my distortion figures going lower at final output stage!

i spent so much time fine tuning my single stage 6SN7 line inputs for
1% 2nd harmonics, and ~0.5% for 3rd harmonics,  with 20dbu input level with unity gain.

when i connect same setup to passive mix buss with mic_preamp as gain makeup to test,
my distortion figures going down to ~0.5 % 2nd and ~0,03 3rd !!!

how is this possible ?

what's the level coming out of the mic pre?

20dbu too

kambo said:

i spent so much time fine tuning my single stage 6SN7 line inputs for
1% 2nd harmonics, and ~0.5% for 3rd harmonics,  with 20dbu input level with unity gain.

when i connect same setup to passive mix buss with mic_preamp as gain makeup to test,
my distortion figures going down to ~0.5 % 2nd and ~0,03 3rd !!!

how is this possible ?

Click to expand...

#1 THD+N includes noise so check bandwidth of the later stage. Less HF response could measure lower THD+N(oise).
#2 not common but sometimes distortion products cancel each other out (rare).
#3 it is spelled bus. (buss is what you do to your girlfriend).

JR

JohnRoberts said:

(buss is what you do to your girlfriend).
JR

Click to expand...

JR wins the internet today!

I get on people about the "buss" thing.  Drives me nuts.

not  so fast  8)

Even Fred can get it wrong.    It's wrong.  Period. 

if buss is good enough for them, good enough for me...

kambo said:

not  so fast  8)

Click to expand...

Using the wrong word for bus is a "tell" that informs me someone is not skilled in the broader art. I used to spell it wrong too back in the '80s before I figured it out (I am a drop-out so self taught).  I have yet to trace back to where the incorrect usage began, "BUSS" is a well known fuse brand.

I recall one uncomfortable moment in an elevator with an acquaintance who happened to be editor of Studio Sound at the time, when I casually mentioned in passing that "buss" was the British spelling, among our sundry word differences. He actually got quite irritated and informed me "bus" was the correct spelling there too.

The depth of my irritation occurred when one of the art directors in Peavey's in house advertising department changed the spelling to "buss" in one of my magazine ads.  I was supposed to sign off final approval on all of my ads, but this was sent out to print while I was out of town and unavailable.  I didn't see it until I got my copy of the magazine (I was very angry). That mistake never happened again, at least not with that one guy. 

If you do a survey of the entire electronic community, not just studio types, bus is universally spelled "bus" inside computers or utility power distribution. Only some studio types use this improper spelling (actually a different real word).

Someday I may find patient zero who infected the studio console community with this mistake.  Not a huge deal, but like a said, a way to tell the uninformed from the real engineers.

Since I was ignorant too once, I try to be understanding, but refusing to use the correct word after being informed seems hard to justify (of course different strokes for different folks). 

JR

PS: I recall back in the early days of electronic mail. At peavey we had an internal electronic message system running on our mainframe. I had to teach one director level executive how to use the spell checker in the application because spelling words wrong in his written electronic communications distracted from his message. He wasn't ignorant but apparently didn't read much and couldn't spell common words to save his life.

Dictionary.com and OED agrees.

6. Electricity.. Also called bus bar, busbar  [buhs-bahr]

its always good to hear your past experiences John...

may be someone here should email mr Neve about correct spelling of "Buss"

kambo said:

its always good to hear your past experiences John...

may be someone here should email mr Neve about correct spelling of "Buss"

Click to expand...

Is he patient zero?

OK I sent an email to the [email protected]  email address asking about this.

I never met the man.

JR

set yourself free by accepting both spellings as correct,

a quick search reveals wide spread crime by the use of buss in the audio community,

there is only one mix, so we call it a mix,

there is more than one track to a bus so we use the plural buss,

but never mixx buss,

buss is also more electrical sounding because Buss makes fuses, as opposed to a Greyhound  Bus,

would you want someone telling you that they mixed you CD on a Greyhound bound for Albicurky?

see, you knew what i meant by Albicurky, even though it was mispeled. thus, communication was complete, the meaning was conveyed even though there were obvious errors. humans can correct for humanness, as opposed to a 386 which expects exact syntax,

CJ said:

set yourself free by accepting both spellings as correct,

a quick search reveals wide spread crime by the use of buss in the audio community,

there is only one mix, so we call it a mix,

there is more than one track to a bus so we use the plural buss,

but never mixx buss,

buss is also more electrical sounding because Buss makes fuses, as opposed to a Greyhound  Bus,

would you want someone telling you that they mixed you CD on a Greyhound bound for Albicurky?

see, you knew what i meant by Albicurky, even though it was mispeled. thus, communication was complete, the meaning was conveyed even though there were obvious errors. humans can correct for humanness, as opposed to a 386 which expects exact syntax,

Click to expand...

+1

i did send an email to mr Neve too that i am totally supporting "buss" vs bus, with some great
comments from CJ's post....
  8)

From what I can tell, the audio 'bus' is a derivation of the word 'omnibus', which - according to Wikipedia - is the Latin word for "for all" and  "refers to a passenger-carrying vehicle, originally an enclosed horse-drawn one" (*)

I dislike the double-s too. It just looks wrong (etymology aside).
I saw it the other day on a Tree Audio console. Should have lowered the price by half.

Ps. In Swedish, 'bus' - as in the vehicle - is spelled 'buss'.
'Bus' is what you call mischief, or a prank. A data bus is spelled 'buss'. 'Bussning' is a bush ring (bushing).
There's just too many bus(s)es.

(*) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omnibus

CJ said:

set yourself free by accepting both spellings as correct,

Click to expand...

Bus/buss is just one of several misused words that stand out. Polarity/phase is another hot one. There are more. I generally ignore such, unless I am already posting other answers to a question. I hope I am doing the OP a favor but opinions vary about that too.  :-\

a quick search reveals wide spread crime by the use of buss in the audio community,

Click to expand...

Sadly true, but in my judgement they are all wrong.  I have been paying attention to this for decades and the misuse is not really that widespread, and most misusers change their behavior when informed about the correct spelling. I spelled it wrong myself in the early '80s.

there is only one mix, so we call it a mix,

there is more than one track to a bus so we use the plural buss,

Click to expand...

Buses, or busses are acceptable spellings for the plural. I use buses to be consistent with the single 's' and reduce confusion.

but never mixx buss,

buss is also more electrical sounding because Buss makes fuses, as opposed to a Greyhound  Bus,

Click to expand...

Except that electrical power industry spells it bus, computer industry spells it bus too.

would you want someone telling you that they mixed you CD on a Greyhound bound for Albicurky?

see, you knew what i meant by Albicurky, even though it was mispeled. thus, communication was complete, the meaning was conveyed even though there were obvious errors. humans can correct for humanness, as opposed to a 386 which expects exact syntax,

Click to expand...

I wrestled with this for decades as a designer of gear with both buses and polarity switches that had to be labelled and described in owners manuals. Some people didn't even understand what polarity meant decades ago, not to mention so many letters to fit on a tight panel graphic. Using the proper word could in fact hurt communication.

Communication is not just about conveying the meaning, but misspelling/wrong word usage also conveys information about the professionalism of the speaker/writer. (when in doubt do what's right).

If Neve wants to use the 'ss' spelling  as a trademark affectation they certainly can. Rupert's design chops are not in question.  The misspelling in my Peavey ad was done by a young kid working in advertising who saw that misspelling in print somewhere else and it stuck with him as correct. 

I have been following this for decades (since the mid 1980s). If Neve has some historical information about where this spelling originated I'd love to learn about it. Maybe then I can drop this (nah).

JR 

kambo said:

not  so fast  8)

Click to expand...

When it comes to language, my go-to is the Webster, not an EE.

I heard back from the email contact at Neve and his explanation is that 'buss' is the english spelling, 'bus' the American spelling.

I was informed otherwise by Studio Sound's editor decades ago.

Interesting times.

JR

PS: Sorry about the veer, but I have been searching for where this comes from for decades.

Webster has a sympathetic view to the different spellings but Oxford and Cambridge ignore buss.
https://www.merriam-webster.com/words-at-play/plural-of-bus
http://www.oxfordlearnersdictionaries.com/spellcheck/english/?q=buss