Who thinks there are UFO's out there?

Thought boji's link to "Freedom Watch's" law suit against the Dept. of Defense:

https://www.freedomwatchusa.org/pdf/190722-FIled%20UFO%20FOIA.pdf 

was interesting. I was memorized by the recent video shown of some Navy pilots spotting UFO's in they're F18's.

https://nypost.com/2019/05/27/navy-pilots-spotted-ufos-flying-at-hypersonic-speeds-report/

So why the heck, by now, do we not have definitive proof of these things? Its hard for me to believe the government can keep it a secret for so many years if UFO's were real. I mean, seems there would be a good possibility of a UFO crash in a populated area with enough witnesses to make it public.
So although I want them to exist...because I'm a nerd, I don't think they do.

What say you?

It would be extremely naive to think that in this vast known universe and even more vast unknown beyond the known, that we are the only planet with life. It may not be as we know it or as we define it but there has to be something out there. 

Well just speculating here but two thoughts percolate up as I ponder...

1. Any civilization advanced enough to enter our atmosphere and observe us probably would be advanced enough to avoid crashing...and possibly even detection...I mean we need to think through the logistics of space travel...

Granted we are just now really exploring our own galaxy, our current data supports the idea that any carbon based life form would probably hail from outside our own solar system due to what we have accumulated regarding our own planets...I mean as far as I can tell none of the planets circling our sun can sustain life as we experience it...

Space travel from other galaxies or systems would probably entail many light years to get here...the size and description of current UFO's seems contrary to the logistics of that process...now some people would suggest the UFO's are simply recognizance types of vehicles, NOT life supporting long distance travel devices... but science would suggest if they were just exploritary pods then there would have to be some sort of "mother ship" they connect to and while it possible that they might have the technology to hide such systems it does not explain WHY they would do it...

2. With the proliferation of pretty accurate and fast digital cameras in every cell phone device (Current real time estimates at 9.32 Billion mobile connections worldwide) the proximity of getting actual data has risen exponentially...

Basically there is less than a 1 in 9.32 Billion chances they they exist because so far not one real clear picture/recording has ever been produced...

Everyday it is less than 1 in 9 billion...

Of course all of this presupposes that life from another system is any much like ours is...I think the chances that there are alternate universes out there where we have momentary overlap on occasion is more probable...

Whether or not UFO's are real isa completely different question as to if there is life out there...I cannot possibly conceive that our planet is the only one with "life"...but life out there may be very different that what we experience...hell we barely know about life here and it is waaay more abundant than we can document.

Yes, they probably exist but why would any intelligent life bother with us... ?

This has been well inspected by science fiction.  8)


JR

I think sometimes the way we ask these questions handicaps the answers we might get...

The question of do "they" exist seems a little biased to our way of being...Pando is an aspen root system that has nearly 50,000 connections but sprang up from one seed, it is a living thing many thousands of years old but has "multiple roots"...forest often act in synergy as one...and this demonstrates "life" as a collective rather than an us and them...the possibilities of different combinations of chemical/mineral/inorganic life is as vast as the carbon based approach...how that would manifest is probably much different than little space ships zooming in and out of our skies...

My best guess regarding ANY UFO looking device is that it is probably some unmanned AI sort of data collection tool possibly sent out to document/report on any and every possible planet that meets a certain thresh-hold of interest for other life forms...

Frankly I do not think humans will ever get much beyond our current solar system, space travel introduces HUGE logistical problems that I don't think we can overcome because many of them bounce up against physics (like going the speed of light/time travel issues)...and if thats the case then a strong case can be made for developing tools that do our space travel for us...AI needle ships that can collect and send back data...it's easier for me to imagine one of our data collection pods entering a strange atmosphere and sending back data than it is for me to think "they"might be doing it...because "they" would probably be something so different from us that data collection itself would have to be reconsidered...what kind of information would "they" be lacking?

If any alien life happened upon us here and realised the situation they'd black flag us on the intergalactic saxophone and wait till we've self destructed,
' no point in waisting fazer juice on these muppets , lets try back in a 100 years they'll probably have wiped each other out ' nanu nanu  ;D

parallel dimensions.
infinity is a hard concept to grasp

Resources ,human or otherwise arent infinate Shabs , time and space maybe ,but that clock will hapilly tick on without humanzee at the helm .

parallel dimensions.
infinity is a hard concept to grasp

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Maybe Shab's having a laugh, but what little I divine, I also co-sign.  If you've not watched "Flatlanders", I recommend it. 

Food-chain-epistemology
The desert of the real is full of creatures scurrying around beneath greater forms of consciousness that do not know what they are missing. They may be so low to the earth that they're blind to the bipedal humanoid overhead that is out on a date, but since they occasionally catch a whiff of cologne, they learn that sometimes shadows overhead carry smells.

Humans are the worst at this, (have you seen dolphins interpose bubble vortex rings to pass the time?) thinking they are the end-all-be-all, and that all roads to knowing must funnel through their dazzling apex mind to get a true level-up.  But ALL life on earth, if it can think, thinks this way. From gaboon vipers to baboon spiders, and they don't know jack about carving a Jack o' lantern or how a lantern fish carves out arcs of bioluminescence in the vantablack waters of the Mariana trench.

Why would the laddar of consciousness top out at the opposable-thumbed chimp that can't resist gazing at a mini-monolith 40 times a day?  You say it was a flap of radar-tracked, multiple ground confirmation sightings?  Swamp gaslighting. 
A fast-changing vector of light in the sky? You'll lose your credibility with those kinds of lies. 
Here's a FOIA request to test your resolve, five years it may take- best not get involved. Add five letters more and a court mandating action, it is finally delivered: a page of redactions.

I read a stunning book called The Day After Roswell. Amazon it. It seemed quite credible and detailed what happened from a military insider POV. I found it quite convincing and enlightening. Best book I’ve read on the subject.

Corso likely embellished on many details and I don't like the 'they want to take our earthly supremacy away'  vibe he kept warning the reader about.  Also, if there's a type, then there's types. The hubble deep field told me so.

But there are parts of his book that lend credibility to the notion that ufo's are in fact viewed as a threat to national security, and that governments have always put their foreign technology divisions to work on such things. For example there are many testimonials from those in charge of Nike Ajax missile bases where numbers of their ICBM's were taken simultaneously offline while topside folks reported sightings of giant plasma balls hovering over the silos  (The odds of having 8 out of 10 missiles all report a "no-go" status at the same time, with the issue repeating later that night at another installation 100 miles away was statistically improbable). The fact that we hear about such things now is only because enough time has passed that these older, honorable, patriotic soldiers feel they can tell their stories without being punished for breaking their vows of secrecy.

I appreciate the bump of this topic, although I don't know how much I like knowing I'm the resident UFO kook around here.     <3

Should anyone be entertained by a bunch of old people with credentials and bonafides getting together under one roof to tell their stories, I'd point you to a 2001 press club event found on the internets.

It begs the question: what would posess these folks- so late in life -to dream up nutty stories that would only serve to cause their families grief, unless they realized (after having collected most of their pensions) they have a greater obligation to tell the truth to the next generation than to keep their military/governmental oaths that sustain the lie and secrecy around such phenomenon?

https://youtu.be/4DrcG7VGgQU?t=187

At morning tea this morning (I'm currently building a deck on the beach for someone) I saw dolphins frolicking just offshore. It looked like they were herding a school of fish. Made my day.

As I have mentioned elsewhere, after studying about extremophiles, I started to believe that these kinds of (in the American vernacular) critters could survive space travel. I've never really properly interrogated the notion though.

Aren't there those that believe that dolphins are aliens?

boji said:

Corso likely embellished on many details and I don't like the 'they want to take our earthly supremacy away'  vibe he kept warning the reader about.  Also, if there's a type, then there's types. The hubble deep field told me so.

But there are parts of his book that lend credibility to the notion that ufo's are in fact viewed as a threat to national security, and that governments have always put their foreign technology divisions to work on such things. For example there are many testimonials from those in charge of Nike Ajax missile bases where numbers of their ICBM's were taken simultaneously offline while topside folks reported sightings of giant plasma balls hovering over the silos  (The odds of having 8 out of 10 missiles all report a "no-go" status at the same time, with the issue repeating later that night at another installation 100 miles away was statistically improbable). The fact that we hear about such things now is only because enough time has passed that these older, honorable, patriotic soldiers feel they can tell their stories without being punished for breaking their vows of secrecy.

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Hi Boji, it sounds like you read the book. Did you?

I wonder why you say he "likely embellished the details."

I found it quite compelling.

And no you are not the only resident UFO kook; we are two. Wanna have a tin foil hat party?

Another really good read, but I haven't finished it, is Cover-Up at Roswell: Exposing the 70-Year Conspiracy to Suppress the Truth.

And I just finished: The Forgotten Promise: Rejoining Our Cosmic Family by Sherry Wilde. Very very good book!

Mike

Personally I thought the movie "Contact" was a masterful portrayal of some of these modalities...the Aliens were more like an octopus (which is probably our most alien species DNA-wise) than they were like us...I enjoyed the notion that should be a relevant discussion that ANY space-time travel species would need to be able to manipulate gravity as a force...and here we sit, not really even knowing what gravity is...with those concepts the idea that time itself becomes a permeable construct that can at least be "read" as data points...coincides nicely with the manipulation of gravity...

I appreciate people who claim to have seen things they cannot explain...but the narrative seems to follow some rather extrapolated conspiracy theories which i am not prone to step into...

I think alien life came here, they saw and decided I'll pass.  ;D

I was and still and interested in a lot of unexplained phenomenon. Used to enjoy watching Unsolved Mysteries for that reason. I still haven't seen enough compelling evidence. But a dear friend of mine who is a PhD scientist absolutely believes Roswell was an alien visitation.

Ricardus said:

I was and still and interested in a lot of unexplained phenomenon. Used to enjoy watching Unsolved Mysteries for that reason. I still haven't seen enough compelling evidence. But a dear friend of mine who is a PhD scientist absolutely believes Roswell was an alien visitation.

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The coverup was too huge, swift, and long-lasting for there not to be truth in it.  Nobody protects the story of a weather balloon the way the govt has protected the Roswell incident.

The fact that we've have never encountered alien life (which I agree the gov would not be able to cover up), is considered an argument for the simulation hypothesis. That we exist  in a computer simulation.
Because with the size of the universe, the estimated number of planets, and the billions of years, it is improbable that life HADN'T evolved somewhere else.

Phrazemaster said:

The coverup was too huge, swift, and long-lasting for there not to be truth in it.  Nobody protects the story of a weather balloon the way the govt has protected the Roswell incident.

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Yeah, there are some compelling red flags.