DIY gear to get a 60ish colour/distortion?

I love the sonics of Dylan's "Bringing It All Back Home" album. Very bright and distorted in a good way, but not strained (no aggressive resonances in the midrange). Signal seems to be quite asymmetrical, too, from looking at the waveform (certain signals like the male voice often are, but this also seems to be imprinted by processing here).

So is is there a piece of (DIY) gear that would give me a similar sound, for coloration purposes? Tube, presumably, for the distortion, or a compressor that treats both halves of the wave somewhat different etc.?

Thanks!

Well, that record was done at Columbia Recording Studios in 1965 (i think), and i believe the studio had it's own custom consoles built at the time. The mics used would be a major factor in the sound. So i would probably start from there? Old mics, old pre's. It is what it is. Personally, i wouldn't worry it about it so much and shoot for something that sounds/feels good, rather than trying to recreate something that cannot be recreated...if you get my meaning...

Probably a redd type pre...with 47's...i dont know..

I'm interested in this topic as well. You might get some pointers from a thread I starter earlier.
http://www.groupdiy.com/index.php?topic=37765.0

desol said:

Well, that record was done at Columbia Recording Studios in 1965 (i think), and i believe the studio had it's own custom consoles built at the time. The mics used would be a major factor in the sound. So i would probably start from there? Old mics, old pre's. It is what it is. Personally, i wouldn't worry it about it so much and shoot for something that sounds/feels good, rather than trying to recreate something that cannot be recreated...if you get my meaning...

Probably a redd type pre...with 47's...i dont know..

Click to expand...

Thanks! I'm not looking to recreate it, just to have a device that gives a similar type of coloration. I've got nice mics, EQs, compressors, a great tape machine, but they're all much more hi-fi and don't give this emphasized grainy midrange texture. From what I've heard the obvious distortion devies like the culture vulture sound different, too. I'd prefer to have a box rather than mics, so I can send just about every kind of signal through. Would be nice. ;-)

eskimo said:

I'm interested in this topic as well. You might get some pointers from a thread I starter earlier.
http://www.groupdiy.com/index.php?topic=37765.0

Click to expand...

Did you ever build you device? What does it sound like? I'm looking for texture rather than obvious distortion (if that's any help).  The one obvious clue in regards to the Dylan album seems to be the asymmetry of the waveform. I've found out quite some time ago that I like sounds a lot that are highly asymmetrical, they have a certain "alive" sonic quality.

Nope, I moved and shit got shelfed. But I might pick it up. A tad itchy.

I'd maybe try driving some older (ie. class-a / BA283, etc.) Neve gear and see how you find that.

living sounds said:

desol said:

Well, that record was done at Columbia Recording Studios in 1965 (i think), and i believe the studio had it's own custom consoles built at the time. The mics used would be a major factor in the sound. So i would probably start from there? Old mics, old pre's. It is what it is. Personally, i wouldn't worry it about it so much and shoot for something that sounds/feels good, rather than trying to recreate something that cannot be recreated...if you get my meaning...

Probably a redd type pre...with 47's...i dont know..

Click to expand...

Thanks! I'm not looking to recreate it, just to have a device that gives a similar type of coloration. I've got nice mics, EQs, compressors, a great tape machine, but they're all much more hi-fi and don't give this emphasized grainy midrange texture. From what I've heard the obvious distortion devies like the culture vulture sound different, too. I'd prefer to have a box rather than mics, so I can send just about every kind of signal through. Would be nice. ;-)

Click to expand...

Good mics and a good tape machine should cover a large percentage of that overall sound in a very general way.  Every photo I've seen from those era sessions shows Dylan in front of various Neumanns for the vocals and guitar.  

The setup was all musicians in the same room playing at the same time. One cut at a time only - no overdubs. You can see plenty of baffles in the photos. Still probably got a lot of bleed.  The drum and bass sounds were not even close to modern production style - instruments were all kind of loosey goosey and the sound was complex and relatively lo-fi. Call it Hi-fi Lo fi

It's still hard to pinpoint exactly what you're looking for in terms of what you're hearing on that record.  I doubt any single device will  transform any overall band sound to a great degree.

All of Dylan's New York Columbia recordings from that era have that sound.  The room, the console, and high quality mics.  Never been able to find any detailed info on the custom console(s).  I've often wondered if any changed from tube to SS during that era which would span from 61-65'.  Would be very interesting to compare the preamp design to other known designs.

From the interprative description "grainy midrange texture" that you're hearing you might try out a 60's CBS Volumax or Audimax. Very distinct grainy mid oriented and up-front distortion sound.   Neve 1272 also would be a lot closer than say an Avalon.  Also might be worth trying an older tape formulation too.

I think rumor has it they had a lot of Langevin AM-16's at the west coast studios, but they may not have been there until the mid 60's.  Not a simple DIY, nor is the Altec 9470 which is similar. 

As some had mentioned , i'd think it's more
of the whole signal chain than any one device
now you could build a device with all those things in it

Thanks!

Trying an older tape formula was something completely off my radar.

I don't think bleed is what it's about either, the sound I like is also in the songs with only vocals and guitar.


I'll look into the suggested units.

eskimo said:

Nope, I moved and shit got shelfed. But I might pick it up. A tad itchy.

Click to expand...

That happened to my home-brewing!  I dreamed of owning a house where I could sanitize everything at a utility sink in the basement instead of in the bathroom of our small apartment.
I'm on the second house and have not brewed a batch since the apt!  Always some other "homeowner" that has to be done. . .
Mike