Need Piano Advice

[john12ax7]

Looking to buy a small or medium grand piano for home use,  5' and up. Main desire is good action and playability,  stays in tune,  budget up to 5k usd. For an intermediate player to practice and improve on.

Some older Yamahas fit the budget but I wonder about tuning pegs and general issues on a 50 year old piano that hasn't been refurbished.  Not familiar with too many brands outside of Yamaha and Kawai, so any makes and models advice appreciated.

 

[ubxf]

I have a Yamaha 9' from 1965 all original but maintained regularly and there are no issues except that it sounds darker because of the original strings

 

[abbey road d enfer]

I don't know the used piano market in the US, but I don't think $5k can get you one of the good brands (Kawai, Yamaha, Bechstein), but you may be lucky.
You may find a chinese one but I can't vouch for their durability.
It seems a Samick 5' could be a possibility. Construction (Korea) is quite good, but 5ft is quite small.

 

[john12ax7]

I have a Yamaha 9' from 1965 all original but maintained regularly and there are no issues except that it sounds darker because of the original strings

How often do you need to tune it? Some from the 1960s I've seen tune up ok but then are out a couple months later.

 

[john12ax7]

I don't know the used piano market in the US, but I don't think $5k can get you one of the good brands (Kawai, Yamaha, Bechstein), but you may be lucky.
You may find a chinese one but I can't vouch for their durability.
It seems a Samick 5' could be a possibility. Construction (Korea) is quite good, but 5ft is quite small.

5' is the starting point,  certainly can be bigger. Will look into Samick.

 

[ubxf]

How often do you need to tune it? Some from the 1960s I've seen tune up ok but then are out a couple months later.

I have it tuned before every major session but this past year it stayed in tune without being looked at

 

[abbey road d enfer]

How often do you need to tune it? Some from the 1960s I've seen tune up ok but then are out a couple months later.

Last time I had my Yamaha C7 tuned up, it had not been for 3 years*. The tuner recognized it had not moved much and that I could have dispensed with the tune-up. That's what I had thought but anyway it was an important session so I didn't want to take any risks and preferred not to use my own judgment.
My piano is in a room with well-controlled temperature and humidity.

*Not something I recommand. Good practice is once a year, and for professional use twice a year, once before summer, once before winter.

 

[Whoops]

Some from the 1960s I've seen tune up ok but then are out a couple months later.

Being out of tune in a few months is consistent with my experience with all Pianos I had contact with.

In the studio we had an Yamaha C7, the tuner was hired before each new session were the Piano was used.
Sometimes the Piano players would complain about the tuning in the 3 day of recording...

We had controlled temperature and humidity but I guess it's just a difficult instrument to be in tune

 

[abbey road d enfer]

Being out of tune in a few months is consistent with my experience with all Pianos I had contact with.

In the studio we had an Yamaha C7, the tuner was hired before each new session were the Piano was used.
Sometimes the Piano players would complain about the tuning in the 3 day of recording...

We had controlled temperature and humidity but I guess it's just a difficult instrument to be in tune

Funny how the same model can behave differently.

 

[Whoops]

Funny how the same model can behave differently.

Yes, probably there's other factors involved, I dont know

 

[ubxf]

I think for the tuning it all depends how precisely you look at it and also how the instrument is played . If you are extremely critical i believe that with any piano even after a few days it could be slightly out. A good piano tends to go flat fairly evenly and it stays in tune with itself so when you play it it sounds ok unless you have perfect pitch.

 

[McIrish]

Instead of a grand piano, have you ever thought of a Yamaha U3? It's a pretty big upright and with the lower panel off, I can get it to sound very close to a grand and it takes up a lot less space in the studio.

 

[abbey road d enfer]

Instead of a grand piano, have you ever thought of a Yamaha U3? It's a pretty big upright and with the lower panel off, I can get it to sound very close to a grand and it takes up a lot less space in the studio.

That's an option I've seen a couple of times.
The main problem is that it doesn't have the same wow factor as a grand. Most of the pianists don't own a grand, so they cherish the opportunity to play on one.

 

[fazer]

Piano pegs find a resting place so the more you keep them in tune the more they stay in tune.  At least that’s how it was explained to me.  I have owned a Yamaha C7 since 1981.  Keeping them tuned and for me that means before any recording session is just how it works.  My experience has been that most concert pianist have a tuner they prefer as well as a piano that they choose to play on.  The room it’s in is very important.  My previous hose had an 18 ft ceiling and very large open areas that help the sound of the piano.  I currently live in a house with 8’ ceiling and have my piano In Storage to be moved hopefully next month.  I kind of wish I could change over to an upright grand as already mentioned but plan to move it to my walkout basement studio.  The temperature will be stable but the sound will never be the same.  It will be ok for rock and roll.  Grand pianos have maintained prices to some degree but small uprights you can’t give away.  A 9foot Bechstein is the finest  piano I’ve ever recorded.  Players would fall in love with that sound.  It had such an inspirational sound and great action. 

 

[Matt Nolan]

Piano pegs find a resting place so the more you keep them in tune the more they stay in tune.  At least that’s how it was explained to me.

That sounds a little like piano tuners' maintaining their income talk to me. Strings do not maintain their properties indefinitely, so those pegs are not staying in the same place over time.

But, sure, regular tuning, tuning before a recording session or performance is absolutely a good idea.

I heard that a surprisingly strong influence on the sound of a concert grand is the sound of and the way it interacts with (primarily through the legs and wheels) the stage floor. Another important aspect of the room. Makes sense to me.

 

[user 37518]

+1 on the Kawai, relatively cheap and great sounding.

 

[Matador]

We purchased a used Steinway Model K upright, which measures at 52", which is about the same size as a baby grand.  With the lower panel off it's a pretty good sound (provided the room is treated).  It's a massive slab of flamed mahogany but was relatively inexpensive (about the same as a new Kawai).

 

[john12ax7]

Thanks to all who chimed in.

I had considered a Yamaha G5 but the condition was not great.  Then found a good deal on a C7, was way over budget and a bit too much for an apartment, would be worth the extra money if had a proper space for it.

I did end buying a piano and took delivery today.  It's a Howard by Baldwin made by Kawai. It's in good shape,  very reasonably priced,  way under the planned budget,  and plays nice.  Was a good fit for the situation.

About the only issue is dust inside on the soundboard.  Is there a preferred way to clean it,  or just take a dust cloth to it?

It could also use a tuning, is this something to DIY or don't bother and just hire someone?

 

[Matt Nolan]

It could also use a tuning, is this something to DIY or don't bother and just hire someone?

Unless you are well versed in the ins and outs of stretch tuning, I would hire someone

 

[abbey road d enfer]

About the only issue is dust inside on the soundboard.  Is there a preferred way to clean it,  or just take a dust cloth to it?

Pianos are very robust instruments. I use a pressurized air aerosol and a vacuum cleaner.

It could also use a tuning, is this something to DIY or don't bother and just hire someone?

I did it once, and will never do it again. Took me several days to get all the courses sounding right, and then I figured it just didn't play right. It was better than before, but still not good enough.