you're done!
http://classicapi.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=84_85_165&products_id=336
 
jsteiger said:
I carry the Switchcraft XLR tubes exactly for this purpose. 3 resistors, a few inches of cable and you're done!
http://classicapi.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=84_85_165&products_id=336

These are seemingly perfect for the task. Until on a busy day someone walks into the tubes ripping out the entire panel socket along with it!

give-me_-a-lever_-long_-enough_thumb.jpg
 
Wouldn't it be prudent to plan on P48 from the mike amp, and use at least some coupling caps or possibly a transformer?
 

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