[JohnRoberts]

Real life.

While I cannot read minds, they appear to be protesting the governor's overly restrictive shut down as fascist.

JR

[hodad]

While I cannot read minds, they appear to be protesting the governor's overly restrictive shut down as fascist.

JR

This Is a POLITICAL rally, not some organic uprising.  I'm surprised you didn't notice that, John, since you so loathe politics.  In Michigan, the rally was supported by a right wing astroturf group that is tied to betsy Devos' family (you know, the ones who got rich off a pyramid scam?)  Billionaires are more than happy to shove a few hundred little people into harm's way to score some political points. 

If Republican rabble weren't brainwashed idiots, they'd be protesting the lack of testing, and the horrible delays and lack of planning that have caused said lack.  Trump is the idiot who's made all this worse.  Democratic governors are targeted bacause they took a sh!t on Trump's plan to usurp governors' power.  That is really why they're protesting--Trump had a hissy fit. 

TESTING, TESTING, TESTING.  I've been saying that for a month and a half at least.  Even you've been saying it, John.  That's the key to easing up on the shelter in place.  And Trump, not the governors, is lagging mightily, STILL, in this area. 

All the Republican [email protected] need to go to DC and tell Trump to get his @ss in gear.  This is squarely on him, and he's done a horrible job as a leader. 

[JohnRoberts]

This Is a POLITICAL rally, not some organic uprising.  I'm surprised you didn't notice that, John, since you so loathe politics.  In Michigan, the rally was supported by a right wing astroturf group that is tied to betsy Devos' family (you know, the ones who got rich off a pyramid scam?)  Billionaires are more than happy to shove a few hundred little people into harm's way to score some political points. 

If Republican rabble weren't brainwashed idiots, they'd be protesting the lack of testing, and the horrible delays and lack of planning that have caused said lack.  Trump is the idiot who's made all this worse.  Democratic governors are targeted bacause they took a sh!t on Trump's plan to usurp governors' power.  That is really why they're protesting--Trump had a hissy fit. 

TESTING, TESTING, TESTING.  I've been saying that for a month and a half at least.  Even you've been saying it, John.  That's the key to easing up on the shelter in place.  And Trump, not the governors, is lagging mightily, STILL, in this area. 

All the Republican [email protected] need to go to DC and tell Trump to get his @ss in gear.  This is squarely on him, and he's done a horrible job as a leader.

Just more of my dumbass sloppy thinking....   

Clean you hands and stop touching your face...

JR

[JohnRoberts]

I am not ready to call foul yet.......BUT China has recently instituted new export regulations delaying shipments of PPE from China involving important health supplies... Coincidence? Maybe but perhaps a subtle negotiation over being blamed for this cluster fsk.

JR

[cyrano]

I see that Chinese behaviour as a warning that the party is still boss in China and doesn't want others to interfere.

Bad news for Taiwan, that's been cut off from getting WHO data. And while the US fleet had to withdraw from the South Chinese sea, because of infections aboard the main carrier, the Chinese are moving in. They "donated" about a billion dollars to build a trade port in Indonesia. Of course, it's also a marine port. Chinese marine, that is.

It's not a confrontational policy, more of a silent, slow take-over. Instead of showing muscle, they are just trying to show a friendly face to those who are in need. Like Africa, fi. Seems to be working.

[john12ax7]

If the world had any sense they would recognize Taiwan as an independent nation and learn from them.

[DaveP]

I worked as a volunteer at a hospital in the Congo  from 75-77.  ( it was called Zaire then)

There was no plastic PPE back then, but plenty of cotton gowns and masks that were sterilised in high pressure boilers powered by paraffin and then re-used.  I guess this was not too far removed from what happened back in 1918.

The problems we are suffering today are two-fold:-

1)   Over reliance on a throwaway plastic culture.

2)  Over reliance on Chinese manufacturing.

I hope the West wakes up to this and maintains some strategic manufacturing in-house in future.   I always thought it was a short term fix to buy cheap from China, now look where we are

DaveP

[JohnRoberts]

I see that Chinese behaviour as a warning that the party is still boss in China and doesn't want others to interfere.

Bad news for Taiwan, that's been cut off from getting WHO data. And while the US fleet had to withdraw from the South Chinese sea, because of infections aboard the main carrier, the Chinese are moving in. They "donated" about a billion dollars to build a trade port in Indonesia. Of course, it's also a marine port. Chinese marine, that is.

It's not a confrontational policy, more of a silent, slow take-over. Instead of showing muscle, they are just trying to show a friendly face to those who are in need. Like Africa, fi. Seems to be working.

China patiently plays a long game extending their influence all around the world, the "belt and road" program is a debt trap that many poor nations take in hook line and sinker.  Africa is already struggling with high debt levels, China is offering more of the same.

JR

[JohnRoberts]

If the world had any sense they would recognize Taiwan as an independent nation and learn from them.

I have been paying attention to history long enough to remember it was originally called Formosa. It has long been a thorn in mainland  china's side... they were ticked off before WWII when Japan took over the short lived republic there.

Communist china believes that Taiwan belongs to them  and really does not like it when other countries recognize Taiwan as a separate nation and give it military defensive support. 

The United States bi-partisan position is that it doesn't recognize the PRC's claim over Taiwan, and considers Taiwan's status as unsettled. All of this ambiguity has resulted in the United States constantly walking on a diplomatic tightrope with regard to cross strait relations.

The reports coming from Taiwan about COVID19 conflicting with mainland china's, resulted in more diplomatic dancing for the western powers.

The WHO is pretty much a puppet of communist china so not allowed to recognize Taiwan by its masters.

Hong Kong can serve as an example of China's long term intentions (hint: not freedom of self rule). This likewise is playing out in slow motion, while the world is distracted elsewhere.

JR

PS: We agree again...

[cyrano]

It's not a debt trap. That would be US style. The Chinese really "donate" the funds. Of course, they get exclusive rights to some things in exchange, so it's not without strings, but still...

[cyrano]

The WHO is pretty much a puppet of communist china so not allowed to recognize Taiwan by its masters.

That's certainly not true. You could say the same thing about any other Int'l organisation, like Interpol, or UNO.

Just like all other players, China wants influence in all of these organisations. But they are very much aware that if they would dominate in one of these organisations, that would render them useless.

And, yes, Taiwan is between a rock and a hard place. But let's not blame Gibraltar on the Spanish, shall we?

I can understand both sides. Taiwan wants recognition as an independent state. And China doesn't like that, obviously. But I don't think the Chinese communist party would risk going to war to incorporate Taiwan. It's an insult to the party, but they don't need Taiwan.

The US needs China, as they are finding out now. But China needs the US too. It's just a question which one of those needs the other one the most...

[JohnRoberts]

It's not a debt trap. That would be US style. The Chinese really "donate" the funds. Of course, they get exclusive rights to some things in exchange, so it's not without strings, but still...

A study of chinese culture does not suggest they are doing this out of altruism...

Of course I cannot read their minds so perhaps overnight they became generous to distant people for no reason, perhaps just some more of my sloppy thinking. 

JR

[cyrano]

A study of chinese culture does not suggest they are doing this out of altruism...

Of course not, John. Money equals power, equals time. And since most of us would like to live forever, we're all susceptible...

[hodad]

Baecause Trump couldn't get his hands on any smallpox blankets: 

A single deportation flight to Guatemala by the U.S. government saw more than 75% of the migrants later test positive for novel coronavirus, the country's health minister told reporters on Tuesday......{L}ast Friday, President Donald Trump ... signed a memorandum to authorize sanctions against any country that doesn't accept removals from the U.S.

[hodad]

One more note:  Last night I saw the Repoublican governor of Maryland call Trump "delusional" on testing.  See, JR, you can still be conservative without drinking the Trump Kool-Aid.  All the cool Republicans are doing it--why not just give it a try?

[JohnRoberts]

One more note:  Last night I saw the Repoublican governor of Maryland call Trump "delusional" on testing.  See, JR, you can still be conservative without drinking the Trump Kool-Aid.  All the cool Republicans are doing it--why not just give it a try?

Stop trolling me personally...  I hope you don't think you are accomplishing anything.

JR

[hodad]

I hope you don't think you are accomplishing anything.

JR

Yeah.  You'd think I'd know better by now.  The preponderance of evidence suggests you're correct--what kind of fool am I?

[JohnRoberts]

Hong Kong can serve as an example of China's long term intentions (hint: not freedom of self rule). This likewise is playing out in slow motion, while the world is distracted elsewhere.

JR

I must have felt a disturbance in the force... Hong Kong police just arrested more than dozen major pro-democracy leaders. Apparently under instructions from mainland China to squash the democracy protests while the world is paying attention elsewhere...

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/18/world/asia/hong-kong-arrests.html

JR

[cyrano]

Probably also hoping it doesn't get in the news now, because of Corona...

[hodad]

So Donald Trump's big "hunch" is turning out not to be the wonder drug he promoted it as:  https://apnews.com/a5077c7227b8eb8b0dc23423c0bbe2b2

You'd think that by now certain people in this country would figure out that we're better off trusting science over Donald Trump's "hunches,"  but that seems highly unlikely.  Cultists gonna cult, I suppose. 

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