Top/end mirror image
« on: November 24, 2019, 08:43:11 AM »
Revelations around the Irish connections to human trafficing, slaves and the sex trade abound the planet just now ,
but is it pure coincidence the Queens son is also embroiled ?

Gardai and Police lately have cut a huge hole into so called 'untouchable' gangs that have been doing as they please  across the jurisdictions of Ireland and the UK, border foxes you could call them . The Epstein scandal ,for me is really the icing on the cake , scum of the earth has provided human meat to high society , that forms a blackmail loop from end to top , it basically means the rule of law can be short circuited whenever need arises , thats precisely what we saw from the system in the case of Jeffery Epstein , it was an imperative to many top people across America and the world that Epstein be found dead and not have to account for his actions ,the implications of which would have registered on the scale of 'national security' in almost every country on the planet.

Here in Ireland this top/end mirror image has become quite apparent to me , on one hand the people in power are posh rich kids ,buggered up in private boarding schools , at the end you have a working class people treated like dirt over political illegiances going back generations .Broadly speaking you end up with two camps , gov and anti gov ,at crossed purposes ,yet without even realising it both sides are being manipulated from behind the curtain .

Johnny says it well here,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w_7_lEOaU10
for the non link clickers ;) John Lennon -Working class hero (Acoustic)



JohnRoberts

Re: Top/end mirror image
« Reply #1 on: November 24, 2019, 10:41:04 AM »
The Epstein scandal should be a bigger embarrassment than it is to a lot of powerful people. The old joke says that having too much dirt on powerful people can make you suicidal. There are quite a few deaths associated with powerful figures that defy simple explanations.

The Epstein suicide smells bad. While he deserved to shuffle off his mortal coil, there are many rich and powerful people in his circle of acquaintances (friends?) that also need closer inspection.  Prince Andrew is just one of the many on that long list, while the Duke of York seems to totally lack any self awareness of his situation and has been relieved of diplomatic duties (for now at least), for his thoughtless public comments.

The US attorney general (Barr) has reportedly viewed the prison video tapes that do not show any visitors who could have "helped" Epstein commit suicide in his final hours, but will continue the investigation. The pattern of broken neck bones looks more like manual strangulation than rope hanging, but this autopsy evidence is not definitive.  The two prison guards have been charged with sleeping while they were supposed to be watching Epstein, and then falsifying records to cover their misbehavior.

A larger investigation into the Epstein case continues despite his death. His homes have been raided and it is unclear if associates destroyed all the evidence implicating powerful people. Epstein strikes me as the kind of guy who would keep a "get out jail free file" full of juicy dirt on powerful people, that apparently didn't keep him alive this time.  I suspect that such a file would be very well hidden so might not surface for some time, if ever.

 ===

While some people assume slavery is a practice that ended centuries ago, human trafficking (the modern version of slavery) is unfortunately alive and well.

JR

PS: The victoria's secret runway show has been cancelled because the owner had ties to Epstein, hmmmm.
It's nice to be nice....

Re: Top/end mirror image
« Reply #2 on: November 24, 2019, 12:46:15 PM »
Thanks for the reply John  on a most thorny subject ,

Theres a brewing crisis here over how asylum seekers are housed , the current administrations answer is to crank up the 'institutions of state' once again ,but what else can we  expect from a bunch of privately educated teachers pets.
The public response to this ranges from Trumpisms  to outrage , the bizzare thing about it is, be it deliberately racist language or calls for these peoples human rights to be upheld both sides of the argument stand together .

There no doubt  a 'cleaning of house' is going on between  Ireland  and the UK , but my guess is a few top table chess pieces will need to go along with the purge of the foot soldiers to keep the balance .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cuuhsqA95iA

nobody told me there'd be days like these ,
 is that Phil Spectre in the vid  ;D

 


iomegaman

Re: Top/end mirror image
« Reply #3 on: November 24, 2019, 01:35:59 PM »
Thanks for the reply John  on a most thorny subject ,

Theres a brewing crisis here over how asylum seekers are housed , the current administrations answer is to crank up the 'institutions of state' once again ,but what else can we  expect from a bunch of privately educated teachers pets.
The public response to this ranges from Trumpisms  to outrage , the bizzare thing about it is, be it deliberately racist language or calls for these peoples human rights to be upheld both sides of the argument stand together .

There no doubt  a 'cleaning of house' is going on between  Ireland  and the UK , but my guess is a few top table chess pieces will need to go along with the purge of the foot soldiers to keep the balance .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cuuhsqA95iA

nobody told me there'd be days like these ,
 is that Phil Spectre in the vid  ;D

The thin veneer of society always seems to cover up some really bad cultures that have been growing in the dark since the beginning of human institutions...and we always feel a little shocked to find out we have not really developed as quickly in the moral universe as we maybe have in other areas...

I think eventually humanity will recognise a that some of our greatest advancements were made by moral scientist rather than laboratory ones...maybe "scientist" is the wrong word here...moral practitioners/soul physicians/etc...people like Jesus who managed to live (and be killed for it) without any moral scandals...people who could be held up in the mirror and shown to the rest of us as "This is what human is supposed to be"...

Of course we need to get past the tendency to immortalize those people into religious icons...because of course that creates religious institutions where the veneer can cover up the same level of sex slave/abuse as exists in the rest of hidden society.

The Epstein death and Catholic sex abuse and human trafficking ALL have data points that are way to common for humanity to claim any kind of maturity.

Adolescent Man is just as deadly as Cro-magnon man...he just dresses nicer.
Since the development of the internet millions of people have died, the two may or may not be related.

Re: Top/end mirror image
« Reply #4 on: November 24, 2019, 02:10:04 PM »
thanks  Iomega ,
for your thought provoking and intelligent perspectives ,
your right in that its the idolisation causes the rot to set in .

iomegaman

Re: Top/end mirror image
« Reply #5 on: November 24, 2019, 02:44:57 PM »
thanks  Iomega ,
for your thought provoking and intelligent perspectives ,
your right in that its the idolisation causes the rot to set in .

Absolutely, making idols is so damn easy and fairly unconscious...mimetic behavior has helped us to evolve out of the cave dwelling past at an mazing rate but it is also the Achilles heel in our culture...we get our desire for things from those around us and its completely unconscious...

In example...I drive  Jaguar...I love it...real leather, real wood...classy...when I got it (its old now but I still love it) my oldest daughter was driving a Hyundai...made in the Jaguars image, faux leather faux wood same body shape etc...but I could honestly not tell the difference inside the vehicles...it looked and felt the same...it got me thinking..."Why is real leather/wood better to ME than faux if I cannot really tell the difference?"

Who told me real wood/leather was better? It's better via a value system of some sort...but how did I get that value system, who made me think I liked real better than faux if I cannot tell the difference in driving experience?

It's mimetic...I picked it up from the culture around me...Sting drives a Jag, be like Sting...(he probably does not but adverts for them)...etc...

Our culture has become masterful in exploiting mimetic behavior...and thats where people like Jesus and many saints and Buddha and even Mohammad become iconic because we usually end up scapegoating those who live lives on a higher moral plane and then later we idolize them because making them "divine" excuses us from having to be human on the level they were because "they were divine"...

Epstein was scapegoated...(he was completely guilty and deserving I am sure) but let's not let the fact escape us that he was the "scapegoat" that is meant to carry scandall outside the camp (escape goat)...it brings peace back to the status quo and we get back to business and the original issue gets buried away behind the layers of hidden secrets until it gets uncovered again and another scapegoat is needed to bring peace back into the community...people like Jesus are unique because they show us some of the victims are innocent...and it throws a wrench into the entire cycle...which cause immense damage to the system...

We can do better...mimetic behavior has helped us evolve but we need to recognize that it is just as dangerous as some of the things it saved us from...the mob is NEVER right...mob behavior is a contagion...and people like John Lennon use art to help us see the potential of moving away from the mob thought...its a tightrope though...love cannot be legislated or demanded...everyone must freely choose...and therein is the rub.
Since the development of the internet millions of people have died, the two may or may not be related.

bluebird

Re: Top/end mirror image
« Reply #6 on: November 24, 2019, 04:45:12 PM »
...its a tightrope though...love cannot be legislated or demanded...everyone must freely choose...and therein is the rub.

Amazing, how do you come up with this stuff?

Great post... Makes social media even more scary. "mimetic" direct injection...

Re: Top/end mirror image
« Reply #7 on: November 24, 2019, 05:36:56 PM »
Hi Blue,
heard over the grapevine in a limited series of tests ,LSD is showing superior results to Prozac, including limited licencing from FDA.

non related musical clip ,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=22wawX1-Zsg
 
will you look at the round of applause that Irishman got from very a British audience .

Re: Top/end mirror image
« Reply #8 on: November 25, 2019, 07:00:18 AM »
Its hard to see how mass market social media will bring anything good . 

I guess Ive always had a built in ? when it comes to pack mentality ,being told how to think instantly rings alarm bells with me .
Religion was force fed to us here in Ireland ,but I remember from a very young age thinking 'what a load of Bollocks' it is .

I remember being sent to cub scouts at one point , I resented every moment of it until I organised a few of the others to skip scouts and pool our subs money to buy cigarettes, we ended up caught I was fingered as ringleader and got the boot permanently from Scouting organisations ,  the other thing I remember was the taunting of the other scouting group 'CBSI' ,'a bunch of queers' was the usual line , its only now, almost 40 years later come to light that sexual abuse was rampant in Catholic Boys Scouts of Ireland, all government funding has now been cut and the organisation is dead in the water . I was lucky I wasnt sent to be an altarboy , although I know a few people who were forced to do it by their parents , so blinded by the white light they couldnt even see the danger they were putting their children in , In some ways now mass market social media is ticking a lot of the same boxes ,a clear and present danger to childrens development that many refuse to see. 

iomegaman

Re: Top/end mirror image
« Reply #9 on: November 25, 2019, 09:59:21 AM »
So true Tubetec...mimetic rivalry (often dumbed down as "peer pressure") is a powerful force and now it has the largest bullhorn and soapbox...

I think most people get involved because they want some level of intimacy in a growingly distant feeling world...but the truth is intimacy can never be a group product, ever.

You know the jigs up whenever the group you are in "De-names" someone...to take away a person/group/peoples name is to set them up for sacrifice...this is step 1-5 of the scapegoating process...

I remember the phrase "Queer" being thrown out when I was a kid as well...it was always a way to de-name someone and attack them...it was an effort to remove them from the tribe and exile them from intimacy and set them up for attack.

Pretty easy to scan the social media or news and see who is being "de-named"...

We do it most with political leaders we despise..."45" comes to mind...as does "socialist" here in USA...
Since the development of the internet millions of people have died, the two may or may not be related.


JohnRoberts

Re: Top/end mirror image
« Reply #10 on: November 25, 2019, 11:42:49 AM »
So true Tubetec...mimetic rivalry (often dumbed down as "peer pressure") is a powerful force and now it has the largest bullhorn and soapbox...

I think most people get involved because they want some level of intimacy in a growingly distant feeling world...but the truth is intimacy can never be a group product, ever.

You know the jigs up whenever the group you are in "De-names" someone...to take away a person/group/peoples name is to set them up for sacrifice...this is step 1-5 of the scapegoating process...

I remember the phrase "Queer" being thrown out when I was a kid as well...it was always a way to de-name someone and attack them...it was an effort to remove them from the tribe and exile them from intimacy and set them up for attack.

Pretty easy to scan the social media or news and see who is being "de-named"...

We do it most with political leaders we despise..."45" comes to mind...as does "socialist" here in USA...
Perhaps you are referring to the "cancel culture".... Indeed mob behavior is amped up by the internet connectivity....

JR

PS: For some "good" mob behavior, something like 70% of voters turned out for recent elections in Hong Kong overwhelmingly electing pro democracy candidates. It will be interesting to see the mainland Chinese response to this blatant rejection by regular citizens.
It's nice to be nice....

Re: Top/end mirror image
« Reply #11 on: November 25, 2019, 12:21:58 PM »
I did see a news item about Hong Kong earlier , somehow they have managed to turn it around and make the system work in their favour , its a bit like Tianenmen square but this time the people took victory over the state . It could easily awaken more rights based protests in other places in China , we might not even hear about it .

JohnRoberts

Re: Top/end mirror image
« Reply #12 on: November 25, 2019, 01:08:46 PM »
I did see a news item about Hong Kong earlier , somehow they have managed to turn it around and make the system work in their favour , its a bit like Tianenmen square but this time the people took victory over the state . It could easily awaken more rights based protests in other places in China , we might not even hear about it .
It is far from over. China cannot afford to give them freedoms they deny from the rest of China, even though that is what they agreed to do when they got Hong Kong back from Britain. It will be hard for them to keep this vote results secret from the mainland. They already call the protestors terrorists, so this vote may be difficult to explain (so they probably won't).

Usually china restricts who they allow to even run for office to prevent embarrassments like this but I suspect the protest movement on HK was too widespread to cancel in advance.

Interesting and good but i am still waiting for China's response. I doubt it will be warm congratulations.  ::)

President trump is about to sign a bill that congress passed condemning China's behavior in HK, that will surely PO china too. Not going to help the trade negotiations.

JR
It's nice to be nice....

boji

Re: Top/end mirror image
« Reply #13 on: November 25, 2019, 05:42:36 PM »
Re: sex trafficking, below video of Ronald Bernard, a dutch banker turned whistleblower gave me pause. Last year he testified before the INTJ commission on human trafficking, and his public confessions on the reality of the skin trade are worth appreciating, even if it is terrible to think about.

Viewer discretion advised.

https://youtu.be/SHVkQBrEIOg?t=1318

Edit: Upon reflection, maybe this person is a fabrication, and his testimony was bs. Maybe it was real.  Only a single reference to his death from some obscure news outlet is returned by name search. You'd think it would have been bigger news.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2019, 06:28:38 PM by boji »

Re: Top/end mirror image
« Reply #14 on: November 25, 2019, 10:30:08 PM »
I think you do hear the odd story of bankers who end up realising all is not right with the business model and cracking up completely . What he says about the blackmail seems to add up, having dirt on powerful people gives you have a powerful hold over them ,  looks like Epstein was doing precisely the same .

I had a sneaking suspicion Epsteins friend  Maxwell was connected to Robert Maxwell , I googled it earlier on and indeed its his favourite and closest daughter . Even though her fathers death was put down to misadventure she always maintained he was murdered and I had  heard his death refered to as suspicious by someone who claimed to be a CIA opperative and seems very credible.

I think its really all about making sure theres dirt on file on everyone in positions of power ,political and big business figures  are especially lucrative targets. Its quite obvious people like Epstein and Weinstein were facillitated for years when really all they are is glorified pimps with hidden cameras all over the place .

In relation to the Irish connection to all this , the movie 'the crying game' illustrates fairly well the techniques used , British soldiers were entrapped and blackmailed. Some  IRA members themselves seemed to have a taste for underage sex and were facillitated ,filmed and used as moles in the organisation . Its kind of like a cold war ,each side holding cards against the other ,so most of the time its a stalemate position if either side tries to makes a move and then its in the vaccum that all kinds of horrors can take place .




boji

Re: Top/end mirror image
« Reply #15 on: November 25, 2019, 11:18:32 PM »
"One ring to bring them all and in the darkness bind them."

It follows that when you reach a certain point of income, power becomes about both anonymity and projection. Outside the club, reality is accidental, provocative, crowd sourced.  On the inside, it is the opposite.  Marionettes can not get tangled up and perform the wrong drama on the world stage. I know this sounds terribly dark and conspiratorial, but it's all anyone can conclude given the constant circus of media, materialism, and magic that keeps the herd from organizing club inspections.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jwaw24W2bW0
« Last Edit: November 26, 2019, 12:43:10 AM by boji »

Re: Top/end mirror image
« Reply #16 on: November 26, 2019, 05:29:55 AM »
Thanks Boji,

I think this dark force relies on the fact that its a camera obscura view of it most people see , we'd like to think we'd made progress,but as John pointed out  the slave trade is alive and well .

I kinda get the 'lizard people' delusion too , its easier to scape the goat than accept the implications that this is purely of mans making.   I think one of the big dangers now ,fueled by social media driven anxiety,  is the expectation that  we cant be offended or made to feel uncomfortable as its a 'negative' and instead of facing up to reality we just flick the page on social media to something nicer that doesnt tend to undermine our illusion. For me growing as a human being means these most difficult subjects have to be tackled head on , this is not easy ,it never was ,nor will it ever be .Escapism in the shorter term is a nessesary survival strategy  but in order to learn and grow you have to speak the truth and shame the devil back down into hell at some point .

I just wanted to add here ,my use of the words devil and hell  is  figurative  and relates more to the evil were (humanity)capable of than a place or a being that actually exists .
« Last Edit: November 26, 2019, 02:07:50 PM by Tubetec »

boji

Re: Top/end mirror image
« Reply #17 on: November 27, 2019, 01:37:52 AM »
Quote
devil and hell  is  figurative

Except it has been made literal on many occasions, and we mortals have invoked the archetype of the devil to lasting and terrible effects. 
Hell is also a condition, which is like any other. But I imagine most who have been there would agree it is not just a mental place. It can be occupied. It has borders which can be crossed into physically, and for a lucky few, exited.

But if hell is not a place, then the "State of Wisconsin" is not a place. Wisconsin is a fiction in every sense except by common agreement that it occupies a space. One's "State of Mind" and one's "State of Wisconsin" are just words that stand in for a set of experiences.
The "State of Hell" I'd say is not much different, although its borders and occupants are much more ephemeral and fluid, and there's  much disagreement about who's in charge.  :D

On the devil outside
I've said this more than once, but the behavior of tribalism and cancel culture is begging to be reduced to a rejection of the shadow-self.  It takes what we most fear we are deep inside, and projects it outward into others, offloading the responsibility for the state of the world. The truth is if every single person believed themself no better than Epstein, Hitler et al, it would make us all the more honest and purposeful in acts of love and kindness-- each would know that every goodly gesture was a direct confrontation with the worst within, and that keeping our evil natures in the passenger seat rather than at the wheel would take more work than using the car to map out evil landscapes.

Squeaky

Re: Top/end mirror image
« Reply #18 on: November 27, 2019, 03:09:13 AM »
I have often struggled with understanding the a priori of humanism. That which is the innate in us. It is probably heterogeneous anyway - also depending on trigger responses during individuation as well as genetic disposition. When I was younger I believed in honour and kindness - goodwill, if you will. Luckily, I suppose, I was fortunate enough to be brought up in an environment that such notions could be put forward and be considered as reflections of human nature. As I entered into my adult life I was confronted with so many occurrences that led me to think that in the milieu of man perhaps the cream does not rise to the top. Those that take, step over, seize dubious opportunities, those that are capable of making decisions that harm many (and perhaps the world in general) for their own gain, that these are the people that have the basic fabric to overcome. To rule. To be successful. This led me to conclude that I should accept that what I thought should be the cream of humanity will not rise to the top. Platonic philosiphism is dead. From time to time I have started thinking that perhaps, I should just accept that humanity is not what I thought it was and get on with the struggle. Join the rotten bastards at their own game. One upmanship. Cronyism. It is not what you know... Step on someone... Your foot in their face. Au fin, I don't f-n-kw. I just can't do it. Apparently the meek will inherit the earth... "oh, that's nice, they have a hell of a time" (Life of Brian).

fazer

Re: Top/end mirror image
« Reply #19 on: November 27, 2019, 09:28:44 AM »
Quote
Apparently the meek will inherit the earth.

JP Getty quote
“The meek shall inherit the earth .......but not the Mineral Rights”



 

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