is reading lots of schematics the best way to learn?

Hi all,
I'm a novice in the field of electronics and wanted to know what your suggestions are for further learning. I've had a few university courses in electronics but don't feel like I have much practical knowledge that would be useful in designing anything complicated.

I gather that The Art of Electronics is an excellent book and plan on getting one soon. But beyond this book, is reading a lot of schematics the best way to learn (other than actually doing lots of projects, of course)?

If so, are there any good books that contain tons of schematics with explanations? I'm guessing The Art of Electronics is more of a how-to book, rather than something with tons of schematics and examples. Certainly, just going through this book isn't going to make me very capable, is it?

I've visited a number of sites with schematics, recommended by people on this forum, but often found them to be either lacking explanations, or inconsistent in presentation (not to mention that I prefer looking at a paper rather than an LCD ).

The books that I did find were mostly limited to a single subject (ie. audio), and I was looking for something more general, ideally presented in an increasingly-complicated manner.

I guess I'm looking back at how I learned to program, and I remember that reading other people's code was of tremendous value. I'm hoping that taking a similar route in learning electronics will speed up the process (please correct me if I am wrong)

Also, are software simulators(ie. PSpice) a good aid in learning? or are they more useful for checking things before actually building a project?

Thanks for your input!

Hi Psasidisrcum,

In the posting subject you ask:
"is reading lots of schematics the best way to learn"

It is not the best way, but it give you a great insight how you can design a circuit with many different variable, especially design of discrete build audio amps.
But it is also very important to have somebody with good electronic experience to ask and discuss a odd design you have find in a schematic. Of course, you must have knowledge about reading schematics, so you understand all components cymbol and theoretical drawings, so you can transfer the schematic to a real thing.

My education and experience to design discrete audio electronic, have I from the Japanese audio industries under the 1970 to 80`s. (I purchase manuals for a lot of money)
Under this time they use very complex and hi-tech discrete audio circuits design in the mostley of all Japanese Hi-Fi gear brands, and you can learn a lot of good amp design from those schematics and manuals.
But you must have some basic knowledge to be able to understand and use this type of schematic information.

From the beginning (in the 1960`s) I start to learn me the basic when I try to repair musical instrument and audio gear, and build simple circuits from electronic magazines.
And I have also the luck to have a very nice mentor that take the time to explaining when I ask a lot of questions the whole time.

I think this is the best way to learn electronics from the start.

--Bo

What are your objectives? What level of circuit do you look at and fully comprehend now? What is your taste for what level of math?

Looking at schematics is a reasonable part of self-study. There are compendia from the reader-contributed sections of the freebie electronics magazines like EDN and Electronic Design. To an extent, the older ones are the better ones because the newer ones have a lot of integrated parts and generally few discrete components, as well as a heavy digital emphasis. Ones from the 1960's are pretty simple, and still have some tube circuits mixed in with the solid-state. These books are long out-of-print but can be hunted down on sites like bookfinder.

The National Semiconductor Linear Applications Handbook is a good place to browse, albeit with a heavy emphasis on op amps and other National products.

But don't expect the explanations to be too complete.

Besides the justifiably celebrated Horowitz and Hill, among modern books there are the Jim Williams pair on analog circuit design and Bob Pease's Troubleshooting Analog Circuits. Williams has gotten contributions from a number of very good designers with plenty of real-world experience. Pease rants a bit (and is reluctant to admit errors I've discovered) but there is a lot of useful information there.

The most important thing imo is to sit down and think about things. Know and apply ohm's law and calculate in your head as much as possible. Do lots of this and turn to simulators to verify your conclusions. An over-reliance on simulation has led to mental laziness, but if your mind is developed sufficiently to begin with the sims can be very powerful tools. Even now I have to guard against hopping on a simulator when a simple paper-pencil and maybe calculator analysis is more to the point.

This is an excellent forum for asking specific questions too, if you get stuck.

Brad

I have the "Art of Electronics" and I think that its value is that is readable. the forward says that it is culled from an introductory course at harvard university so it is geared for intelligent but early learners.

reading just schematics can be like decyphering hyroglyphics without the explanation. along with a good mentor(like the guys here on the forum) they can be very accelerating if you ask questions and get answers. also, I find that some schematics are drawn just to help the technician get through a repair very quick and can be confusing on a big picture scale. they try to hide their trade secrets by making them ambiguous. there is a lot of extra stuff on my neve VR preamp pcb i am reverse engineering that is not on the schematic but the schematic is not wrong. component placement and trace artwork can be critical to the outcome.

Look in the Meta for Usefull Information for Newbie DIY and you will find numerous links to tutorials, and topics full of helpful information. That is a good place to start. There are also several listings of helpful books for beginners in there since you like looking at paper best.

I think a good way to learn about these matters is trying to repair broken stuff. Most often that process forces a much better understanding of the operation..

Jakob E.

Hi,

Hiyas,

The way I have learned is to fix broken stuff and build projects but relating them to theory in a few books I like - Tube Amplifiers by Morgan Jones (kinda audiophileocentric) and The Ultimate Tone by Kevin O' Conner which is about guitar amps. I can't just read theory or look at schematics it's just boring mathematics which I can't do anyway so if I fool around with real circuits and then read to understand what they are doing then I actually understand things. Some old tube electronics books are good for understanding how tubes work... like I learned that from this self-study bunch of pamplets from the 50s I found in a goodwill.

I also learned a lot from designing a really simple tube mic pre and I purposefully used diffferent and theoretically wrong parts to see how it affected the sound and circuit.

hth,

Kiira

You need a good balance between lab work and theory.
Theory is hard to learn without a good teacher to answer questions.

Art of Electronics is a good referance, but to me, not a great textbook.

Learning is painful. Why do you think kids hate school?

If it were easy and fun, then everybody would have a PhD.

To learn the most i think you need textbooks as well as practical experience. I think a large part of learning electronics is recognizing the basic building blocks like emitter followers and diff-amps and knowing what they do. You can read stuff like that in AOE but for me it really started to make sense when i tried some of those basic circuits.

Reading schematics is good too. But its better when you can look up stuff about it to really understand what's going on. And it's even better when you've got someone who really knows his stuff to explain everything. Luckilly we have people like Prr and Bcarso here :grin:

Start with vacuum tubes, and work your way to silicon. Tubes are a little easier to understand.

[quote author="CJ"]Start with vacuum tubes, and work your way to silicon. [/quote]

I couldn't agree more.

Peace,
Al.

quote: "Start with vacuum tubes, and work your way to silicon. "

On the bench, simple audio tube circuits are usually going to sound better*. They are also easier to see to work on, and forgiving of clumsy probing. Drawbacks are higher cost and potentially lethal voltages.

For another reference which I plugged recently, try Professor Nahin's The Science of Radio. Readable, historically informed, vacuum tube oriented despite its recent vintage (2nd Ed. 2001). Good guy, even if he ignores my e-mails.

Brad

*some would argue that they are always going to sound better. They are certainly more fun to watch.

Wow, so many responses already. Thanks Bo, Brad, amorris, Thomas, Jakob, Kiira, CJ, Mendelt and Al for your input! I'm beginning to think people on electronics boards are a lot nicer than those on software boards.

I've gotten a lot of helpful suggestions from this board and another one I posted a similar message at, but I'm still inconclusive on how I should proceed. I do plan on getting The Art of Electronics first and spending some time with it, as I had initially planned. As far as what comes next, a lot of ideas have come up and I've tried to summarize them a bit here, with corresponding questions.

1) learn from disassembling random electronics
2) learn from designing own circuits (but does AofE give me enough of a head-start to design increasingly complicated circuits?)
3) learn from reading datasheets / application notes (but which ones will I read and where would I find them?)
4) focus more on fundamentals (reading more books? ie. Malvino's Electronic Principles?)
5) learn more about vacuum tubes and work towards silicon (through books? which ones?)

I guess there may not be a single way, but perhaps if I lay them out like this, people will find it easier to specify which ones I should follow.
A lot of people mentioned the importance of just thinking about things, using common sense, Ohm's Law and so forth. But on what will I use these suggestions on? I'm guessing it implies reading schematics, but where will I find these schematics to apply these methods to?

In short, I have a lot more ideas now than I did before I posted my question, but I'm still without a solid direction. I realize it's probably difficult to pinpoint a single thing, but what do you suggest I specifically (simple is good! ie. read this book, buy that kit, etc..) do, once I've spent some time with AofE?

Thanks again for all your input! I appreciate your help and how it is making my journey through electronics easier.

[quote author="psasidisrcum"]
Also, are software simulators(ie. PSpice) a good aid in learning? or are they more useful for checking things before actually building a project?[/quote]

Simulators are great for learning. They allow you to alter circuit topographies, change component values, and then instantly see what happens to the response, distortion, biasing, etc. You can sim 10 circuits in the time it takes to breadboard one real circuit.

The demo version of Micro-Cap is very nice.

Build the circuits you find in the Art of Electronics. The application hints from manufacturers data sheets are also a great resource. Search this site and make a list of commonly mentioned op amps and transistors. Then go to the manufacturers websites (Analog Devices, TI, Fairchild, National, On Semiconductor, etc.), download the data sheets and read, read, read. Then build those circuits in the simulator and see what happens!

Of course, you eventually have to build the real thing, but you'll gain a much better feel having played around with the simulator first.

Thomas

Almost forgot - Rane is another a great resource. They offer a wide variety pro audio products and provide full schematics for most of them. They're not necessarily the most elegant designs, but they're usually solid "meat and potato" circuits. And they sure are fantastic starting points if you're just beginning!

.

Jensen papers also good... at Jensen website.

[quote author="CJ"]You need a good balance between lab work and theory.
Theory is hard to learn without a good teacher to answer questions. [/quote]

Absolutelly!!

Learning is painful. Why do you think kids hate school?

Click to expand...

mmm........it can be painful when the teacher isn't any good at deliverying/explaining the information in a way that you can understand/digest, not to mention in a stimulating and entertaining kinda fashion. Now, where can I find an educational institution that can provide this sort of learning!????

Back to the blackboard, whiteboard.... What's the difference between education 100 years ago and now?? Besides the occational out of date videos and may be some lab work???

If people start to investing money into education like what they do in business may be kids wouldn't hate school as much, and may be more kids would excell and find what they want to do with their lives rather than hating being there the whole time???? Waste of time?? Waste of lives??? Walking zombies??

If it were easy and fun, then everybody would have a PhD.

Click to expand...

Yes, to a PhD what he/she does is fun to them because what drives them forward is their own interest and curiosity which they are looking to satisfy and that would make anything "easy".

[quote author="CJ"]Learning is painful. Why do you think kids hate school?[/quote]

Two reasons. One, they're told by other kids that they should, and that if they like school, they're weird geeks.

Two, because too many schools find ways to make something that should be a pleasurable experience painful. I've always felt that learning, real learning, was one of the three great ecstatic experiences accessible to humans outside of a religious context, and I do find it fun, even when it sometimes is painful.

I've been struggling to learn how to use a new piece of software, FreePCB, which I downloaded a couple of months ago after it was recommended by someone on this board. It has been a struggle, but also a joy, as the little light bulbs went on one by one.

It's an old custom in the Jewish community to give a child a piece of bread dipped in honey on his/her first day of school, so the child will know that learning is sweet. (Those Jewish grandmothers understood operant conditioning way before B. F. Skinner, let me tell you.) Sometimes I think it's a custom that should be more widely practiced.

Back on topic: I've found back issues of Audio Amateur, particularly those from the 1970s, very useful tools for learning. In fact, those -- along with a couple of professors who were kind enough to answer hundreds of dumb questions from a guy who wasn't even enrolled at their school -- were my primary education in electronic design. I believe audioXpress is now selling backissues on CD-ROM, several years at a time.

Bruce Rosenblit's book on tube design is also good.

Peace,
Paul

Hi, Paul.

I didn't realize it was you until I saw your username! I really enjoyed your articles (was it in Home Recording?) about "sleeper" mics. Do you have any resources online on more of your insightful writings?

Thanks,
Chris

I have recently downloaded a version of the Radio Designers handbook.
My limited space on my HD did not permit me to expand this text.
i now have a new HD and between my projects I will expand the compressed file and start reading from it.
it was recommended to me by (i think) NY dave.
someone here can probably post that link for you to DL it.
i know it's not the paper version...maybe you can find one on evilbay.
my host site is no big enough fo me to post it otherwise I would.
Anyone have this link fo our forum friend?
hope this helps
TS