ruffrecords

Helios 69 Module dimensions
« on: March 28, 2018, 12:07:52 PM »
Anyone know the dimension of the front panel of the original Helios 69 mic pre/EQ module?

Cheers

Ian
www.customtubeconsoles.com
https://mark3vtm.blogspot.co.uk/
www.eztubemixer.blogspot.co.uk


'The only people not making mistakes are the people doing nothing'


mjrippe

Re: Helios 69 Module dimensions
« Reply #1 on: March 30, 2018, 12:19:09 PM »
This one?

ruffrecords

Re: Helios 69 Module dimensions
« Reply #2 on: March 30, 2018, 04:15:13 PM »
There various version, like this one for example:



and the Clapton one:



but they were all variations an a them so I suspect they were all in an identical panel size.

So, thank you very much for that info. 7 inches high is 4U which is what I had guessed. The width I had no idea but now I know it was 1.8 inches, an odd choice but who knows what drove the decision.

Once again, m,any thanks for the info.

Cheers

Ian
www.customtubeconsoles.com
https://mark3vtm.blogspot.co.uk/
www.eztubemixer.blogspot.co.uk


'The only people not making mistakes are the people doing nothing'

ruffrecords

Re: Helios 69 Module dimensions
« Reply #3 on: March 30, 2018, 04:15:53 PM »
By the way, do you have any more Helios brochure info?

Cheers

Ian
www.customtubeconsoles.com
https://mark3vtm.blogspot.co.uk/
www.eztubemixer.blogspot.co.uk


'The only people not making mistakes are the people doing nothing'

mjrippe

Re: Helios 69 Module dimensions
« Reply #4 on: March 30, 2018, 05:01:57 PM »
By the way, do you have any more Helios brochure info?

Hi Ian,

Mostly just some schematics and photos I've collected over the years.  All of it probably from the internet.  But here is one more piece you might find helpful.

Mike

Re: Helios 69 Module dimensions
« Reply #5 on: March 30, 2018, 05:24:40 PM »
So many ledgendary albums cut with the helios ,been meaning to get some of Dickies mojo into my setup for years ,did a bit of searcing around before but couldnt find much info ,appart from the mic pres . Be nice to see the full thing .

ruffrecords

Re: Helios 69 Module dimensions
« Reply #6 on: March 30, 2018, 05:32:06 PM »
Hi Ian,

Mostly just some schematics and photos I've collected over the years.  All of it probably from the internet.  But here is one more piece you might find helpful.

Mike

Thanks MIke. I remember seeing that a long time ago but I never saved it. I have now!! Many thanks.

Ian
www.customtubeconsoles.com
https://mark3vtm.blogspot.co.uk/
www.eztubemixer.blogspot.co.uk


'The only people not making mistakes are the people doing nothing'

ruffrecords

Re: Helios 69 Module dimensions
« Reply #7 on: March 30, 2018, 05:33:44 PM »
So many ledgendary albums cut with the helios ,been meaning to get some of Dickies mojo into my setup for years ,did a bit of searcing around before but couldnt find much info ,appart from the mic pres . Be nice to see the full thing .

There are also sorts of bits and bobs about Helios on the net but very little solid info. I read somewhere that only about 50 consoles were built in total of which about 30 still remain. It would be nice to find someone somewhere who has a set of manuals for one.

Cheers

Ian
www.customtubeconsoles.com
https://mark3vtm.blogspot.co.uk/
www.eztubemixer.blogspot.co.uk


'The only people not making mistakes are the people doing nothing'

Re: Helios 69 Module dimensions
« Reply #8 on: March 30, 2018, 05:44:53 PM »
Rolling stones mobile kept the Helios in place for decades , I think Strawberry studios in Manchester also had one for a long time too ,it was locally built of course ,wonder who reserves the IP rights nowadays .Anyway pubs in Ireland have opened on good Friday for the first time in nearly 100 years ,so Im going down for a few celebratory pints  ;)

ruffrecords

Re: Helios 69 Module dimensions
« Reply #9 on: March 30, 2018, 05:48:44 PM »
Rolling stones mobile kept the Helios in place for decades , I think Strawberry studios in Manchester also had one for a long time too ,it was locally built of course ,wonder who reserves the IP rights nowadays .Anyway pubs in Ireland have opened on good Friday for the first time in nearly 100 years ,so Im going down for a few celebratory pints  ;)

The first one I saw in the flesh was the green wraparound at the Who's Ramport Studios back in the 70s. I was at Neve at the time and I was down there to discuss the design of the Neve replacement for the Helios. I remember thinking how small it was compared with the long straight Neves of that time. I wonder what happened to it?

Cheers

Ian
www.customtubeconsoles.com
https://mark3vtm.blogspot.co.uk/
www.eztubemixer.blogspot.co.uk


'The only people not making mistakes are the people doing nothing'


Re: Helios 69 Module dimensions
« Reply #10 on: March 30, 2018, 08:47:04 PM »
Glynn Johns ,who's next ,sparkling sound ,bristling with favourable harmonics

ruffrecords

Re: Helios 69 Module dimensions
« Reply #11 on: March 31, 2018, 03:27:01 AM »
Glynn Johns ,who's next ,sparkling sound ,bristling with favourable harmonics

Quite a few classic Thin Lizzy tracks were recorded on that Helios too. While I was there they played a copy of the master tape of The Boys Are Back In Town through the huge 15 inch Tannoy monitor golds they had in the control room. Stunning.

Cheers

Ian
www.customtubeconsoles.com
https://mark3vtm.blogspot.co.uk/
www.eztubemixer.blogspot.co.uk


'The only people not making mistakes are the people doing nothing'

ruffrecords

Re: Helios 69 Module dimensions
« Reply #12 on: March 31, 2018, 03:36:30 AM »
Glynn Johns ,who's next ,sparkling sound ,bristling with favourable harmonics

After I retired and got back into audio electronics, the Helios pre designs were among the first I looked at and simulated. As a rule, you try to design a pre so the dc level at the output is half the rail voltage so you can get the maximum output before clipping. When I looked at the Helios pre it did not do this, The dc output level is some way off half the supply voltage. The result is one half of the waveform distorts more than the other. The result is pleasing even harmonic distortion. I noticed that if you swapped the two resistors that set the bias,  the output sits almost exactly at half the supply voltage. So whether the pleasing distortion characteristics of the Helios pre is deliberate or the result of accidentally swapping the bias resistors we will never know.

Cheers

Ian
www.customtubeconsoles.com
https://mark3vtm.blogspot.co.uk/
www.eztubemixer.blogspot.co.uk


'The only people not making mistakes are the people doing nothing'

Re: Helios 69 Module dimensions
« Reply #13 on: March 31, 2018, 04:13:56 PM »
Interesting point about asymetrical clipping , I guess its exactly what we get from single ended valve circuits , I wonder sonically what the difference is between the upper part of the wave clipping and the lower end ie cut off due to the grid going negative, I like the way in older designs soft clipping and what happens on transients actually figured in the designers mind ,now its just it'll deliver abc volts into xyz load ,beyond that all bets are off .In the real world your always going to get unexpected peaks vocals and acoustic instruments are the ones that'll catch you out every time .

I do know a guy called Jackie 'the bell' he knows Pete T and even says he has has bits of one of Petes ill fated Ricky 12 strings ,he says the quadrophenia Jimmy charachter was partially based on himself,maybe a polite email might convince him to enquire about Pete's old Green Helios,and see if we could get the original documentation to post here .


Re: Helios 69 Module dimensions
« Reply #14 on: April 02, 2018, 08:40:26 AM »
Hi Ian,
I sent off an email to Jackie relating to Pete's Green era Helios, its a bit of a long shot at this stage ,but who knows, might turn up something . Not sure if you've seen this site relating to Helios, https://www.helios-audio.com/future-manufacturing
They raise some interesting possibillities on making a modern kit based version ,which I'm sure would be of interest to many here at Group diy.
There does seem to be a willingness on the part of the current owners of the Helios brand to formalise the putting of the designs into the public domain . In any case I sent them off an email enquireing about the possibility of getting further documentation.

I wonder was the off centre biasing arrangement a legacy from the earlier germainium modules when things changed over to npn silicon later on .

 

ruffrecords

Re: Helios 69 Module dimensions
« Reply #15 on: April 02, 2018, 02:10:25 PM »
There seems to be some dispute who own the the rights to Helios or the Helios logo. Helios electronics actually made a type 69 channel reissue:

type 69 channel

and I believe there are others thinking along similar lines.

The problem with the 69 is it is a module meant to go in a console. It has no line level balanced output so it really needs an extra stage to turn it into a stand alone outboard unit.

Cheers

Ian
www.customtubeconsoles.com
https://mark3vtm.blogspot.co.uk/
www.eztubemixer.blogspot.co.uk


'The only people not making mistakes are the people doing nothing'

Re: Helios 69 Module dimensions
« Reply #16 on: April 02, 2018, 03:40:12 PM »
Yeah I did read somewhere that the type 69 pre/eq module didnt have line driving capabillity . Any clues as to what form the master and tape output  drivers were? Its a bit of a shame the whole legacy has wound up in dispute as the helios sits side by side with the best of the best . I have one other contact from years back in the studio I used work ,he was always big fan of the Helios ,might take a few phone calls to find the guy  ,but he may have some relevant documentation stashed away somewhere, or might know someone who does .It has to be out there somewhere.

ruffrecords

Re: Helios 69 Module dimensions
« Reply #17 on: April 02, 2018, 06:20:53 PM »
Yeah I did read somewhere that the type 69 pre/eq module didnt have line driving capabillity . Any clues as to what form the master and tape output  drivers were? Its a bit of a shame the whole legacy has wound up in dispute as the helios sits side by side with the best of the best . I have one other contact from years back in the studio I used work ,he was always big fan of the Helios ,might take a few phone calls to find the guy  ,but he may have some relevant documentation stashed away somewhere, or might know someone who does .It has to be out there somewhere.

There is a line amp schematic - I am pretty sure it has been posted here in the past. I have a copy somewhere. It would probably need a Neve/API style step up output transformer to achieve true pro output and headroom capability.

I also know a guy from the Olympic days who I think also has some documentation.

Cheers

ian
www.customtubeconsoles.com
https://mark3vtm.blogspot.co.uk/
www.eztubemixer.blogspot.co.uk


'The only people not making mistakes are the people doing nothing'

Re: Helios 69 Module dimensions
« Reply #18 on: April 02, 2018, 06:53:40 PM »
This pic showed up alright ,so I said I might as well post it

Re: Helios 69 Module dimensions
« Reply #19 on: April 02, 2018, 06:58:33 PM »
And heres the link to a previous post ,seems to be a bit of info here alright ,

https://groupdiy.com/index.php?topic=59428.0