DAW advice from Logic and PT users

So our old Mix+ system has limited days ahead as the computer has died and its about time to upgrade.  My partner and I have discussed two options that we think are good and Im hoping that anyone with the same experience could chime in.  The choices.  An HD rig or a Logic/apogee rig.  Im not the biggest plugin user, typically HPFs and a compressor here and there.  I've heard that engineers have a learning curve ahead of them when switching to logic.  In PTs the biggest edits I would do is chopping drums to the grid but it was pretty rare.  I do enjoy the triple tool as well and find the playlist system to be valuable. 

I figure that Logic can accomplish these types of edits and would hope the apogee converters sound better than the HDs. 

Any thoughts are appreciated!

I am a Logic user from day one (Creator on C64), but currently flirting with Nuendo (which would give me an easy opportunity to switch to PCs later). As long as you're not doing in depth audio editing, Logic is fine for music recording/production.

FOr what it's worth,



  I use logic every day. I also use 'Tools occasionally. I edit drum tracks in Logic. I don't use beat detective



    hey, but that's just me!


  ANdyP

I just bought an HD Accel system with two Lynx Aurora converters with the LT-HD cards. I couldn't be more happy with the sound and stability. I don't have much experience with the 192 i/o, but I think the Aurora must be better conversion. On a par with the Apogees, I would think. I'm quite happy with my new system. Its been rock solid, and a few larger sessions under the belt now. Stability was one of the most important factors for me.

Don't mean to provide a cop-out answer: but just go with whichever one you are most comfortable with. At the end of the day Logic and ProTools are just tools you work with. Similar results can be achieved on both. The programs themselves have mostly the same basic functions and buttons; they just use different names, colours and layouts for them.

Some do have functions others don't and no one DAW seems to have all of the really cool functions you want. So if you can test them out a good bit and go with what fits.

I know a lot of other professionals with the same viewpoint as mine. Personally I prefer ProTools but it's only as I'm so used to working with it. I would have no problem switching to Logic if I deemed it necessary.
Mostly I find myself using a lot of different DAWs these days but it's more down to the projects I'm working on.

Remember you don't need to use the digidesign(Avid now) converters with the HD rig.

Anyway not sure if that helped much. Best of luck.

Rob

I am currently running Logic 9 with an Apogee Ensemble. I have been using Logic for about 5 years now, and I have yet to run into a situation where Logic couldn't do what I needed. DAW's are becoming very similar. PT has Elastic Audio, Logic has flex time, both have a "tab to transient" feature. Logic offers very deep MIDI capabilities while PT's editing features are really great. I especially like the Audiosuite processing. Logics work around would be to export a track to Soundtrack pro, but thats a pain. I recently got the chance to give PT a try, and even though I've never touched it, I was able to make it work for me. I think if you learn one DAW, you can learn another much faster. PT's work flow didn't really work for me, and since I am mainly ITB, Logics track freeze function is invaluable. I also find routing outboard to be easier in Logic. My Apogee Ensemble is an incredible little device as well. I love the sound of it! Good luck!

why not do booth. Run logic with the PT HD I/O it works well. I have done that. I am in the learning logic learning curve. Gotta get those quick keys down to look like a bad ass. Plus you can run logic on just about any system with out any hardware using the mac speakers which is cool. You can have it on a lap top to learn it and run it anywhere without any real extra hardware other then an audio hard drive.


As far as converters go, the 192 is shit IMO.  The design is dumb. The small fan on the side does little for heat dissipation. This will often cause one of the A/D or D/A cards to have issues such as 1 channel not working, Random noize coming out of channels, etc, etc. The switch mode supply location causes swich noise to get  into the audio path. Non symmetrical I/O All in all the 192 is a fail..

You best bet IMO is either go with the lynx aurora's which run really hot(temp wise) or an SSL alpha/delta link combo.

oh yeah and if your mixing in the box Logic IMO has a better mixer. The mixes keep their stereo image.

Why don't consider Reaper?
I've switched to Reaper 6 months ago and there's no reason use Logic anymore yo me
http://www.reaper.fm/

Hammond said:

Why don't consider Reaper?
I've switched to Reaper 6 months ago and there's no reason use Logic anymore yo me
http://www.reaper.fm/

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+1

I suggest you give Reaper a shot. I think it's great.
I've never tried Logic though.

I also just switched to Reaper and it has been absolutely awesome. I really can't say enough good things about it. It is easily the best DAW I have used.
Best, Ben

RAM said:

Don't mean to provide a cop-out answer: but just go with whichever one you are most comfortable with. At the end of the day Logic and ProTools are just tools you work with. Similar results can be achieved on both. The programs themselves have mostly the same basic functions and buttons; they just use different names, colours and layouts for them.

Some do have functions others don't and no one DAW seems to have all of the really cool functions you want. So if you can test them out a good bit and go with what fits.

I know a lot of other professionals with the same viewpoint as mine. Personally I prefer ProTools but it's only as I'm so used to working with it. I would have no problem switching to Logic if I deemed it necessary.
Mostly I find myself using a lot of different DAWs these days but it's more down to the projects I'm working on.

Remember you don't need to use the digidesign(Avid now) converters with the HD rig.

Anyway not sure if that helped much. Best of luck.

Rob

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+1

But definitely PT if you are going to do some hardcore editing (as i do). Never had the patience to learn I-logic.  ;D ;D ;D

AND : Quickeys. Get it, learn it and develop hudreds of shortcuts and you´ll be the quickest razor blade in town (i am. Have over 100 dedicated shortcuts for anything you can imagine editing-wise. Programming language skills is a plus here). People is always amazed and ask "HOW ????", specially when i run one of my monster "auto vocalign all six tracks below main vox track" sort of quickey.

I was a Nuendo guy before PT (about 8 years ago) and it was great, but now, i cannot imagine working at the same speed and running all my outboard with anything besides PT. That´s what work for me.

Best regards.

Worked for over a year on Logic 8 and found it very easy to use.  The automation worked great and was very handy - spoiled me.

No complaints about the audio quality.  When mixing I routinely kept tracks at -18 to -24 and ran the master bus at -4 to -6 with no apparent loss or degradation.  90% of the time I was tracking at 16-bit/44.1.

They're both fine really.

I use both. I love logic for composing. I can't stand doing anything with audio in it. Personally, I think the mixer sounds terrible. Every ITB mix I do in Logic comes out sounding flat, disjointed and centerless. I know other people who make it work.

I use PT HD for all of my audio needs with the much maligned 192 interface. I feel there is a reason it became an industry standard.

Whichever way you go, you will be blown away by how much better it sounds than TDM.

[quote author=Silvas]

I was a Nuendo guy before PT (about 8 years ago) and it was great, but now, i cannot imagine working at the same speed and running all my outboard with anything besides PT. That´s what work for me.

Best regards.

[/quote]

I forgot to mention, sonic-wise, with PT you may consider summing outside. I have my passive summing box, with makeup gain courtesy of either Hardy M-1 preamps or Scully 280 preamps...but lately, all my inputs and outputs have been busy with all the compressors  so no OTB summing until i get more i/o (i prefer compressing outside than summing outside if i cannot have both). The Aurora16 has been a huge inprovement over the 96 i was using, and a moderate inprovement over the 192. YMMV of course.  Many folks says logic mixer is nice, tho.  The studio recently got a SPL MTC for the monitor controller (wanted an igor monitor controller kit but no time nor money !), and that was another vast improvement over what i was using, made me realize again that you have to adjust a bit your technique for ITB or OTB mixing....in my case i feel  mixing OTB leave you more room and space to put things in the stereo field, and mixing ITB you need to shape the sounds a bit more and carve space,  to get the same results...just my 2 cents.

I did the switch from Protools Mix to Logic / Metric Halo 2882 and now orpheus. Even the old MIO2882 is way better than the old mix converters, the orpheus is fantastic. Learning logic was a pain in the ass. But now I'm as fast in Logic as with PT. The comping feature is very fast. I'd get myself a native system plus a Metric Hallo ULN8 . Metric Halo's drivers is super stable, much better than prism sound


nicholas

Annnnnd what about Cubase?

mushy said:

I use PT HD for all of my audio needs with the much maligned 192 interface. I feel there is a reason it became an industry standard.

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well that is due to the fact that for many years all you could get for pro tools hd was a 192. Many years passed before other companies were allowed to make interfaces for it.

my two cents:

don´t go for Pro Tools HD. Its an old system, which is much too expensive. Every decent native system today has more power in terms of the maximum number of audio tracks and plug ins. Avid  knows that the DSPs on the HD-Cards are outdated but they have no chance to introduce a more modern hardware because they have to keep the old systems compatible. This is a dead end.

There´s no chance to run Pro Tools 8 together with Logic since the TDM-support for Logic was discontinued.
I would go for a native system - you have the freedom of choice from so many converters and software for less money.
Personally I like Logic and since I have been working with PT before, I must say there isn´t so much difference between the two, apart from more clever editing tools in PT and the MIDI-Stuff (which is still far easier in Logic). Cubase / Nuendo is a complete different world to PT.

pucho812 said:

well that is due to the fact that for many years all you could get for pro tools hd was a 192. Many years passed before other companies were allowed to make interfaces for it.

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Yeah, but still.  I'm with the Ethan Winer school of thought on this.  Once you get to a certain level of quality, you'd be hard pressed to be able to tell the difference between boxes in that range.

Also... People have made great records on way less....  At some point you have to just quit worrying about this chip vs that chip and just put your money where your mouth is.  In the end, it's about the music. 

true but where the technical problems of the 192 IMO outway the sonic. I have had many 192's take a shit over the years from heat issues Yes a lot of the converters at that level sound good, but a 192 VS say a lynx aurora 16 is night and day plus the symmetrical I/O is just easier.

Yes in the end it is about music so why not get rid of the daw for something that will let the music shine analog tape.