fet based mic pres or mixers

GroupDIY Audio Forum

Help Support GroupDIY Audio Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

versuviusx

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 12, 2004
Messages
227
Location
Wilmington,NC
hi
i was wondering if anyone could tell me why fet based mic pres are so cool. i'm trying to learn more about them. would love any opinions.
also does anyone know of some cool sleeper fet based mic pres or mixers. would love to audition some. thanks
 
[quote author="versuviusx"]hi
fet based mic pres are so cool. [/quote]

Where did you get that?
A FET mikeinputstage has the problem that it has a way higher OSI (optimum source impedance) than necessary for microphone input. This makes the noisebehaviour worse than with a BJT stage. So why should a designer start at the most important part of the preampdesign with a bad compromise?

BTW, I never heard of any famous FET mikepre´s. But correct me if I´m wrong, I´d love to learn about it.
 
It's just like guitar amps - there are crap valve amps, and great solid-state amps.... and vice versa.

The words "discrete" "classA" and "FET-based" are often marketing hype. That doesn't mean something is not good though....
 
[quote author="versuviusx"]hi
i was wondering if anyone could tell me why fet based mic pres are so cool. i'm trying to learn more about them. would love any opinions.
also does anyone know of some cool sleeper fet based mic pres or mixers. would love to audition some. thanks[/quote]

As others have noted FETs are better matched to high impedance applications. To deliver decent noise performance with a FET would require an input step up transformer which would likely dominate the sound character.

JR
 
Also, character of their input is capacitive so they work the best with capacitive sources of signal such as condensor microphones.
 
Don't blow the guy off completely. He should have referenced a particular design that demonstrates to him that FET pres are so cool, but I know of a few so....

If we take a look around (MicPreamp META) we have Tamas's FETBloak, GreatRiver MP-2, Hampton's JFP, Groner's JFET/IC hybrids, Forsell 992, and many FET-input opamp designs.

Mr Borbely has done nice things with them. Compromise is what a designer does. If he does it well...
http://www.groupdiy.com/index.php?topic=5984

BCarso provided some designs (I haven't seen other Fet inputs running on +/-15V which is handy):
http://www.groupdiy.com/index.php?topic=7934
 
[quote author="Wavebourn"]Also, character of their input is capacitive so they work the best with capacitive sources of signal such as condensor microphones.[/quote]

Bootstrap it, Baby!
 
Does not matter what kind of FET, either metal-dielectric-semiconductor, or metal-oxide-semiconductor, or reverse biased PN junction, anyway capacitive input impedance part is absolutely dominant. It is like a moisture during a rainy weather: it is not good, not bad, it IS THE FEATURE. So, use it properly, that's it.

Another story is transfer characteristic... FETs are good voltage controlled resistors. This particular feature may be used in compressors, for example, if to use FETs in controlled voltage dividers. In amplifiers the same feature gives high level of 2'nd order distortions. Again, it is the feature that may be used both for good or for bad.

I repeat, "it sounds cool when painted blue, sounds warm if painted red". As any device if to use with specific features in mind the result will be as desired.

[quote author="skipwave"][quote author="Wavebourn"]Also, character of their input is capacitive so they work the best with capacitive sources of signal such as condensor microphones.[/quote]

Bootstrap it, Baby![/quote]

How? :green:

WavebournMXL770Mod.gif
 
[quote author="Wavebourn"]Does not matter what kind of FET, either metal-dielectric-semiconductor, or metal-oxide-semiconductor, or reverse biased PN junction, anyway capacitive input impedance part is absolutely dominant. It is like a moisture during a rainy weather: it is not good, not bad, it IS THE FEATURE. So, use it properly, that's it.

Another story is transfer characteristic... FETs are good voltage controlled resistors. This particular feature may be used in compressors, for example, if to use FETs in controlled voltage dividers. In amplifiers the same feature gives high level of 2'nd order distortions. Again, it is the feature that may be used both for good or for bad.

I repeat, "it sounds cool when painted blue, sounds warm if painted red". As any device if to use with specific features in mind the result will be as desired.

[/quote]
A FET's channel conductance is responsive to a changing input voltage (Vg-s), unlike a bipolar transistor whose Collector current is a multiple of base-emitter current. Both devices have input capacitance, but in neither case does it characterize their behavior, perhaps for the FET it is a fair characterization of it's input impedance.

I can't comment on red/blue/green, but either FET or bipolar can sound good when properly applied.

JR

PS: the FET mic pre's linked to suggest use with step up transformer so I stand with my original observation.
 
[quote author="JohnRoberts"] perhaps for the FET it is a fair characterization of it's input impedance.
[/quote]

It is exactly what I meant.

[quote author="JohnRoberts"]

I can't comment on red/blue/green, but either FET or bipolar can sound good when properly applied.
[/quote]

Agree.

PS: the FET mic pre's linked to suggest use with step up transformer so I stand with my original observation.

If to speak of rack gear and transformers why not use vacuum tubes?
 
[quote author="Wavebourn"]

PS: the FET mic pre's linked to suggest use with step up transformer so I stand with my original observation.

If to speak of rack gear and transformers why not use vacuum tubes?[/quote]

I don't care to use transformers or tubes if I can deliver a quiet, linear path without them. So far I have managed OK.

JR

PS: I do use transformers for mains isolation in PS.
 
[quote author="JohnRoberts"]PS: the FET mic pre's linked to suggest use with step up transformer so I stand with my original observation.[/quote]

The Borbely can be used transformerless (diagram at the bottom of the following page):
http://www.borbelyaudio.com/eb103213.asp

However, this one appears to be an oddity, and for the most part JFET inputs are for those who accept (and even appreciate) a transformer.

I have to admit, I love transformers for all the wrong reasons. For me, they are basically a cop out from having to deal with more complex inputs requiring device matching and such. On the other hand, transformers have unique characters, which can be subtle or not. No mixdown black box can take the place of an input transformer that reacts desireably to the SM57's output transformer. Of course, this is starting down the road of using the recording apparatus as an extension of the musical instruments, interpreting their tonal signatures instead of faithful reproducing them. Whether or not you want to go there is up to you.
 
[quote author="JohnRoberts"]

I don't care to use transformers or tubes if I can deliver a quiet, linear path without them. So far I have managed OK.
[/quote]

Me too. But quite recently I rediscovered tubes and transformers for myself that I hesitated before. Shame on me. :cool:

PS: I do use transformers for mains isolation in PS.

I use twice more, feeding tube mic pres by 12.6V AC. :green:
 
Back
Top