Say gung ho to the 1178

Whats wrong with the 1178?

Everyone with no electronically avareness seams to say
"gung ho" to the 1176, but noone aptrechiates the 1178!

I think its nice, im doing "sort of" clone! :wink:

regards
kkrafs

Well the 1178 doesn't let you select different ratios for each channel, nor different attack and release times. As a result the Stereo link/mono switch might just as well not exist, because it only gets used in stereo mode most of the time.

On the sonic side, there are many different types of 1176, and the 1178 is a version of the least-loved 1176; the silver-face. No input transformer at all, no constant-impedance attenuator, and -one of the enduring premises of the earlier 1176's- the oroginal idea of everything up to the attenuation element being passive -as in the LA-2a's- was abandoned.

I used to have a pair of D-revision 1176's and I added an 1178. The 1176's beat it at everything but noise figure when compressing the buss (which I rarely used it for) so as a result, the 1178 basically got no use. It's still there in the rack, but alost no fingerprints on it since it's only used after we've run out of other compression.

If I recall correctly, to improve tracking inter-channel, they used a different GR element as well.

Nobody I know who regularly tried both had much love for the 1178.

Keith

Let's change the title of this thread... I know, it's been a while but still...

or at least add another k for kkrfat kkk-rfat (ok it's a joke but this title really annoys).

[quote author="SSLtech"]Well the 1178 doesn't let you select different ratios for each channel, nor different attack and release times. As a result the Stereo link/mono switch might just as well not exist, because it only gets used in stereo mode most of the time.

On the sonic side, there are many different types of 1176, and the 1178 is a version of the least-loved 1176; the silver-face. No input transformer at all, no constant-impedance attenuator,

and -one of the enduring premises of the earlier 1176's- the oroginal idea of everything up to the attenuation element being passive -as in the LA-2a's- was abandoned.

I used to have a pair of D-revision 1176's and I added an 1178. The 1176's beat it at everything but noise figure when compressing the buss (which I rarely used it for) so as a result, the 1178 basically got no use. It's still there in the rack, but alost no fingerprints on it since it's only used after we've run out of other compression.

If I recall correctly, to improve tracking inter-channel, they used a different GR element as well.


Nobody I know who regularly tried both had much love for the 1178.

Keith[/quote]

What do you mean with no constant impedance attenuator?
Do you mean the Gr cell?

To me the 1178 has its simliaritiese to a F version 1176
no input transformer, FET gain cell, yes opamp buffer instead
of discretes, and a diffrent output driver stage.

There was input transformer less 1176 to!

So if using BF245 in both it would be interestimg to her what differs!

Well it seams that it wasnt much liked as well as this topics title says! :wink:

[quote author="clintrubber"]Let's change the title of this thread... I know, it's been a while but still...[/quote]

However,

translation of "sieg heil" could be "hail victory". Hail and heil
bare the meaning, being a salute. As with many of the nazi rituals,
the heil was taken from the rituals of ancient rome, where the
gladiators and soldiers of the roman army, would hail the emperor
before going into battle.

But, it can mean "well fare", however that was the point of the topic
title, its some times to much 1176, ie 1176 its getting "sieg hailed"
by everyone! (by people outside this list offcourse)

Its like when pople say that Bob Moog was the creator
of the synthesiser therefore the ladder filter sounds best
and everything else are crap! :twisted:

Or when everyone agrees that Bheringer are crap only......wich it is! :razz:
(sorry i meant brurhingem brringer, crap", bringger,bherr.....hrrrrrrr!)
:grin: :roll:

I experienced the oppsite....most gearslutties believe that the 1178 is real stereo 1176. too much chips in there to be real ;-)

steff

plz get that nazi shit off that thread title.

However,

translation of "sieg heil" could be "hail victory". Hail and heil
bare the meaning, being a salute. As with many of the nazi rituals,
the heil was taken from the rituals of ancient rome, where the
gladiators and soldiers of the roman army, would hail the emperor
before going into battle.

But, it can mean "well fare", however that was the point of the topic
title, its some times to much 1176, ie 1176 its getting "sieg hailed"
by everyone! (by people outside this list offcourse)

Click to expand...

In all respect, it'll have become clear that various people didn't like the thread-title (to put it mildly). Enough reason to change it imho without any further discussion.
I figure that for the added comment above an alike version could be made for their 'four-legged logo' like they didn't invent it but re-used it. That'll all be true etc, but it doesn't matter. The fact that it also was(/is... ) related to bad, very bad things is enough reason to skip the use of it altogether (imnsho) -to avoid any misunderstanding.

[quote author="kkrafs"]What do you mean with no constant impedance attenuator?
Do you mean the Gr cell?[/quote]
No. the 'real' sought-after 1176 (all the ones up to rev E IIRC) have in order of signal path: A constant-impedance variable attenuator, An input transformer, a resistor and a FET. The whole UREI premise was that it was basically impossible to overload the front end, since everything was totally passive.

The later ones, as also used in the 1178, had unprotected circuitry before the standard potential divider input gain control.

Keith

Ok, but non of the versions could stand more then the PS ie 30V
in the FET pre amp. Isnt +29 dBu an awful lot of input signal?

Not at all. Since the incoming signal is attenuated passively, you could in theory put 50V in at the front end then attenuate it to a happy level for the transformer without it mattering in the slightest what the PSU voltage is... Also, the input transformer is used "the wrong way round" so it steps signal DOWN to the FET operating range.

By the way, +29dBu is a peak-to-peak voltage swing of almost 62 volts...

keith

Nice thread-title ! :thumb:

Cheers,

Peter (who's unaware of the exact meaning of gung ho for now - it's that Anthrax-song, right ? Oops, anthrax... )

I think that gung-ho has two possible meanings: one is a type of stir-fry served in a red bean sauce usually over a bed of noodles, the other is a low-price prostitute that I once encountered on a trip to the far east... (Or was that the "kimono dragon??? :? )

Keef

Interesting meanings ! :wink:
There's also some vague recollection that it's some marines-yell ?

Yes, and Memorial Day is coming up.

[quote author="SSLtech"]Not at all. Since the incoming signal is attenuated passively, you could in theory put 50V in at the front end then attenuate it to a happy level for the transformer without it mattering in the slightest what the PSU voltage is... Also, the input transformer is used "the wrong way round" so it steps signal DOWN to the FET operating range.

By the way, +29dBu is a peak-to-peak voltage swing of almost 62 volts...

keith[/quote]

Sorry, sorry, i locked in the wrong column in the db table, yes 62v PP,
but "when" or in what situation do you pump in 50 Volts into a
compressor? Yes i know that the trafo steps down, im just pussled by
the voltage ranges you studio folks are using, +50v for me is like
running telephone lines out at the country side!!!!

When do you need 69,31V!!! I just wonder!!
:?

Btw the 1178 schemo states that there are
attack and release located on front panel!!

Yes,

But the attack and release controls are dual gang- i.e. in "mono" (unlinked mode) each channel has to have the same attack/release times. As Keith mentioned, it makes a mockery of the "Mono/Stereo" link switch, as both channels will share the same time constants!

One problem that dogs the 1178 is a scratchy Input Level pot. The whole of the input stage has no coupling capacitors from input XLR to GR stage. It's common to find a DC level offset at the Input Level pot which causes bumps and scratches. A quick mod with extra caps can help this a lot.

One good thing about the 1178 is the gain available- it's a good stereo line amp. And when you really drive the output stage the VU lamps dim :twisted:

Mark

You can't use different ratios for the two channels either... like 4:1 for the kick drum and 12:1 for the snare...

Not that I hate the 1178, just that having a pair of 1176's and an 1178 next to each other, I know I'd much rather build a pair of 1176s than an 1178...

Keith

[quote author="SSLtech"]No. the 'real' sought-after 1176 (all the ones up to rev E IIRC) have in order of signal path: A constant-impedance variable attenuator, An input transformer, a resistor and a FET. The whole UREI premise was that it was basically impossible to overload the front end, since everything was totally passive.
[/quote]

Hey does the 1176 pcb that is sold around here have this thingamacig?

Also, are there any 1178 PCB's floating around? I know I have seen the schemos somewhere.

regards,
hej

Hejsan wrote:

Hey does the 1176 pcb that is sold around here have this thingamacig?

Also, are there any 1178 PCB's floating around? I know I have seen the schemos somewhere.

regards,
hej[/quote]

I think the GSSL around here sounds great. Haven't compared it to a real one though.... but there's some kind of mojo in it for shure