Khron

"Normal" ribbon appearance?
« on: December 08, 2018, 12:55:10 PM »
I got my hands on a Superlux R102 for dirt-cheap the other week (30e ;D ), and i figured i'd do a teardown and lift the schematic, for a blog post.

The thing works fine, but...  One thing that struck me was that the ribbon didn't look quite as corrugated as i would've expected, and it's not anywhere near "straight" - see attached photo.

Is this anywhere near normal?  :o

[Later edit] Well, it doesn't look quite as loose in the photo on RecordingHacks. Unless my eyes are playing tricks on me...

http://cdn.recordinghacks.com/images//mic_extras/superlux/R102-ribbon.jpg

For what it's worth, further details can be found right over here :)
« Last Edit: December 08, 2018, 03:43:04 PM by Khron »
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Pip

Re: "Normal" ribbon appearance?
« Reply #1 on: December 08, 2018, 04:06:05 PM »
I looks OK to me. How does it sound?

If you mean should it be pleated the answer is yes!
Pip
New York City
http://geosonixlab.com

Khron

Re: "Normal" ribbon appearance?
« Reply #2 on: December 08, 2018, 05:15:20 PM »
Haven't really run any sweeps or anything like that, but visually, it just looked like...

Well, if it was more pleated / corrugated, it would've been more "straight", and/or a more fitting length for the length of that "window".

Now it kinda looks like it got (partially) "straightened out" and is thus too long for that gap. Is this making any sense? ???


I looks OK to me. How does it sound?

If you mean should it be pleated the answer is yes!
Khron's Cave - Electronics - Audio - Teardowns - Mods - Repairs - Projects - Music - Rants - Shenanigans

Khron

Re: "Normal" ribbon appearance?
« Reply #3 on: December 10, 2018, 06:39:15 AM »
At least going by the photos i found here:

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/so-much-gear-so-little-time/441808-ribbon-sag-update.html

Kinda looks to me i've got a case of the ribbon sag as well (har-har). Except this one's considerably flatter (less zig-zaggy) than those ones, like it's been stretched out inside the gap there.
Khron's Cave - Electronics - Audio - Teardowns - Mods - Repairs - Projects - Music - Rants - Shenanigans

bmack

Re: "Normal" ribbon appearance?
« Reply #4 on: December 12, 2018, 01:03:45 PM »
Yes, your ribbon needs to be re tensioned.  I looks like it took a big hit, straightened out your crimps, and now it's blowing in the wind.  Although, if it sounds alright . . .

This is a test Michael Joly recomends in  the link you sent:

Simply listen the your ribbon mic in headphones and slowly rock the mic forward and backward bringing it to a horizontal resting place with the front then back side facing the floor - there should be no sudden clanging or clunking sound. If you hear a sound like a metalic bang the ribbon has severe sag and should be retensioned. A minor amount of sag is normal (perhaps 0.5 mm deflection from the center line in a "long ribbon" mic) and indicates a ribbon that is probably close to ideal tension and thus proper resonant frequency.

Marik

Re: "Normal" ribbon appearance?
« Reply #5 on: December 17, 2018, 03:16:44 AM »
I got my hands on a Superlux R102 for dirt-cheap the other week (30e ;D ), and i figured i'd do a teardown and lift the schematic, for a blog post.

The thing works fine, but...  One thing that struck me was that the ribbon didn't look quite as corrugated as i would've expected, and it's not anywhere near "straight" - see attached photo.

Is this anywhere near normal?  :o

[Later edit] Well, it doesn't look quite as loose in the photo on RecordingHacks. Unless my eyes are playing tricks on me...

http://cdn.recordinghacks.com/images//mic_extras/superlux/R102-ribbon.jpg

For what it's worth, further details can be found right over here :)

The ribbon looks like a typical Chinese made one--corrugation pitch and depth are incorrect, the ribbon doesn't hold its tension and is saggy, most likely the ribbon material is way too thick. As an example of correctly corrugated ribbon for comparison below is our own VL37 1.5um ribbon. A couple survived falling from 8 feet tall booms on concrete floor, still maintaining a perfect tension (not that we'd suggest experimenting). Since you are in Europe I'd suggest to send it to Stewart for re-ribboning.

Best, M
« Last Edit: December 17, 2018, 03:39:41 AM by Marik »
Samar Audio & Microphone Design

www.samaraudiodesign.com

The Art of Ribbon Microphones

Re: "Normal" ribbon appearance?
« Reply #6 on: March 16, 2019, 03:25:09 PM »
Hi, I got the same question about ribbon sag of the Superlux R102 MK1. I bought my mic for supercheap money aswell and it was clearly sold as defect. The problem is, there is very low signal buried in the noise.

I guess the active impedance converter is ok, the problem seems to be the heavy sag of the ribbon? (see photo)
I am totally new to ribbon mics but I want to get me feet wet. My plan is to unscrew the two Phillips screws close to the transformer and than I would try to retension the ribbon again. Good plan? ;-)

Any suggestions and tips to reach my goal without killing this super fragile ribbon?
And for plan B, is there someone in Germany or in nearby europe who is doing jobs like this?

Thanks a lot! (..and thanks Khron for the schematic and the further information)

PS: Who is Stewart?
« Last Edit: March 16, 2019, 03:36:22 PM by rock soderstrom »

Khron

Re: "Normal" ribbon appearance?
« Reply #7 on: March 16, 2019, 03:37:25 PM »
I was considering "restretching" the ribbon myself too, just haven't gotten around to it yet. Hasn't exactly been a priority for me :)

A "longer-term plan" is to re-ribbon it entirely, but i've yet to find a source for some suitable plastic gears or something :D
Khron's Cave - Electronics - Audio - Teardowns - Mods - Repairs - Projects - Music - Rants - Shenanigans

Re: "Normal" ribbon appearance?
« Reply #8 on: March 16, 2019, 03:47:32 PM »
I was considering "restretching" the ribbon myself too, just haven't gotten around to it yet. Hasn't exactly been a priority for me :)

A "longer-term plan" is to re-ribbon it entirely, but i've yet to find a source for some suitable plastic gears or something :D

In comparison to your motor my ribbon sags really bad! It is close to 1cm... :o

Here is guy on ebay who is selling superduper Aluminium foil from Japan for this job:

https://www.ebay.de/itm/123692869731?ViewItem=&item=123692869731

I guess it would be way cheaper for me to find someone who experienced in doing this instead of "learning on the job", but hey I am DIYer.. ;D

Khron

Re: "Normal" ribbon appearance?
« Reply #9 on: March 16, 2019, 03:55:16 PM »
Having seen this video "some time ago" (when it came out), it gave me more confidence in the DIY-ability of such a project ;D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UIVkRQ4MI0M
Khron's Cave - Electronics - Audio - Teardowns - Mods - Repairs - Projects - Music - Rants - Shenanigans


Re: "Normal" ribbon appearance?
« Reply #10 on: March 16, 2019, 04:09:27 PM »
Having seen this video "some time ago" (when it came out), it gave me more confidence in the DIY-ability of such a project ;D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UIVkRQ4MI0M

Yeah, good video! It makes me believe that I can do this by myself, too. I like his LEGO pleating machine  ;D
I always knew that there will be a day that I will feel sorry about giving away my LEGO stuff to my nephew, arrrgghh  :o

Re: "Normal" ribbon appearance?
« Reply #11 on: March 16, 2019, 06:06:19 PM »
Ok, the ribbon in my mic is broken, I need a new one. I guess I will save my nerves and my wallet and give this to someone who is closer to this topic. I need an expert.  8)

Every advice is welcome!

volker

Re: "Normal" ribbon appearance?
« Reply #12 on: March 16, 2019, 06:38:23 PM »
Stewart: http://xaudia.com/

Also a long-time member here.

Re: "Normal" ribbon appearance?
« Reply #13 on: March 16, 2019, 07:45:54 PM »
Stewart: http://xaudia.com/

Also a long-time member here.

Thanks Volker!

Phrazemaster

Re: "Normal" ribbon appearance?
« Reply #14 on: March 16, 2019, 10:13:05 PM »
If still wanting to DIY it you might check https://www.diyribbonmic.com for good info
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Re: "Normal" ribbon appearance?
« Reply #15 on: March 17, 2019, 04:37:37 AM »
If still wanting to DIY it you might check https://www.diyribbonmic.com for good info

Thanks for information!

Phrazemaster

Re: "Normal" ribbon appearance?
« Reply #16 on: March 17, 2019, 11:17:56 AM »
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** * Kablooie!


 

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