de essing

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kepeb

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 4, 2010
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581
Location
Norwich, UK
hi,
those of you that still feed a separate eq'd mult to a comp to de ess...
what frequencies/ how steep do you like this signal?
 
I used to do this with the Sony Oxford dynamics and it was my best ITB de-esser, since beaten by outboard.  Frequency was wherever the ess action was happening, low Q (broad).

 
Last time I did this in a commercial product, I set it at 75uS, resulting in a first-order (6dB/octave) shelf starting at 2kHz.
Why 75uS? Because I could call it a "broadcast limiter".
 
Generally between 6 & 8k. The lower the freq, the more extreme the effect will sound.

For ITB de-essing, I HIGHLY recommend the Massey De-Esser. It is the single best one I've ever used either ITB or not.
 
cheers,
I'll take a look. I get a bit lost in the world of plugins but i will make a note.

interesting. got sidetracked there... :)
i did some related searches and read some great stuff on FM pre emphasis.

what does 'uS' stand for?
 
mushy said:
For ITB de-essing, I HIGHLY recommend the Massey De-Esser. It is the single best one I've ever used either ITB or not.

I second that. The Massey De-esser has saved many vocal tracks for me. Typically dialed into around 7-8k. Coincidentally (?) right where every beginner's book on recording tells you to boost to add "presence" to a vocal.
 
no one here bothers to just use automation to control sibilance?  simple 1-4db dips in the track right on the "ssss" in the wave form for however long the performer sang it.    That's what I learned to do.  Takes like an hour or so, but it sounds better than most plugins in the end.
 
mulletchuck said:
no one here bothers to just use automation to control sibilance?  simple 1-4db dips in the track right on the "ssss" in the wave form for however long the performer sang it.    That's what I learned to do.  Takes like an hour or so, but it sounds better than most plugins in the end.

Sometimes that can be the best way but sometimes I'm using my de-esser as a HF limiter for general tonal shaping and not just zapping S sounds.  This is especially the case in mastering but even on a vocal sometimes I'm just mitigating hardness on certain phrases, not just deleting S sounds.

 
I have only used hardware de essers a few times and they normally stomp in the box stuff.  I wish we had a good DIY de esser project.
 
I am not sure we need a dedicated product.

Patch a parametric EQ into a decent comp/limiter side chain and you are ready to rock and roll... not only can you dial in perfectly for the offending source but you can de-pop, de-thump if needed.

Then those two useful building blocks can do other stuff when needed.

BTW of you have automation and time... why not.

JR
 
I'm not sure all the dedicated de-essers work as a EQ - compressor combo.
I don't think the dbx 904 de-esser works that way.
It splits the audio signal at a turnover frequency and looks at the energy in the high pass portion. If that exceeds a threshold, the signal is attenuated. Either the high pass portion is attenuated or the entire portion.
You could probably still do this will EQ / compressors but it would be pretty complicated.
 
dbx engineers actually wrote a white paper on de-essing that was an AES show preprint several decades ago. Indeed there are different strategies for frequency selective dynamic processing.  While you don't want one section of the frequency spectrum to cross modulate another, one ASSumption often made about de-essing is that when it is used, the HF signal is the dominant signal at that time, so there is no or little benefit from band splitting.

An Additional benefit of keeping the gain element wide band is that you can layer multiple dynamic effects on top of each other by summing the sundry control voltages into a common VCA. Over the decades I have done a few commercial designs with de-essers combined with comp/limiter/noise gate. etc.

A multi-band dynamics processor is another animal entirely useful for more than de-essing which is a pretty narrow specific application. 

Of course opinions vary...

JR
 
I worked with a pro who used a de-esser in mixing a lot. Just a bit to take the harsh edges off. It was really eye opening how it could be applied.
In particular, I remember he put a de-esser on accordion that showed a big improvement. Operating on particular freqs I think (this was Waves ITB de-esser).
Anyway, until that point I thought it was a one trick pony for sibilant vocals.
Although I have the hardware to try it, I can't imagine building up a multiband compression setup with EQs on the sidechain. What a mess

 
Gold said:
dandeurloo said:
I wish we had a good DIY de esser project.

You mean like the this? http://www.groupdiy.com/index.php?topic=26692

I don't think this thing ever left prototyping phase. I remember seeing schematics that were at the time untested. Then the project just disappeared.
 
I have been needing some good de essers.  Is there any reason to DIY something.  Meaning can there be any improvements to what is already out there? Other wise no need to re invent the wheel. 

 
In the analog days I used the Valley People Dyno-mites (the tan half rack stereo units)
For de-essing, Ducking F.M.limiting, 18 other finctions.
In the digital world I'll just lower or redraw the offending ES's until they sound natural. Same with breaths.
It doesn't effect the whole track.
 

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