vtl5c1 Subs

GroupDIY Audio Forum

Help Support GroupDIY Audio Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

pucho812

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 4, 2004
Messages
14,832
Location
third stone from the sun
Have you seen the price on these things lately. vtl5c1 Going  upwards of 20.00(usd) in some places. Can anyone recommend  A sub?  So far I found a silonex nls-32 but until I try it,  and give the old listen, can't confirm. So best to ask and  get a second opinion from the genius bar.
 
I recently bought chinese clone 5C1´s from diytubes, that didn´t perform too badly- fast on, fast off- might be a better match than silonex nls32  anyway (and cheap, ca.3 EU).
 
I've looked real hard, because I have multiple guitar pedal projects that use them. Nothing is as consistent, fast, and wide dynamic range as the PE ones. NSL 32 is too low on resistance at the same current, higher Fv from the LED, and too low off resistance, plus it's noticably slower in a tremolo.

Smallbear has a Macro 'workalike' that has high dark resistance if that's critical, but it is all over the place in terms of speed and Fv for the LED.

I'd go on but I'm making myself sad.
 
The Chinese M1210CLC / VTL5C1 is generally usable for substituting in a pinch. Search e.g. AliExpress, pricing around ½-1usd/pcs incl. shipping.

Not that I can use them at all any more - optical compression as such has been banned by the EU (!!)

Yes, I already wrote them a passive-agressive letter questioning the sanity of this, waiting for reply.

Jakob E.
 
gyraf said:
Not that I can use them at all any more - optical compression as such has been banned by the EU (!!)

Wwwwwhhhhhhhhhhaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaattttttt???

Could you paste some link to this another EU absurd???

:D :D :D
 
There are photocells that don't use CdS and CdSe, but they don't work well for audio as a drop-in thing. The H11F1 won't do it without careful negative feedback, for instance (that's a guitar pedal, but it gives an idea), but it's incredibly fast, cheap, and compact, so maaaaaybe it's worth figuring out a way to make those work.

If you're going to use the Macron ones:

Generally, under the same basic test conditions, like just a resistor in series with the LED side, if I see about 30K on a VTL5C1's LDR, I'll see under 5K, sometimes under 2K, on the Macrons, but they aren't really that consistent. On the one hand, this means that it's "easier" to drive them to a really low resistance. On the other hand, this means that they're more likely to hang out around that lower resistance if you're just plopping it into an existing design, and you don't get to take advantage of the high dark resistance. So you need to decide (a) is this a problem for the project I want to drop it into and (b) can I do anything about it if it is? If you can fix the problem, then it's a cheap and easy solution to P-E's decision to stop manufacturing the things. The projects where I've had the most serious problems (the Mutron III in particular gets completely #@$!ed up, and the higher Fv is a problem with LFOs because it can make the wave lopsided) couldn't be fixed with just a few component changes and probably needed a major redesign. Not something I was really interested in dealing with to save a few bucks.
 
L´Andratté said:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Photoresistor

The use of CdS and CdSe[3] photoresistors is severely restricted in Europe due to the RoHS ban on cadmium.

I think this mainly applies to the business products(like Gyraf).

Yes i know it's related with industry, anyway still another absurd...

Now we need to wait when they ban tubes!!!

And please remember guys, what's most important, snail is a fish!!!!!
 
ln76d said:
Wwwwwhhhhhhhhhhaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaattttttt???

Exemption 40 of the RoHS Directive “Cadmium in photoresistors for analogue optocouplers applied in professional audio equipment” expired on 31 December 2013, so it can be no longer be used and there is no replacement exemption. There are no drop-in replacements available.

H11F1 series unfortunately can't be used for classic optical compression, as it's a FET: Very different native timing and working levels. Only real thing in common is the optical isolation and resistance response up to 30mVAC.

The "Macron" cell ROHS-certification was based on falsified laboratory reports. The whole story (and more) here: http://ec.europa.eu/environment/waste/weee/pdf/rohs.pdf#page=29&zoom=auto,116.25,504.5

Real amount of cadmium is not high at all, the problem lies in the definition "100ppm in mechanically separable materials" - and as Cd is a thin layer by-itself, you can scrape it off with a steady hand and a sharp tool to get >100ppm Cd.

Absolute amount of Cd is in the range of ca. 100ug per cell. Vanishing amount, was it not for the "mechanically separable" clause.

Indium antimonide (InSb) and GeCu photoconductors are said to be technically possible, but are completely absent from the market - they're probably not so good ideas anyway..

The last non-cadmium option would be Lead Selenide (PbSe) - but this is as dead as Cd according to ROHS.


Jakob E.
 
..the sad thing is that component manufacturers discontinue the parts because industry can't no longer use it. Which is catastrophic to diy as well..

Jakob E.
 
at this time the solution was to buy bulk so we picked up some 2000 vtl5c1's. The good news is that we got them fairly cheap, not nearly the 20.00(USD) price tag some spots have them for. This will  hold us over for now until we figure out a permanent solution.
 
Here's a possibility to buy... still expensive but not 20USD :)

http://se.farnell.com/excelitas-tech/vtl5c1/optocoupler-single-channel/dp/1652517

regards

/John
 
so at work we tried a sub just to see what will happen

two possible ones were nls32-sr2 and nls32-sr3

Without any circuit rework the nls32-sr2 did not work at all, the sr-3 worked but behavior was way off.

So if we did switch over would require some circuit rework.
 
Today I talked with a german PA poweramplifier manufacturer about this topic. I knew that he´s using optos for the limiters in his amps. He started many years ago with a japanese product which run out of production because the company went belly-up. He then changed the circuit to VTL5C1s for a short period but was no satisfied with the result. The next incarnation which is in use upto now is using NSL32s. Of course the circuit matters and statements like these are large generalizations. But since I trust his ears and knowledge I´m pretty sure that NSL32s are a usable alternative if one can get along with it´s time constants.
 
Back
Top