[livingnote]

Haha yeah you got that one nailed 

I like that two-row header there. Afaic the good ol'
pinheader is just unbeatable.

[delaymix]

Big project! This is one of those projects that you know how it starts ... but nobody knows how you can finish... It seems a very interesting project. When we started to manufacture?

[TornadoTed]

I see this project as the final step in my DIY odyssey 

[Tubemooley]

Furthermore anyone taken a closer gander than this at this?
http://www.ambertech.com.au/feature.php?articleID=1375

The Radial Workhorse is not available yet. They're working on finishing it up for release. I contacted Sonic Circus right after AES in October. And then someone else in late December (maybe vintage king). It looks pretty cool but I would want to hear it. Hate to be a douche-bag here but they're probably using IC opamps. That ain't gonna' cut it for me. Still, it looks like a great design. DW.

[jsteiger]

very interested. also jeff if yr interested in some schematics and such I've got these:

which were built by me from surplus from an API 2488 refurb, designed and executed by Paul Wolff. To go with I also have routing modules and a motherboard for the bottom of the buckets. I'd do anything I can to spare you engineering time after marvelling at the 51X job y'all did...[/url]

Looks interesting Paul. Very similar to what I am proposing. What time frame was this from? Mid 80's? Looks like it was before Paul started with the 2510's. It does look like he started changing things from the vintage versions. I still don't know why he did not like the old way. Evolution I guess.

BTW, what input iron is that? Anything that looks like that has to sound great! 

Do you have these running as a "mixer" now?

...I guess most people here are probably wondering about the cost of undertaking a console like this.

Yes for sure Rob. I will work on some of the basics to get an idea together. There are so many variables and levels it could be taken to. I think the main thing will be what is involved with the input channels themselves. Faders, subgroup modules, metering and so on will be tackled after. I'm sure some folks will not need any additional subgroups. Some won't care about actual faders and may just use rotary pots.

Like I say, first things first with the input channel section.

Cheers, Jeff

[DAN_000]

Yes Jeff !!  Im very interested !!

Like I see ,  DAW insert point will be before line input.  I will like so much the posibility to swich the DAW insert point pre/post inserts (EQ/comps, etc).
This way,  we can choose record signals procesed with inserts or not.

Cheers !

[desol]

I see this project as the final step in my DIY odyssey  

You can say that again.

[benlindell]

It'd maybe be nice to set up the buckets with inserts after each one so you can send the signal to tape after any module and then return it at any point. Check out http://www.petesplaceaudio.com/MARK_VIII.html

[zayance]

I've saw the MARK VIII a couple of months ago, it looks really sweet and if this ends up behing made, it's possible to build with a little wood working ability...

[analogical]

It'd maybe be nice to set up the buckets with inserts after each one so you can send the signal to tape after any module and then return it at any point.

If you keep your sends balanced and the stuff you want to connect to under say, 50ft from your buckets, just buy a normalized patch panel and go to town.

[analogical]

I've saw the MARK VIII a couple of months ago, it looks really sweet and if this ends up behing made, it's possible to build with a little wood working ability...

My jaw dropped when I saw how much PP thinks some metal boxes wrapped in laminate particleboard should sell for...

Definitely you can make your console yourself, however be prepared to line the interior of your wooden wonder with some RF mesh or something. Consoles are made of metal not just for their strength, but also for the ability to keep unwanted electromagnetic yuckeyness away from the thousands of little antennae on your circuit boards. 

[zayance]

My jaw dropped when I saw how much PP thinks some metal boxes wrapped in laminate particleboard should sell for...

Definitely you can make your console yourself, however be prepared to line the interior of your wooden wonder with some RF mesh or something. Consoles are made of metal not just for their strength, but also for the ability to keep unwanted electromagnetic yuckeyness away from the thousands of little antennae on your circuit boards.  

Yeah i don't remember the price, but all i remember is that it was enough to not buy it  , and thanks for the tip, i'll take that in consideration, i know mumetal is expensive, but thin layer can be ok if you buy from some suppliers that have some extra stuff, I mean cutted foils and extra that they will sell for prototype things, i remember something like a A4 dimension  paper of 0.2, or 0.5mm( don't remember exactlly) was about 70 or 80 Euros more or less, from the supplier i found here in France, if my memory is correct.
That could be even better if used in critical places, and you'll still be far away from PP's prices, and still make a metal frame around the wood, that could be perfect, i'll have to get more into that when i have some time, just for taking a little advance on that project...

PS: by the way you can find some descent metal foil pliers (dunno if it's the name for it?) for a good price, and they'll do 1mm to 1.5mm thick steel or even 0.5 of galvanised steel, which is enough for that purpose, and there also you'll still be far from PP's prices, and you'll have a cool tool, to build PSU cases, paper cases, cigarette boxes, shoes case, ok i'll stop here, sorry  

[fluxivity]

Jeff, the long embarassing and unnecessary story of my API console, remember you sort of asked fr it. Back circa early nineties I had this 2488. It was awesome, sounded justlike a record, run signal through, mix it, damn everybodys always happy. Then I needed better routing, I just had to have better routing, one gain pot and 4 selectable sends would not do it any longer. "I'll redo the input modules." at the time the only thing I did worse than upgrade things was probably run a studio. Anyhow I pull out my gigantic box of schematics that doubled as a user manual and got the schemo for the 515, pulled one out of the board, opened it up, shut it very gingerly and started shopping for SSL's. A nightmarish mess of brittle wires and breaky switches. Stripped my eq's out of the board and traded it for a bunch of racks of 212 pres and off the console went. I missed it for mixing, but offline editing on the SSL taught me a lot about how to hit 1/2 in tape but you quickly learn to miss a 325 driven buss output. Anyhow, frickin years pass, sell the studio, get an EE degree, end up in virginia. It's 2009, I'm cruising the API listings on the ebay. "dang that console looks familiar..." and further down the listing sez twas in the egyptian room in new orleans. Whoa, my frikkin console, on the ebay. Turns out its 20 miles down the road from where I was living. owner had proven himself the man I would never be and contracted PW to redesign the input module circa early 2000's. I get the console to my ex partner in the san francisco studio and I inherit some eq's, a lot of extra circuit boards and a box full of my old nemesis the original 515 modules. Sold of the original ones to someone on the cheap who decided not to refurbish them if I recall correctly.
I contemplate getting a bucket running as a mixer but there is a dang darn burrbrown for the line input gain which really curdles my cheese. Probably I'll just rack up the ones I have running as I need dough to get parts of this console yr doing together. The original input transformers abound in various states of usability and crustiness, classic api output EA transformers have been on the output of the couple of racks I've made from them.

[boji]

...you'll still be far away from PP's prices, and still make a metal frame around the wood, that could be perfect"

That's the way to go.

As for pliers, go to your local pawn shop. Meth head construction workers pawn their bags of tools all the time and lose it to the house. You'll find much of what you need there.

Invest in a nice big table vice and a ball peen hammer. 90% of your metal work that is not being machined can be done with those two tools.

[zayance]

Well yes, but i was thinking of something more like this, but you'll still need a good wooden table of course:

cheap:
http://www.otelo.fr/fr/catalogue/mini-plieuses-lourdes/otmt-99060025-ref-60967.html

expensive:
http://www.otelo.fr/fr/catalogue/plieuse-atelier/otmt-99060055-ref-59430.html

Or the all in one type, but this one is limited to 0.75mm, for the 1mm max it something like 400euros and so on
http://www.otelo.fr/fr/catalogue/combine-cisaille-plieuse-rouleuse/otmt-99060040-ref-59396.html

Still a good investment i think if you have some space...

[jsteiger]

I have done a little redesign to shrink the input channel modules. Feature wise, nothing has changed. The PCB's for the new layout will be 5" deep and 4.5" tall. I made some better use of the available space and have nearly no unused areas on the DOA side PCB. The main goal was to get them as small as possible to keep the cost as low as possible.

Following I have pricing for the input channel PCB's and the motherboards.
Input channels require 2 PCB's. Cost for a single channel set would be $31.96, in matte black.
Input channel motherboard is 5" X 11.98" X .125" thick, 2oz copper with white, peelable solder mask. Again, this motherboard would be for 8 channels. Cost would be $40.79. The bottom solder mask will be peelable as we may/will need easy access to the ground plane for many things.

That puts the PCB only cost for a single 8 channel bucket at $296.47.

I should have metal costs for the input channel sections by the end of next week. I have them engineered pretty cool so that the first bucket will require a top, a bottom, a left side and a right side. The 2nd added bucket would require only one side as the tops and bottoms from both buckets will be secured to a common side (from the 1st bucket). The top and bottom will be interchangeable and the same part. The left and right sides will also be the same part and interchangeable. This will help keep metal production costs reasonable.

Things add up very fast with a project like this.  

Regards, Jeff

[[silent:arts]]

Jeff,
don't get too cheap with leaving out the solder mask

think of untrained people messing up the motherboard,
2 x 36 pins for the card edges, power and other buss connections,
and a short in between

it won't be a cheap project, but the few $ more for a solder mask would be a good investment.

[zayance]

I totally agree with the solder mask, i've done soldering like this a couple of times, and it can really be a mess if you don't do it well, went ok, but you want to have a project like this as clean as possible no?

[jsteiger]

OK. Easy enough. I have have modified the PCB costs to reflect solder mask on the motherboard.

See 2 posts above for that.

Best, Jeff

[clister01]

This looks amazing.  If it can compete with the Mark VIII in terms of price (which is harder said than done) and be as full featured, I for one would be extremely interested.

-Cameron

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