Golden Age Project Pre 73?

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zachs

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 6, 2007
Messages
251
Location
Salt Lake, UT
Anyone know anything about these pres? They seem to be some low-ish grade 73 type pre. Insides don't look too bad, maybe with some better trafos and some other swaps these might be really good? Not really sure just thought I'd see if anyone knew anything.

gap73front.jpg


gap73.jpg
 
loocking at the pics .same china manufacturer than the "chance" tnc acpm groupbuy.
with some changes.. tantalum and a 3 deck china gain switch external psu (wallwart i bet)
sourcing the in out line tx would maybe great if they are quality wise similar to the carnhill ones.......
price ideas http://www.mamut.net/goldenagemusic/shop/
the sweedish "designer" http://www.goldenagemusic.se/goldenageproject/uk/index.htm
hope it help
audioforge
 
Plus the off position on the gain switch [ which chance's needed ]
I was wondering how long it would take them  [ or someone ]
to make the corrections and sell it , should start seeing more of
them rolling out soon .
If the price was good enough to afford carhill upgrades then
it may really be a winner
 
Hi Guys, I received my GA73 about a week ago.  Since I have serviced several Neve 1073 modules and Neve consoles I was excited to open up the GA73 and have a look inside.

What I saw impressed me and I am sure it would also impress Rupert Neve himself with how closely the circuit follows the original drawings that I have from 1973 of the Neve 1073.

It also sounded really good out of the box and you would have to get up toward nearly $1200 a channel to get something that compares in sound and features I think.

The only difference I notice right off was that the GA73 used electrolytic coupling capacitors where Neve use tantalum but this would only increase the price about $15.  The tantalums are a little more accurate and generally considered more “HiFi” than electrolytics.

The heart of the Neve 1073 and a good part of the sound is derived from the 23 position gain switch which varies in 5db steps from -20db to -80db.  This switch just like the Neve has 3 sections that are controlled together.  The first section, adds 5db of attenuation to the -20/-25 and -30 positions after the mic transformer but before the first gain stage.  The second section increases the first gain stage in 5db steps of up to -50db.  Here the 3rd section is engaged after the OFF position and the second stage’s gain is increased from -55 to -80db.  This elegant gain staging maximizes the signal to noise and minimizes distortion.

This is the part of the circuit where other Neve clones usually fall short and use a pot and often a single gain stage yielding 65db of gain max.  The repeatability of the input gain settings in 5db steps is a marvelous feature when doing dialogue replacement and going from a “whisper to a scream” and back again.

Because there is no pre-transformer attenuation like API, the Tridents “A” range, “B” range, WBS M460/M470 and other discrete preamps from the 70’s.  The “sound” of the transformer is more prominent in the Neve “sound” especially from high SPL sources that drive in the input transformer hard.  A kick drum or snare drum can produce -10dbu at the input to the mic transformer on peaks.

I have included a picture of the stock GA73 transformer on the left, the Neve/St Ives in the middle and the Neve/St Ives with the case removed on the right.  The next two pictures compare the stock GA73 transformer laminations to the Neve/St Ives laminations.  When I measure the ratio of the stock transformer I get 1:2 in Hi Z and 1:4 in Low Z.  I also noticed the stock mic transformer was more susceptible to hum and noise interference than the St Ives.  The Neve /St Ives VT22670 has a ratio of 1:2.75 in Hi and 1:5.25 in Lo and the bi-metal laminations are much more sophisticated.

I concluded that changing the input transformer would make the biggest “improvement” to the sound signature.  When I replace the stock transformer with the VT22670 I noticed an extended clarity in the low end and in the lower midrange as this area seemed to punched through more like the Neve.  It was really evident on high level signals reaching the input transformer as the bigger transformer with its more sophisticated bi-metal laminations was able to handle the transients and low end better.

Tom at Cinemag makes an excellent shielded mic transformer for under $50 that would work well in the GA73 and be able to handle the full output level of microphones without any attenuation.  It was a bit of a squeeze to fit in the VT2260 and the Cinemag is slightly smaller.

The output circuit feeds 24 dc through the windings of the output transformer to the 2N3055 output transistor configured in a class “A” circuit.  Because class “A” output stages are not very efficient this transistor like in the Neve is mounted on a serious heat shink.  Feeding the power supply through the output transformer causes it to slowly “choke” a bit on very large transients when the output level is high.  This is another part of the Neve sound.  This output transformer has a ratio of 1:2 so it increases the output level 6db giving Neve its enviable headroom.  I am not sure if replacing this output transformer will make a noticeable difference to sound. The output transformer in my experience would not be a critical to the sound than the input transformer.  If any difference could be perceived it would be at very high SPL levels that would cause any A/D converter to sound horribly distorted.  The best of the A/D converters can only handle and input level of +23dbu before clipping distortion.  This transformer is a bit smaller than the original in a Neve but no smaller than those used in a API or MCI back in the discrete transformer coupled era.

Cheers, Dave Thomas
www.aamicrophones.com

 

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I bought mine in May. I had started recording an album a month ago. I had already recorded drums, bass and acoustic guitars. The acoustic guitars were recorded with a UA 610B. After some tests, I decided to record most of them again. It was that good. Actually, even with its "stock" chinese trafos I would choose the PRE-73 over many $1000-2000 preamps we have in the studio I work anyday, depending on the source. (although not all of them  :p )

Excellent performance for its price.  ;)
 
Thanks for a great read, Dave.

I am wondering if anyone has ever opened up a ch@meleon l@bs 7602, and if this would also be a viable 'pimpable' alternative (i.e. proper gain switching implemented, as described in Dave's post). I have just finished my first EZ1290 and could very much live without ever drilling 25mm XLR-holes into cases again, quite happy to have that done for me in china. :p

If I understand correctly, Carnhill is the 'new' st ives? or are these still made and sold (new) somewhere?
 
It's a bit of the threat but I pimped my CL 7602. Well 2 actually...
Swapped the transformers (to Carnhills), the transistor (to Motorola) and some electrolyitc caps (to tantalums).
If you want I can look up the info. It cost me something about €100 (per unit). The change in sound isn't huge, a bit more low-end, a nicer 'distortion' when overdriven... But now it's an 'expensive' Neve-clone instead of a 'cheap' Neve-clone.

I guess these mods would be the same for the Golden Age preamp because they only apply to the preamp, not the EQ.
 
@ briomusic

st'Ives/carnhill are the same thing  vtb9045=vt22670.

for ref:

http://www.vintagedesign.se/transformer_cross_table.htm

you can find them at audio maintenance in the UK (they have an online store)

cheers,

nhaudio
 
Hi Guys, I received my GA73 about a week ago. Since I have serviced several Neve 1073 modules and Neve consoles I was excited to open up the GA73 and have a look inside.

What I saw impressed me and I am sure it would also impress Rupert Neve himself with how closely the circuit follows the original drawings that I have from 1973 of the Neve 1073.

It also sounded really good out of the box and you would have to get up toward nearly $1200 a channel to get something that compares in sound and features I think.

The only difference I notice right off was that the GA73 used electrolytic coupling capacitors where Neve use tantalum but this would only increase the price about $15. The tantalums are a little more accurate and generally considered more “HiFi” than electrolytics.

The heart of the Neve 1073 and a good part of the sound is derived from the 23 position gain switch which varies in 5db steps from -20db to -80db. This switch just like the Neve has 3 sections that are controlled together. The first section, adds 5db of attenuation to the -20/-25 and -30 positions after the mic transformer but before the first gain stage. The second section increases the first gain stage in 5db steps of up to -50db. Here the 3rd section is engaged after the OFF position and the second stage’s gain is increased from -55 to -80db. This elegant gain staging maximizes the signal to noise and minimizes distortion.

This is the part of the circuit where other Neve clones usually fall short and use a pot and often a single gain stage yielding 65db of gain max. The repeatability of the input gain settings in 5db steps is a marvelous feature when doing dialogue replacement and going from a “whisper to a scream” and back again.

Because there is no pre-transformer attenuation like API, the Tridents “A” range, “B” range, WBS M460/M470 and other discrete preamps from the 70’s. The “sound” of the transformer is more prominent in the Neve “sound” especially from high SPL sources that drive in the input transformer hard. A kick drum or snare drum can produce -10dbu at the input to the mic transformer on peaks.

I have included a picture of the stock GA73 transformer on the left, the Neve/St Ives in the middle and the Neve/St Ives with the case removed on the right. The next two pictures compare the stock GA73 transformer laminations to the Neve/St Ives laminations. When I measure the ratio of the stock transformer I get 1:2 in Hi Z and 1:4 in Low Z. I also noticed the stock mic transformer was more susceptible to hum and noise interference than the St Ives. The Neve /St Ives VT22670 has a ratio of 1:2.75 in Hi and 1:5.25 in Lo and the bi-metal laminations are much more sophisticated.

I concluded that changing the input transformer would make the biggest “improvement” to the sound signature. When I replace the stock transformer with the VT22670 I noticed an extended clarity in the low end and in the lower midrange as this area seemed to punched through more like the Neve. It was really evident on high level signals reaching the input transformer as the bigger transformer with its more sophisticated bi-metal laminations was able to handle the transients and low end better.

Tom at Cinemag makes an excellent shielded mic transformer for under $50 that would work well in the GA73 and be able to handle the full output level of microphones without any attenuation. It was a bit of a squeeze to fit in the VT2260 and the Cinemag is slightly smaller.

The output circuit feeds 24 dc through the windings of the output transformer to the 2N3055 output transistor configured in a class “A” circuit. Because class “A” output stages are not very efficient this transistor like in the Neve is mounted on a serious heat shink. Feeding the power supply through the output transformer causes it to slowly “choke” a bit on very large transients when the output level is high. This is another part of the Neve sound. This output transformer has a ratio of 1:2 so it increases the output level 6db giving Neve its enviable headroom. I am not sure if replacing this output transformer will make a noticeable difference to sound. The output transformer in my experience would not be a critical to the sound than the input transformer. If any difference could be perceived it would be at very high SPL levels that would cause any A/D converter to sound horribly distorted. The best of the A/D converters can only handle and input level of +23dbu before clipping distortion. This transformer is a bit smaller than the original in a Neve but no smaller than those used in a API or MCI back in the discrete transformer coupled era.

Cheers, Dave Thomas
www.aamicrophones.com

Hi Dave!! I know this is an old thread and trying to revive it. I got a GAP Pre 73 Premiere that is giving me issues in the 2nd stage, that would be the 3rd on an actual Neve. This one has 1st stage from 20-50 and 2nd from 55-80. What's curious about it is that it doesn't distort until after 30 mins to an hour or use. After that it distorts to a very high fuzz level and volume drops very considerably. Another strange issue is that it only happens with the line/mic input. If I use the DI input in the front all works just fine. Hoping to get some insight from you and thanks before hand!

Cheers,
 
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