what Neve Modules are these

I'm assuming this is the right location for this post...

Here is a picture of rudy van gelder at a Neve 80 series desk.  What are the modules above each 1073? They have a meter,  2 x knobs and what looks like a switch...

It is a Neve 8024, 24 channel/track, 4 group console. It was one of the first Neves to have in line monitoring and that is what the modules above the channel amps are for. Prior to that, Neve always had a separate monotoring section to one side for the 'producer' to mix on.

Cheers

Ian

So they are monitor returns.


Thanks.....

pucho812 said:

So they are monitor returns.


Thanks.....

Click to expand...

Pretty much. Most consoles were customised in some way so there are no hard and fast rules, but essentially they are monitor returns. In many desks the source was controoled by the tape machine controller so that during tracking the monitor would either be the source or the sel sync. For mixdown, all 24 inputs would switch to the playback returns. There was often a huge T-bar realy that switched all 24 channels in one go. Quite a beast.

Cheers

ian

Sounds like a modification so  a split console could be used like an in-line.

JR

ruffrecords said:

Pretty much. Most consoles were customised in some way so there are no hard and fast rules, but essentially they are monitor returns. In many desks the source was controoled by the tape machine controller so that during tracking the monitor would either be the source or the sel sync. For mixdown, all 24 inputs would switch to the playback returns. There was often a huge T-bar realy that switched all 24 channels in one go. Quite a beast.

Cheers

ian

Click to expand...

Thanks for the info Ian

JohnRoberts said:

Sounds like a modification so  a split console could be used like an in-line.

JR

Click to expand...

Pretty much. Split consoles had a moitoring section that had little more  than a fader and pan. That's all the producer really needed. The first Neve inline consoles had a rotary fader and a pan pot plus a track meter. None of the 80 series was designed as an inlne console from the ground up; you still used the main part fro mixdown - no flip switches at that stage for example. The frist Neve true in line consoles did not appear until the35mm modules appeared in the mid 70s.

Cheers

Ian

Wow, thats a cool picture. We have an 8068 and there are 16 buss buttons below the meters and the monitor volume knob is above the main fader. It was also modified by Fred Hill so half the busses were 1-16 on one side of the console and on the other side of the center section the busses were 17-32.

I cut the last set of Blue Note Jazz records, about 50 titles. I was shocked at how much high end was on the master tapes. There was high end energy well into 30K. At first I couldn't get Coltrane "Blue Train" on the acetate. The lathe cutter head kept heating up because of all the cymbal energy. Cutter heads hate high end. You actually have to calibrate 10K at 14db down or the head heats up. Anyhow putting a heavy low pass tamed all that high end and and also gave the record "that sound".

Most of the Blue Note recordings from that time had that extreme top end. I know Van Gelder is considered a genius but I would have pulled those mics away from the cymbals a bit more. Lol.

To Bluebird:  I'm sure all the eq curves on the tape were set right  but this also sounds a bit like a machine set to IEC when it was an NAB Tape.  However, I'm sure all of that was setup by you correctly.  It sure can be a problem with old tapes from the past when transferred.  Also those old digital reel to reel machines would put a bell like tone on cymbals as well.  If the tape was transferred back in the 80s/90s, then it would have that digital sound quality.

The studio I worked at had an 8036 Neve Split monitor with 1064's and 1081 Eq.  That would feed an A80 Studer 24k.  It was actually a dark sound but very rich.  Going through so many transformers.  Very Punchy sounding but also could build up a muddy sound if you were not careful.

It's to bad Rudy didn't  shared some of his secrets before passing.    It helps to have worked with such great artist, but engineers would do strange things back then to compensate for the sound of tape recorders, and noise reduction.

Hey Fazer, thats a great point! I actually didn't do the transfer. I was cutting from 192K files. I'm not 100% sure who did the transfers, I think it was either some one from Bernie G's or a guy named -------.  It wouldn't surprise me if ------- did it because he has some modded tape deck with most of the electronics stripped out of it.  Not a good idea.

I did tests on an ATR myself, taking the signal from different points in the circuit, replacing the older op amps with newer faster lower distortion versions. Bypassing the output transformer. Taking out the FET's that changed the EQ for different speeds. Nothing I did made anything better. I would take distortion measurements with an Audio Precision into the record head and reading the playback signal. the tape distortion was just so much higher than any of the electronics it was pointless to try and modify the signal path. Plus I have a feeling the people at ATR knew what they were doing. 

Hopefully the EQ I processed the files with will be enough to make the vinyl sound right.  Haven't had any complaints so far! The cutters never get any credit anyhow so I guess it doesn't matter