Neve Air Montserrat board schematics request ( pre and eq)

[pucho812]

Anyone  have schematics for the Neve Air desks. My understanding is it was the Last of the desks Neve made as Neve the company and the first of the desks to use IC's instead of discrete opamps. It also used toroidal transformers. So would be curious to see  them if anyone has a copy.

 

[ruffrecords]

I cannot help with the schematics but I can tell you Neve as Neve went well past 1977 when the Montserrat console was built. When I joined Neve, although it was still called Neve is was owned by the Bonochord group that also had interests in North Sea Oil, hearing aids and test equipment. Some years after I left they were acquired by Siemens but still called Neve. It wasn't until 1992 that Siemens merged Neve with another acquisition of theirs, AMS, to form AMS Neve.

Before I left in '76 the R&D dept had been evaluating ICs, particularly what is now the 5534, so the Montserrat may well have been one of the first to use them.

Cheers

Ian

 

[pucho812]

yes, true, I guess I was referring to the last rupert had a hand in

 

[RuudNL]

If I remember correctly, I once heard Mr. Rupert Neve say that IC's weren't noticeably worse than discrete Class A circuits! (5534)

 

[pucho812]

If I remember correctly, I once heard Mr. Rupert Neve say that IC's weren't noticeably worse than discrete Class A circuits! (5534)

they were actually tda134's which eventually turned into a 5534

 

[RuudNL]

1034

 

[ruffrecords]

yes, true, I guess I was referring to the last rupert had a hand in

That might well be true. When I joined, Rupert had already left as part of the Bonochord deal but he was kept on as a consultant for some years (I do not know how many). He still had a hand in some designs and of course he was a good friend of George Martin (I rememeber George visiting is his big Rolls Royce). The first time I met him was when he came in to discuss his design for the Compact Radio Console (CRC) with my boss. I was only in my twenties and I admit I was a little overawed to meet him.

Cheer

Ian

 

[Gold]

The 8068 used IC’s. That’s the one at the Power Station. They did okay with it.

 

[pucho812]

The 8068 used IC’s. That’s the one at the Power Station. They did okay with it.

I thought the 8068 was still discrete opamp designs

 

[Brian Roth]

I thought the 8068 was still discrete opamp designs

The 8068 from the Power Station ended up in Tulsa.  I installed it in 1991 and maintained it for approx. 20 years.

It was discrete circuitry with lots of transformers.

Bri

 

[Tekay]

The 31106 channels amps were full of TDA1034, output amps used TDA1034 together with a BC441/BC461 pair. VT24470 was used as input transformer and VT24467 as output transformer.
I believe Rupert used similare transformers in the Focusrite ISA110

 

[Brian Roth]

The 31106 channels amps were full of TDA1034, output amps used TDA1034 together with a BC441/BC461 pair. VT24470 was used as input transformer and VT24467 as output transformer.
I believe Rupert used similare transformers in the Focusrite ISA110

Were the 31106 channel amps the ones used in the Air desk?  So many Neve model numbers that I don't know....

Bri

 

[pucho812]

The 8068 from the Power Station ended up in Tulsa.  I installed it in 1991 and maintained it for approx. 20 years.

It was discrete circuitry with lots of transformers.

Bri

that's what I thought. I never had to tech a 8068.

From my understanding, the first venture with Rupert Neve and IC's was the air desks's which was his last venture's with Neve  the company.

 

[mjrippe]

From my understanding, the first venture with Rupert Neve and IC's was the air desks's which was his last venture's with Neve  the company.

Hmmm, cannot confirm or deny.  There are also the 53 series boards where some had 438/440 discrete amps, and others are fitted with the 638/640 which are chip based with output transistors on the 640.  Many modules (33114, 33115, 33415, etc) now have a mix and nobody here ever says one sounds better than the other.

FWIW, I heard that the 54 series were the first boards AFTER Rupert left and those are all IC based.

Ian, wasn't the CRC something of a mess?  I worked on one once and it was not very Neve-like.

 

[ruffrecords]

Hmmm, cannot confirm or deny.  There are also the 53 series boards where some had 438/440 discrete amps, and others are fitted with the 638/640 which are chip based with output transistors on the 640.  Many modules (33114, 33115, 33415, etc) now have a mix and nobody here ever says one sounds better than the other.

I am not sure.  When I joined in 74 , Rupert had already left. Most of the big custom consoles were BA283 etc but the 35mm modules with BA438/440 were also running alongside. I know for certain that at that time the R&D dept were evaluating the TDA1034. AFAIK Rupert had no input into that nor in the design of the 438/440.

Ian, wasn't the CRC something of a mess?  I worked on one once and it was not very Neve-like.

I don't know about a mess but it was an attempt at cost reduction. The totally enclosed modules went, and in their place were plug in cards with the controls mounted directly on them to minimise module wiring and there were steel slide in screens between modules. I think it was aimed at the US broadcast market. Although it was officially the Compact Radio Console it was often referred to internally as the Cheap Radio Console. I left before it was launched so I have no idea how well it did.

Cheers

Ian

 

[Gold]

The 8068 from the Power Station ended up in Tulsa.  I installed it in 1991 and maintained it for approx. 20 years.

The one from Studio A? AFAIK that was still there. It’s kind of hard to believe that would ever be replaced. I’m no Neve expert but I have always been told the 8068 was the last of the 80 series and had IC’s.

 

[Tekay]

Here's a pic of some 31106 channel strips.
https://www.facebook.com/subterraneansound/photos/a.1133112430121356/1974538872645370/

 

[Brian Roth]

The one from Studio A? AFAIK that was still there. It’s kind of hard to believe that would ever be replaced. I’m no Neve expert but I have always been told the 8068 was the last of the 80 series and had IC’s.

Paul, that 8068 install project was almost 30 years ago and my contact with it ended maybe 12 years ago when the Tulsa Church Studio shut down and the desk was sold to Bob Clearmountain.  Unfortunately, owner Steve Ripley passed away a couple of years ago, so I can't ask him for any clarifications.

All I recall was that desk was "sitting in storage" at the Power Station when Steve bought it.

I don't recall any IC opamps anywhere.  There a few things I do clearly recall, including the fact Neve field retrofitted it with some additional mechanical parts because of "frame sag" in the center of the desk.

Bri

 

[Gold]

Brian, After a little internet digging it looks like there were two versions of the amplifier cards in the 8068. A discrete and an IC version. I’ve always been told the one in Studio A had IC amps. I guess the one you looked after had the discrete versions.

 

[pucho812]

AFAIK the last of the 80 series was the 8078's.

But all of This leads me  asking " so at what point did Neve actually switch over to using ic's instead of discrete?"