madswitcher

Re: What makes a sh*thole country?
« Reply #20 on: January 13, 2018, 02:51:48 PM »

IPR?
JR

Intellectual Property Rights.

Mike


JohnRoberts

Re: What makes a sh*thole country?
« Reply #21 on: January 13, 2018, 05:40:27 PM »
Intellectual Property Rights.

Mike
Thanx, I am more familiar with calling it IP.

IP, exactly like all the european designs we "borrowed"  ::)  in our early years as a low cost manufacturing nation.

This is a natural cycle and when the Chinese have more IP of their own to worry about other people stealing, and less low cost labor to live off, they will enforce IP law there too. This is a slow moving evolution.

JR
John Roberts
http://circularscience.com
Tune it, or don't play it...

rob_gould

Re: What makes a sh*thole country?
« Reply #22 on: January 13, 2018, 06:30:23 PM »
I think everyone knows that a few countries qualify for the term, it's just that we are not supposed to speak in such a direct manner anymore, even in private, it seems.

I am only 5' 8" so I have been called short arse in the past, nowadays I would be vertically challenged.  I also once had red hair which some might say was a double blow, but I survived.  Now I cherish my Scottish/Irish ginger roots!

There used to be very few fat kids in the class, maybe 1 in 40?  Then  they had to be called obese, but now that too is pejorative.

Alcoholics are encouraged to go to AA meetings and acknowledge what they are, facing up to the truth you might say.  If we can no longer handle the truth, problems don't get addressed and fixed.

I come from an older generation and culture where what Trump said would have passed without comment or shock horror.  I notice that no-one has answered his actual question yet?

Liberal politicians are falling into the same trap time after time, their angst only serves to boost Trump in the eyes of his voters.

It's like the patients are refusing the PC medicine they been forced to swallow for decades, and now the Docs are in despair.

DaveP

Being called ginger and a short arse etc etc swings between friendly joshing and full scale bullying depending on who's dishing it out and who's on the recieving end. If you found it something you could handle; possibly even 'character building' then lucky you - lots of people can't and don't.

The elderly neighbour in the house I lived in before moving out of Britain thought nothing of telling us about popping to the 'Paki' shop. If that's the kind of thing 'that used to pass without shock and horror' back in the day, then I'll stick to living in the present time cheers.  A time where single word pejorative slurs used to describe entire countries, uttered by an individual who has had a year as potus to learn that there's always a microphone on, and walls have ears, are quite correctly shown up to be small minded, ill informed and bigoted.

tands

Re: What makes a sh*thole country?
« Reply #23 on: January 13, 2018, 06:33:44 PM »
Quote
   

Reagan & the Salvadoran Baby Skulls

By Robert Parry
January 30, 2007

Ronald Reagan’s many admirers may find this idea offensive, but – given a new report by the Washington Post – it might be fitting to have a display at Reagan National Airport to show how Salvadoran baby skulls were used as candle holders and good luck charms. Perhaps the presentation could contain skeletal remains of Guatemalans and Nicaraguans, too.

It might be modeled after skeletons on display in Cambodia from the slaughters by the Khmer Rouge. After all, it was President Reagan – more than any other person – who justified and facilitated the barbarity that raged through Central America in the 1980s, claiming the lives of tens of thousands of peasants, clergy and students, men, women and children.

Reagan portrayed the bloody conflicts as a necessary front in the Cold War, but the Central American violence was always more about entrenched ruling elites determined to retain their privileges against impoverished peasants, including descendants of the region’s Maya Indians, seeking social, political and economic reforms.

One of the most notorious acts of brutality occurred in December 1981 in and around the Salvadoran town of El Mozote. The government’s Atlacatl Battalion – freshly trained and newly armed thanks to Reagan’s hard-line policies – systematically slaughtered hundreds of men, women and children.

When the atrocity was revealed by reporters at the New York Times and the Washington Post, the Reagan administration showed off its new strategy of “perception management,” denying the facts and challenging the integrity of the journalists.

Because of that P.R. offensive, the reality about the El Mozote massacre remained in doubt for almost a decade until the war ended and a United Nations forensic team dug up hundreds of skeletons, including many little ones of children.

Now the Washington Post has added a new grisly detail. Several months after the massacre, the Salvadoran army returned to the scene and collected the skulls of some El Mozote children as novelty items, the Post reported.

“They worked well as candle holders,” recalled one of the soldiers, Jose Wilfredo Salgado, “and better as good luck charms.”

Now, a quarter century later, describing his role piling the tiny skulls into sacks as souvenirs, Salgado acknowledged that he had “lost his love of humanity.”

The Post reported that “witnessing the aftermath of what his colleagues did in El Mozote and reflecting on those skulls changed his mind about how the war was being fought.” Salgada said his mentor, Col. Domingo Monterrosa, who later died in a helicopter crash, had ordered an act of “genocide” in El Mozote.

“If Monterossa had lived,” the Post reported, “Salgada said, he should have been prosecuted for ‘war crimes like a Hitler.’” [Washington Post, Jan. 29, 2007]

Enablers to Murder

But what about the American officials who were the enablers and the protectors of Central America’s mass murderers?

While Monterrosa may have ordered massacres in El Mozote and other towns in El Salvador, President Reagan and other senior U.S. officials collaborated in and covered up those crimes, along with acts of genocide in Guatemala and terrorism in Nicaragua.

Yet, the U.S. officials who supplied the guns, helicopters, advanced technology and political cover have never been called to account. Some, like former State Department official Elliott Abrams, have moved on to oversee the bloody chaos in Iraq.

After leaving office, Reagan was showered with honors, including having dozens of government sites named for him, including National Airport in Washington.

Criticism also should fall on President Bill Clinton, who came into office after the end of the Cold War but rejected suggestions that he authorize an American truth commission to investigate U.S. complicity in the era’s crimes and separate fact from fiction, as was done in Argentina, South Africa and other countries.

Only late in his eight-year presidency did Clinton agree to declassify documents for use by a Guatemalan truth commission examining three decades of political violence that had torn that Central American country apart and claimed some 200,000 lives.

But the worst of the Guatemalan violence – like the bloodletting in El Salvador, Nicaragua and to a lesser extent Honduras – came after the election of Reagan in November 1980. That outcome touched off celebrations in the walled-off, well-to-do neighborhoods across Central America.

After four years of Jimmy Carter's human rights nagging, the region's rich and powerful were thrilled to have someone in the White House who understood their problems and would let them do the needed dirty work.

Once in office, Reagan and his administration swung into action, deflecting condemnation of Salvadoran security forces for the rape/murders of four American churchwomen as well as playing down the staggering number of political slayings that left decaying and mutilated corpses on street corners and in trash dumps.

Reagan also put the Central Intelligence Agency to work arming and training an army of Nicaraguan exiles to launch raids into northern Nicaragua and destabilize that country’s leftist Sandinista government. The contra army soon gained a reputation for rape, torture, murder, drug trafficking and terrorism.

more

https://www.consortiumnews.com/2007/012907.html

healthy student

DaveP

Re: What makes a sh*thole country?
« Reply #24 on: January 13, 2018, 06:45:31 PM »
Quote
The elderly neighbour in the house I lived in before moving out of Britain thought nothing of telling us about popping to the 'Paki' shop. If that's the kind of thing 'that used to pass without shock and horror' back in the day, then I'll stick to living in the present time cheers.
Do you think you might be being a bit over sensitive Rob?  Paki is obviously short for Pakistani, Frog for the French, Kraut for the German, Eyetie for Italian.  It's just tabloid journalese.  The French call us Roast Beefs, is that a racist slur?

DaveP
Soundcloud: Delayed Action.

Gold

Re: What makes a sh*thole country?
« Reply #25 on: January 13, 2018, 06:53:32 PM »
The ethnic group in the US which is the  largest, poorest and heaviest  users of entitlement resources  is Chinese immigrants. Yet no mention of China being a sh*thole country.

Spiritworks

Re: What makes a sh*thole country?
« Reply #26 on: January 13, 2018, 07:16:36 PM »
Do you think you might be being a bit over sensitive Rob?  Paki is obviously short for Pakistani, Frog for the French, Kraut for the German, Eyetie for Italian.  It's just tabloid journalese.  The French call us Roast Beefs, is that a racist slur?

DaveP

I dunno, when I go to the "paki", it's short for package shop, where one can purchase alcoholic beverages. Never had anything to do with the owner's ethnicity.

CJ

Re: What makes a sh*thole country?
« Reply #27 on: January 13, 2018, 07:27:07 PM »
here we go again,
If I can't fix it, I can fix it so nobody else can!
Frank's Tube Page: www.mif.pg.gda.pl/homepages/frank/vs.html
Guitar Amps: http://bmamps.com/Tech_sch.html

JohnRoberts

Re: What makes a sh*thole country?
« Reply #28 on: January 13, 2018, 07:31:11 PM »
 :o :o :o  (aren't we better than this?)

JR
John Roberts
http://circularscience.com
Tune it, or don't play it...

CJ

Re: What makes a sh*thole country?
« Reply #29 on: January 13, 2018, 07:39:16 PM »
spell check
If I can't fix it, I can fix it so nobody else can!
Frank's Tube Page: www.mif.pg.gda.pl/homepages/frank/vs.html
Guitar Amps: http://bmamps.com/Tech_sch.html


CJ

Re: What makes a sh*thole country?
« Reply #30 on: January 13, 2018, 07:48:06 PM »
meltdown,
If I can't fix it, I can fix it so nobody else can!
Frank's Tube Page: www.mif.pg.gda.pl/homepages/frank/vs.html
Guitar Amps: http://bmamps.com/Tech_sch.html

CJ

Re: What makes a sh*thole country?
« Reply #31 on: January 13, 2018, 07:49:44 PM »
huh huh    huh huh  huh  ;D
If I can't fix it, I can fix it so nobody else can!
Frank's Tube Page: www.mif.pg.gda.pl/homepages/frank/vs.html
Guitar Amps: http://bmamps.com/Tech_sch.html

MagnetoSound

Re: What makes a sh*thole country?
« Reply #32 on: January 13, 2018, 08:21:30 PM »
Do you think you might be being a bit over sensitive Rob?  Paki is obviously short for Pakistani, Frog for the French, Kraut for the German, Eyetie for Italian.  It's just tabloid journalese.  The French call us Roast Beefs, is that a racist slur?

DaveP

Yes, it is. It may be relatively mild as racial slurs go, but that is essentially what it is.

It doesn't matter whether Rob is over-sensitive or not.  What matters is how the people being referred to feel when these words are used against them - as against them they certainly are. Nobody uses the word 'paki' in a friendly or respectful way, just as nobody uses n*****, coon, chink, wop, wog, dago, or any other racial slurs in any way other than offensively.

If we accept these words, we not only condone racial stereotyping and violence, we lay the way open for other slurs against women, gays, religious groups and so on. Put simply, it is the language of oppression and, ultimately, war.

'Tabloid journalese' is, unfortunately, one of the most powerful tools of political oppression yet to be recognised by the majority of the population. There are already pressure groups boycotting the Sun and the Daily Mail due specifically to their incessant incitement of racial and religious hatred - not to mention the part they play in manipulating opinion around scandals such as Hillsborough and Orgreave.

It is essential that we free ourselves from ths type of language if we are ever to become the truly civilised society that the silent majority, deep down, really want to see. There is no future in perpetuating this kind of language that is not deeply rooted in oppression and segregation. Let's not be a part of it here, eh?


:o :o :o  (aren't we better than this?)

JR

I would certainly hope so, John.
Dan

I don't think people realize what an embarrassment of riches this place is   -  Paul Gold

Gold

Re: What makes a sh*thole country?
« Reply #33 on: January 13, 2018, 08:24:16 PM »
I’d take a hut over that gross apartment . The  Trump Tower apartment is much closer to a sh*thole than traditional Igbo housing in my book.

scott2000

Re: What makes a sh*thole country?
« Reply #34 on: January 13, 2018, 09:17:09 PM »
Well, pretty much half of this country was called ......... 
de·plor·a·ble
dəˈplôrəb(ə)l/
adjective
adjective: deplorable

    deserving strong condemnation.
    "the deplorable conditions in which most prisoners are held"
    synonyms:   disgraceful, shameful, dishonorable, unworthy, inexcusable, unpardonable, unforgivable; More
    reprehensible, despicable, abominable, contemptible, execrable, heinous, beyond the pale

        synonyms:   lamentable, regrettable, unfortunate, wretched, atrocious, awful, terrible, dreadful,

The sowers of the seeds of strife are everywhere. 

I definitely don't support the negative things coming to light but, I'm not sure I would feel any different always wondering if the truth is just being hidden better. 

Fire goes out without wood.




MagnetoSound

Re: What makes a sh*thole country?
« Reply #35 on: January 14, 2018, 04:38:14 AM »
Fire goes out without wood.

True, and oxygen too.

Speaking as a foreign observer, I am glad these tendencies are coming to light. This guy needs to be impeached at the earliest opportunity - not just in a judicial sense for his obvious offences, but for the good of America in the eyes of the world.

In case it is not being reported over there, most of Europe is stood open-mouthed at the antics of this person you call your president. That he has assumed an office he did not even truly desire, by sleight of hand and with foreign interference, and that he is unqualified to execute, is just the start of it. His character has been shown to be deplorable. The rest of the world is just left wondering how soon you can get rid of him.

These comments are, genuinely, not meant to cause offence. I realise that something approaching half the US population voted for this man. It is recognised that he would not have won office under normal circumstances. That we in Britain currently have a prime minister who is equally incompetent, equally deluded and almost as personally offensive, does not fill me with national pride.

There is a foul stench in the corridors of power on both sides of the pond, indicative of a moral decay that is long past rectification. A sweeping change is needed, not just for the good of the economy and standards of living, but for the western psyche to recover itself. There is no good in pretending otherwise.

Dan

I don't think people realize what an embarrassment of riches this place is   -  Paul Gold

DaveP

Re: What makes a sh*thole country?
« Reply #36 on: January 14, 2018, 04:41:05 AM »
Quote
I definitely don't support the negative things coming to light but, I'm not sure I would feel any different always wondering if the truth is just being hidden better.

This is an important point.

Trump makes unnecessary trouble for himself and others, but at least you know that what you see is what you get.  He is not hiding anything from the public.  Presidents like Nixon, Clinton and Kennedy were hiding plenty.  I think that Trump's openness and transparency is what scares most people, they are just not used to it, now it's on his twitter account for all the world to see.

Quote from "A few Good Men"  "You cannot handle the truth".

If I became the US President, I would use Eisenhower as my benchmark and yardstick, in terms of language and behaviour.   I am withholding  judgement on Trump until his last 6 months in office.  I will judge him on results and promises kept or broken.  I will judge him on my own assessment, not on what the media bandwagon wants me to think, whether left or right.  I am perfectly aware that the "System" wants him gone by any means possible so that they can resume business as usual.

So far the stock markets are up, which is good for people's investments and pension funds around the world.  He has given notice to Pakistan over their double dealing with harbouring terrorists, this had resulted in the deaths of many British and American soldiers.   He has made it clear to Assad that chemical weapon use will be punished. I will wait to see whether his corporation tax reductions result in jobs returning to the US or just making the national debt worse.

DaveP
Soundcloud: Delayed Action.

Jarno

Re: What makes a sh*thole country?
« Reply #37 on: January 14, 2018, 06:12:19 AM »
The system should definitely shaken up, but it needs to be done by someone who is fit to be president, and the current seat warmer is not. Regardless of what the words the people in the street use to indicate other countries, a president should know that he himself should not. It is his job to unite and guide, not divide and alienate. A president should be aware that all of the context which is present when things are said, are not when those same things are printed.

DaveP

Re: What makes a sh*thole country?
« Reply #38 on: January 14, 2018, 07:09:17 AM »
Quote
It is his job to unite and guide, not divide and alienate. A president should be aware that all of the context which is present when things are said, are not when those same things are printed.
You make a good point Jarno.

But the guy who reported the words did not follow your wisdom either.  If one is in the  privileged position of giving the President counsel, one should have the integrity to maintain confidentiality.  Unless of course he had another agenda.

DaveP
Soundcloud: Delayed Action.

Jarno

Re: What makes a sh*thole country?
« Reply #39 on: January 14, 2018, 07:23:02 AM »
Absolutely, Dave. Was that information leaked anyway, or was a journalist present?