A question for Digidesign 002 and 003 users...

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SSLtech

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-Is it reasonable to record to a firewire drive which sits on the same buss as the Digi 002 (in my case it's a 002)

I have a LONG piece of music to record live this weekend (Mahler's 2nd Symphony -all 5 movements, no intermission) and I need twelve tracks to go into record and reliably STAY in record.

I'm very nervous about recording to the internal drive for this one (which is what I usually do, but for only about an hour or so at a time).

If so, -using a Mac- what is the best format for a new drive.

I plan on testing by recording about 4 hours of 12-16 tracks a few times, before I commit to this 'no-second-chance' approach...

Keith
 
I would "obtain" a second rig.  There is the file size limit to deal with, as well as the reliability factor.  In our remote truck, we have 12 MX2424s, all locked to time code and word clock, to record 72 tracks.  6 go into record at the beginning of the event (3 main, 3 backup) and then after a couple or three hours, we kick in the second 6 (with about a 5 minute overlap).  After the first 6 go out of record, we transfer all the data from the first drives to an external fire wire drive.  We have done a 14 hour non-stop 72 track session using this technique.
Good luck!
Best,
Bruno2000
 
Keith, as a long time Mac user I would not recommend to use the same firewire bus for the HD and the interface.
I've made good experiences using firewire for the interface and USB for the audio HD.
I did some 16-track club recordings with that set up without any trouble.
 
I've done lots of long remote recording with my 002.  The Digi manual suggests placing the drive between the 002 and the computer, i.e. firewire out, hard drive, 002.  I've done this and I've also connected the drive to the firewire 800 buss with no problems whatsoever.  Just make sure the drive is 7200rpm with a decent cache.
 
Oh yeah, format.  I've always gone with HFS+ Journaling enabled.  There seems to be some debate on that last point but most do it this way and IME, no problems.  It also helps to make sure your external enclosure is an Oxford 911 firewire chipset for the firewire 400 buss and Oxford 924 for firewire 800.  Really, this works a lot better than recording to your internal drive!
 
SSLtech said:
onlymeeee said:
I guess the question is... what happens to you if the recording fails?

Well, it starts with the thumbscrew and rack... and then it starts getting nasty!

Keith

Well in that case... I'm sure a few of these will do the job reliably enough
usb_sushi_lg.jpg
 
echotodd said:
Oh yeah, format.  I've always gone with HFS+ Journaling enabled.  There seems to be some debate on that last point but most do it this way and IME, no problems.  It also helps to make sure your external enclosure is an Oxford 911 firewire chipset for the firewire 400 buss and Oxford 924 for firewire 800.  Really, this works a lot better than recording to your internal drive!

Todd, I'm very intrigued by this... Since I'm a complete dunce when it comes to drives, is there anything I can find at a national chain (Best Buy for example) which is Oxford 911 (my computer has a single FW400 bus, so I'd have to connect it 'through' the 002, setup guide notes notwithstanding).

Keith
 
I think both the LaCie "porshe" and "rugged" are 911 chipsets IIRC.  I'll try to do a search.  I usually buy empty enclosures with the 911 chipsets and swap drives for projects.  There's got to be something at one of those places.
 
I got so burned by some of the LaCie Porsche drives (I have several dead ones at home) that I can't bring myself to use them..

However, this one...

405756_sk_lg.jpg


...is available from a national chain, It's possibly a modern chipset, butit's 7200RPM with a decent data transfer rate... I wonder if it's worth taking a chance and buying one to try...?

http://www.officedepot.com/a/products/405756/LaCie-d2-Quadra-Hard-Disk-hard/

Keith
 
http://seagate.custkb.com/seagate/crm/selfservice/search.jsp?DocId=203731&NewLang=en&Hilite=chipset
Seagate list the chipsets

Also, if you got the time/and a drive, something like http://eshop.macsales.com/item/Other%20World%20Computing/MEFW924AL1K/ has Oxford chipset.

Failing that, a Glyph etc..
 
Glyph is right out, unfortunately...

I read this thread and it looks like the D2 works for people:

http://duc.digidesign.com/showthread.php?t=251600

I think I might give it a try... Of course I'll run 'dry-run' tests SEVERAL times before I commit to actually using it in anger...

Keith
 
I didn't find any chipset info for the D2, but like you said, Keith, giver a dry run and see what happens!
 
Not much to add here, but FWIW I have two .5 gig hard drives wired between my imac (i5) and the Digi003. The 003 has ADAT from Audient 008 and SPIDIF from API A2D, to give 18 tracks @ 44.1 / 48 KHz.

I have no problems running up to 18 tracks @ 44.1 for 1 hour or much more. On drive is a LaCie, I don't recall the other manufacturer. I've had this set up for about two years, recording a few days every week.

Some things I know cause / avoid problems...

Make sure Spotlight is turned off for all the drives.
Turn off all the screen saver / power saving.
Avoid using plug-ins when recording.
Make sure you haven't selected a region to record!

Stew
 
Ive got a D2 here.  Never had a problem with it.  Not sure I ever did 12 track recording with it. Possibly though. Certainly edited multi streams of HD video in avid.  Stood up to the knock it over, use upside down tests I like to put a drive through.  Have no complaints. It's 'automatic' mode is a bit fruity at times... won't shutdown after computer's shut down, and as such won't come back on properly either. Just flickers it's lights at me. Quick turn off, and on again and all good.
For high street harddrives, I probably put my faith in Western Digital the most. Purely for the fact, I could pretty much play footie with a 'my book' and it would still keep recording.  
As ever though, for every opinion, someone has probably had completely the opposite experience.  
If it's truly critical of course, obviously a 2nd backup system's what called for. Can you hire a standalone recorder too?

Of course, after the dry runs we'll know better!

I think the major thing is make sure the macs in good condition... no gratuitous programs etc. etc.
 
Well, I'm having a hard time finding one locally... seems it's a "ships out of out door today" kind of thing.

Mahler's piece runs over 1½ hours, with only one short choral piece beforehand... so there's no intermission anywhere.

I'm definitely not comfortable right now... ;)
 
Do you have a computer specific shop in the neighborhood?  You can always try to pick up a kensington enclosure and pop a drive in it.  Usually they have Oxford chipsets.
 
SSLtech said:
Well, I'm having a hard time finding one locally... seems it's a "ships out of out door today" kind of thing.

Mahler's piece runs over 1½ hours, with only one short choral piece beforehand... so there's no intermission anywhere.

I'm definitely not comfortable right now... ;)

Do you want a Rocstor drive?  We have used over 50 of them and only had 1 failure.  They have 2 fire wire 800 ports, and I can overnight one (500 gig) to you tomorrow.
Best,
Bruno2000
 
I've had various problems recording to the same firewire buss... although the HD's were invariably cheap, off the shelf ones.

In this thread there's a couple good tips to keep things kosher (although I'm sure you're already got your system defraged etc)
http://duc.digidesign.com/archive/index.php/t-114775.html

Like Stew said, cutting out all the background system clutter really helps with stability... I've got a long list of stuff that I shut down/modify when I do a re-install... let me know if you want that info (I'm running xp)

cheers,
dave
 
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