SSLtech

Re: Why didn't anyone tell me wiring patchbays is such a pain in the...
« Reply #20 on: March 24, 2010, 02:08:55 PM »


Yep.. that's ONE of the two patch-racks in that particular installation.  ;D

and yes, it's a console patch bay. -The client had ordered an Amek 9098i and didn't like the factory patch layout, so had me build a custom one. -Since it was being done from scratch, he then requested NO multipin connections to all the outboard connections, so I wired the FULL length of all the multitrack looms, all the outboard looms, all the mic/line runs etc. and coiled them up.

The patchbays were then mounted into two tall Winsted racks, with all the attached cable lengths coiled and tie-wrapped into the bottom of the assembled racks. The Winsted racks were also reinforced with 2" 90° angle-alloy strips mounted front-to-back, at the exact height to support each Amek Power supply. (Ten x 50kg each; one half-ton of power supplies in total!)

On delivery to California, the patchbays were removed and installed in the control room, and the Amek Power supplies were installed and the console was connected, powered up and shaken out.

For a fee, I'll wire ANYBODY's patchbay!

Keef
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind"
Quote from: PRR
Ah, but that was 1999; we don't party like that any more.


Gold

Re: Why didn't anyone tell me wiring patchbays is such a pain in the...
« Reply #21 on: March 24, 2010, 05:42:17 PM »

For a fee, I'll wire ANYBODY's patchbay!


And a big one at that, I'm sure. I used to do a lot of patch bay wiring. After college the Mackie Adat craze was in full force. I think I wired between five and ten of those setups for four or five years in a row. I love it. I find the repetirive nature very relaxing. I should take up knitting.

Walrus

Re: Why didn't anyone tell me wiring patchbays is such a pain in the...
« Reply #22 on: March 24, 2010, 06:58:58 PM »
I've always found the monotony of patchbays quite relaxing... Like the man said find a decent radio station or a calming cd.

We've always had mic lines on bantam bays and have never blown anything from accidental shorting of phantom power.

For mic lines buy the best quality you can, Moses and Mitchel would be my choice. Check VDC Tradings ebay store for good deals on new ones or i've used second hand M&M in a few budget studios. After a clean they have been like new anyway, sometimes they'll come with multi-core still attached and soldered for you!

I've never had any problems with mics on TT patch bays either. Juts make sure the monitor pot is turned down when plugging!

+1 on VDC, great company. (Although the last M & M patch I bought I got direct from M & M, cheaper too ;D)
Kevin.

Kingston

Re: Why didn't anyone tell me wiring patchbays is such a pain in the...
« Reply #23 on: March 24, 2010, 08:53:14 PM »
My back is hurting. I should have listened to pucho and tuned the chair lower a notch. Arched back: hurt.

Funny thing,

puchos another suggestion (and Mr. clunks) of turning on the radio saved my ass. I don't know why I had not thought of such a simple thing before. Last half of the chore was easy and I didn't make a notice of the hours flying by.

Yes, it indeed is relaxing. One can get completely lost in it. Zen wiring.

Should have ranted before starting this ordeal. Once again suggestions from this forum turn gold.
« Last Edit: March 24, 2010, 08:59:10 PM by Kingston »

KrIVIUM2323

Re: Why didn't anyone tell me wiring patchbays is such a pain in the...
« Reply #24 on: March 24, 2010, 10:02:48 PM »
Quote
Yep.. that's ONE of the two patch-racks in that particular installation. 


Two racks... TOTAL RESPECT KEEF! :o

9098I... Ok never seen one, don't know if there is one in France anyway. I asked myself which console it was because it didn't look like Neve or SSL patchbay.

Just for satisfy my curiosity how long did this work takes? Weeks probably...

SSLtech

Re: Why didn't anyone tell me wiring patchbays is such a pain in the...
« Reply #25 on: March 25, 2010, 08:17:00 AM »
...I think that job was turned around in five weeks. -That included cutting & prepping the cable (multipair & single-shielded pairs), wiring & dressing the patchbay end, and also prepping & pre-pinning and either bagging pins or attaching connectors to the 'far' ends... everything except the mic panels, which were soldered-up on delivery.

I'll confess that I wasn't on my own... I had one assistant; 'Carlito'. He (also known as "the fine Colombian") is the best assistant that I've ever had. He did most of the far end connectorization, and at least 50% of the cable prep, while I did the rest of the cable prep and the patchbay soldering. -I think that he also may have done some of the pre-normalling prep.

Then between us we handled the mechanical stuff, which was easy because we have three 9098i's here and one spare power supply, so we were able to check the position/height of the PSU support rails before lashing all the cables to them for transport.

I dunno if I have a pic of the control room here at work... I'd have to look at home, but I have a pic or two of some of the recording areas and the guitar room... the guitar and amp selection in that facility is enough to make most people faint...!



...suffice to say... -it's a REALLY nice facility! ;)

Oh, and I too love the 'therapeutic' aspect of just zoning-out and doing super-neat "zen-knitting" on a patchbay wiring job!

Keef
« Last Edit: March 25, 2010, 08:18:35 AM by SSLtech »
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind"
Quote from: PRR
Ah, but that was 1999; we don't party like that any more.

Ptownkid

Re: Why didn't anyone tell me wiring patchbays is such a pain in the...
« Reply #26 on: March 25, 2010, 08:39:34 AM »
I think i just came a little.....

SSLtech

Re: Why didn't anyone tell me wiring patchbays is such a pain in the...
« Reply #27 on: March 25, 2010, 05:26:12 PM »
...Actually, I'm just starting wiring a single strip right now... -gonna take a few pictures about how to make it neat. -It's not difficult, it's just all in the preparation.

Keith
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind"
Quote from: PRR
Ah, but that was 1999; we don't party like that any more.

andre tchmil

Re: Why didn't anyone tell me wiring patchbays is such a pain in the...
« Reply #28 on: March 25, 2010, 07:01:15 PM »
That's why you need Ghielmetti patches.
I have some spare ones to let go.
Piece of cake to wire, as you can take them apart in groups of 8.
Patchcords are a bit expensive, so are tires for a BMW.

ColinS

Re: Why didn't anyone tell me wiring patchbays is such a pain in the...
« Reply #29 on: March 25, 2010, 07:12:55 PM »
That's why you need Ghielmetti patches.

Totally agree with that, however even the cheapest Ghielmetti patch panels are twice the price of your average B-gauge panel for the same number of holes (with the possible exception of M&M). Therefore well beyond the reach of most hobbyist studio owners.

Normalling is a bit easier to get your head round with Ghielmettis than with jacks, because you can always see what's going on based on if there's a plug in or not. No hidden magic

We have loads of them at work, nice to use, nice to work with and even nicer to install...the wireman loves them.

The density is about the same as bantams/TT plugs too.

C

PS I don't work for Ghielmetti....I promise!
Blue LEDs make the world go round


strangeandbouncy

Re: Why didn't anyone tell me wiring patchbays is such a pain in the...
« Reply #30 on: March 25, 2010, 07:17:17 PM »
Hi Kieth,


   that gtr room . . . .Sheesh! I hope you have mic room to do 'em justice! What is the facility, anyway? Me most curious now . . .


    Kindest regards from over 'ere to over there,



      ANdyP
. . . . RUH ROH . . . . .

Re: Why didn't anyone tell me wiring patchbays is such a pain in the...
« Reply #31 on: March 25, 2010, 07:38:26 PM »
 ;D i just did some stuff with the bitre crimps and plugs,much easier and easy to change....
nice work .....

pucho812

Re: Why didn't anyone tell me wiring patchbays is such a pain in the...
« Reply #32 on: March 25, 2010, 07:50:46 PM »
I find it easier to wire a patchbay into an elco and go from there.  Here is one we did at work a few years back. since then it got pulled from the room as a different console went in there. the current console has an onboard patchbay instead of an external patchbay. so until we need it again it sits in the tech shop.  You know neat wiring is easy and saves time in the long run just have to think about it.

« Last Edit: March 25, 2010, 07:52:51 PM by pucho812 »
You tell me whar a man gits his corn pone, en I'll tell you what his 'pinions is.

sodderboy

Re: Why didn't anyone tell me wiring patchbays is such a pain in the...
« Reply #33 on: March 25, 2010, 08:29:05 PM »
It's too late now and the soufflé is eaten, but the best way to deal with braided shields at a patchbay is Neve style- unbraid, clip with forcepts at the breakout, tin, cut to 5mm, solder a green wire, un-clip forcept, bend back, loop forward, clip to wire length, shrink over breakout.  You finish with three nice tinnable wires and a little loop behind the shrink.
I use the "everything at once" method- cut all shrink, all teflon, strip all jackets, etc.  When you get to actually soldering to the bays it is like a gift!  That goes for any mass production, which seems to be mostly dsubs these days.
iTunes is perfect for wiring music because I can shuffle 10 hours of holdies or Tangerine Dream and go robot.

As for phantom on bays, the Neve guys were against it because P48 was not switchable on most 80 series. That was the 70's and certainly no one around here should omit phantom switching on their DIY, so NO problem putting mic lines fully normalled to mic pre's on a TTY bay.  That topic was always worse than politics. . .
Mike

Kingston

Re: Why didn't anyone tell me wiring patchbays is such a pain in the...
« Reply #34 on: March 25, 2010, 09:06:26 PM »
The star quad cable I used has another problem with patchbay use it turns out. It's not awfully flexible, and nearly double the diameter of the more standard stuff. I can't do the very clean looking "break out bar bend" coil seen in many pictures here. There's simply not enough room in the tight 1U spot I installed it in. Oh well, I can at least coil them out in bundles of four or eight.

Oh hey, might as well ask now that I bumped into it,

What do you guys use to cleanly number/label all the cables?

SSLtech

Re: Why didn't anyone tell me wiring patchbays is such a pain in the...
« Reply #35 on: March 25, 2010, 09:25:43 PM »
Pucho... -For SHAME!

the prep work on that patchstrip would give Carlito a fit...

Here's how you wire Mogami to a switchcraft bay as shown in the picture: (This is a work in progress, so you'll have to wait a day or two for the thing to be finished)

First, you take some paper console tape and lay it down on your patchbay, and mark the center position of each socket.

Like so:


-Here's a close-up:


-Then you number the points...
like so:




..Then you take your piece of marked tape, and use it as a cutting guide, to pre-cut your unsheathed and 'combed' pairs to length...

-Like so:


then you prep the pairs individually... I'll be doing that tomorrow.

Keith
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind"
Quote from: PRR
Ah, but that was 1999; we don't party like that any more.

Gold

Re: Why didn't anyone tell me wiring patchbays is such a pain in the...
« Reply #36 on: March 25, 2010, 09:33:56 PM »
What do you guys use to cleanly number/label all the cables?

There are many ways to do it. I've been through most of them. Save yourself some aggravation (sometimes only discovered years later when all your marks have faded) and get yourself something like this. http://www.bradyid.com.sg/web/SiteBuilder/ISST-SISBv1r0.nsf/FLV/ID+PAL+Printer+Labels  They are about $100USD. If you plan on labeling cable with any regularity and you want someone other than yourself to be able to understand the labels it's well worth the money.

The paper template is exactly how I do it. To cut cables to length for jacks on the rear of a console I take a strip of paper and poke holes at the connector. Then make a template with ink.

SSLtech

Re: Why didn't anyone tell me wiring patchbays is such a pain in the...
« Reply #37 on: March 25, 2010, 09:34:50 PM »

   that gtr room . . . .Sheesh! I hope you have mic room to do 'em justice! What is the facility, anyway? Me most curious now . . .


Hey Andy... -Ow ya doin?

Can't tell you who, but it's a rather successful musician's home facility on the secluded North California coast...

Yes, he has more incredible mics than I can possibly list... here's a couple of Neumann heads being tested in one of the smaller iso rooms:


...and the machine room (with SEVERAL Studers removed!!!)


-The fireplace in the main recording area:


About seven pianos... every imaginable type, and you should see the view of the ocean...

...yeah... REALLY nice!!!

Keith
« Last Edit: March 26, 2010, 10:59:47 AM by SSLtech »
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind"
Quote from: PRR
Ah, but that was 1999; we don't party like that any more.

sodderboy

Re: Why didn't anyone tell me wiring patchbays is such a pain in the...
« Reply #38 on: March 25, 2010, 09:35:13 PM »
I use the Panduit lables that are like a 3" piece of tape.  1" is white and the rest is clear.  I print or write on the white and it wraps around and gets covered with the clear.  There are a few different sizes.
Mike
PS: it is not a stone law that sez that all wires have to leave at one or both ends, it's just neater.  You can be almost as neat going directly out in groups of 8 or however they group together.  Just make sure they have a little bit if flex before you tie them to the looming bar.

SSLtech

Re: Why didn't anyone tell me wiring patchbays is such a pain in the...
« Reply #39 on: March 25, 2010, 09:39:48 PM »

There are many ways to do it. I've been through most of them. Save yourself some aggravation (sometimes only discovered years later when all your marks have faded) and get yourself something like this. http://www.bradyid.com.sg/web/SiteBuilder/ISST-SISBv1r0.nsf/FLV/ID+PAL+Printer+Labels  They are about $100USD. If you plan on labeling cable with any regularity and you want someone other than yourself to be able to understand the labels it's well worth the money.


Panduit self-laminating labels are my preference Paul... but there are a few options.

Either way, you're bang-on... faded labeling is a nuisance. -The Panduit laser-printed labels are fantastic though.
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind"
Quote from: PRR
Ah, but that was 1999; we don't party like that any more.


 

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