People buying gear from you and then on selling

[deuce42]

For the sake of venting I will undulge myself here

I had an old tweed valve guitar amp that I used for a long time and loved, but lately I had accumulated too much stuff and wanted to offload items I didn't use so much. I wanted it to go to a good home and to somebody that appreciated it.

On wednesday evening I put the thing on Ebay for $400AUS which was dirt cheap but it had a few cosmetic bumps and scratches from its time on the road. I woke the next morning to find something like 15 questions about the thing from different punters. One person had clicked "buy it now" and another guy had sent me a message saying he would come and collect it straight away if I took it off ebay. I explained to the hopeful collector that unfortunately someone had just clicked "buy it now" and I was required to sell it to him.

What ensued was a vitriolic tirade of abuse at how I was morally obliged to sell to him because he contacted me first. I apologised over and over and said I was sorry but I couldn't do this. Feeling bad for him, I even offered to build a similar one for him for cheap.

Next up the guy who purchased the amp with "buy it now" came to colllect it yesterday. We spoke for ages about valves and components, he was really apprecaitive and we talked music for eternity. I felt very good that at least the recipient was a good guy, a family man who loved his telecasters and tweed amps and that he would cherish the amp. Made me feel less bad about the whole affair.

This morning the pissed off guy who missed out on the amp sends me a link to an Ebay listing. Guess what, my amp is now on Ebay for 3 times what I sold it for.

 

[rob_gould]

Definitely not on.

Neither the ranting non-buyer or the capitalist reseller did the right thing IMO.  

Karma will even things out in the end

A small point of note though - the buyer and reseller's actions, though not really a positive thing in muso circles, is just behaving in a way deemed to be perfectly acceptable in our current society - see an opportunity and take it.  Obnoxious for sure, but that's how people make money!

The other guy is actually 'in the wrong'.  If he's a regular ebay user he will know for sure that taking something off ebay and selling it outside their system when the buyer has seen the listing is flagrant abuse of their rules, and can actually result in the seller having their account closed (though I appreciate that this does in fact happen all the time).

 

[canidoit]

You placed the ad as buy it now, you have no rights to control whether he sells it afterward.

Seriously, would you be upset if you sold it for $1200 and the buyer decided to sell it on Ebay for $400 the next day? I have had times where I was in that situation, bought something and found out it was not what I needed and realized I paid too much for it and had trouble reselling it.

A mate of mine bought an unbuilt PCB kit for one of the builds placed here. PCB, with parts and case. The seller said to him, he didnt have time to build it and decided to sell the kit. He then tells my mate that he is not allowed to sell it for more and he has to build the kit. Hes like, WTF????

He bought the kit, and thought the guy was an Ass. He built it and found out bits and pieces were missing from the original kit which he had to source.

Sorry deuce, Im not feeling your vent. I actually have different opinions to your circumstance. I think if this guy manages to sell it for more, then let it be, you weren't willing to sell it for more and have the patience to see if you can get more, then why should you be upset at someone who wants to give it a try. If he couldn't get more and ends up selling it for less than what you sold it for, would you be happier?

 

[sodderboy]

It is part of the learning curve of ebay.  You get to understand why power seller "terms and conditions" are longer than the item listing!  I had similar listings on my way to "100".  I never use the buy it now for one, or a reserve price, because you never know how others value your listing.  I figure how I value something, and start the listing just below that and let it go with no reserve.  As far as dealing with the buying public, patience is a virtue.  You are the seller, so start working on YOUR terms and conditions.  I stopped dealing with Canadians after about #50 because they were odd- every Canadian winner acted like he was simply first in line to decide if he would buy the listing.  "Hey great!  I won.  I will email you in a day or so if I want it."
Look forward to your next sale.
Mike
PS: Hmmm.  Maybe it's time to clean-out the closet for me too. . .

 

[okgb]

Hmmm , gross generalization on Canadians ?
[ if you guys stop overtaxing our wood and
trying to steal our water , we'll let ya come up
and enjoy some of it , just worry about mexico ]

To avoid some hassle , i normally  [ haven't bothered
much lately with fleebay ]  simply list any item for the minimum
i'd be o.k. with , if it only gets one bid ,
If whatever value that people feel it's worth to them drives
the price up, no problem .

Second guy was just mad he missed the chance to profit

Of course sometimes it works with friends to give em the
sell it back to me for the same price if you're getting rid of it deal
[ sometimes lose friends or find out they never were ]

It's be nice if there was a little more upfrontness when it comes to our
grp  [ and less of the slide it through ebay mentality ]
But it is harder to trust people on ebay , no matter how well they act
it's like one needs to develop a policy before dealing and stick to it
if you've thought it through .
I wish i'd have held onto things a little longer to profit more , but
was plenty happy to make money when i did even if i see it resold
later ,

Anyone traveling this way open invitation to stop in
[ Manitoba is just north of North Dakota in the U.S. ]

 

[Biasrocks]

Bummer about the tweed amp mate, that would really tweak my nose.

Perhaps you should sell to someone close by next time and explain to them what your reasons are for selling it to them.

I stopped dealing with Canadians after about #50 because they were odd- every Canadian winner acted like he was simply first in line to decide if he would buy the listing.  "Hey great!  I won.  I will email you in a day or so if I want it."

Wow nice swipe, certainly not this Canadian! Of course, I'm sure no one else does those sorts of things.  :

If you purchase it, it's yours just like the rules say. It's not that I haven't regretted it in some cases.

I've had great dealings with many people on this board, no matter where they're from.

All in all a very generous community.

Mark

 

[deuce42]

My experience of Canadians is always good.

As for this experience, Bias rocks is right I guess-  in that I should have probably sold locally making it clear that I wanted it to go to a good home.

But just for the sake of clarity,I feel some may have missed the reason for my dissapointment. I am not concerned about not selling for enough money or not understanding Ebay rules.  I was perfectly happy to sell it for what I put it up for and thats all I wanted. I am more just dissapointed at human behaviour that sees a buck out of an "opportunity". I realise you cant dicate what somebody does with an item once you have sold it. Its their property now, but its dissapointing to sell an amp to sombody on Ebay who only buys it to put it back on ebay the very next day for triple its price.

I agree with Rob Gould that we live in a world where taking such a business opportunity is accepted as shrewed and intelligent. In fact there are clearly people on this board that disagree and see no problems with taking these opportunities. We are all entitled to our opinions and to see life as we wish.  I can only speak from my perspective and for me I prefer to maintain my own standard of integrity even if that means I wont always be rich. And that is, at its very essence my only issue. I really would have liked the amp to go to someone who wanted it and that is why I decided to sell it at a cheap rate. Perhaps I am just naive, but if so I am perfectly prepared to diligently remain naive for as long as I can - because parting with a nice peice of gear to someone who will make good use of it is a really nice experience, And I believe that passing on of gear is one of the positive things musicians often share with each other. Not everything to do with gear is about monetary value. Well at least some musicians.

 

[sahib]

For the first part. It does not make any difference if somebody contacted you first. If the other guy pressed the buy now button you are obliged to sell it to him.  I had a similar situation here on the black market. Most unfortunately I offered it to the second person by mistake and he paid immediately. The first person was not happy and we had a bit of a difficult time. But because the second person already paid I had to honour his purchase. It was not his fault but mine.

On the second part.  Once he bought it from you it is his. If he sells it for even ten times more than what he paid to you, then good on him. You can not legally restrict him, and morally there is nothing wrong either. This is business.

I won't mention a name but some years ago my wife comissioned a very famous artist. I remember at that time he complained that his paintings were changing hands for over millions of pounds after he sold them. That's just the nature of the business.

 

[pucho812]

Ebay rules are buy it now is automatic first place on a bid. Ao whoever did the buy it now wins regardless of whoever contacted u first. Then what they do with said item is up to them.

 

[canidoit]

Deuce, why don't you look at it this way. You made this guy happy when you sold it to him and if he sells it, he will make the other guy happy. That unit will eventually go to a good home. It's just that you have no idea who could that be.

 

[MagnetoSound]

You sold it too cheap. End of story. The rest (on all sides) is just whingeing.

 

[sodderboy]

Too bad I never dealt with you dudes.  Every studio guy up north that I dealt with was a wierdo.  Nothing personal; I was giving an example of terms and conditions based on personal experience.
MIke

 

[Butterylicious]

I have a friend who sold a Fender Mustang on fleaBay.  It didn't sell for as much as he had hoped it would since it was from the 60's and it was an uncommon color of blue for that era.  None the less, he packed and shipped it off.  The buyer disassembled said guitar and flipped the pieces back on fleaBay.  The neck alone sold for more than the original buying price.  That kinda made us sad.  It wasn't that it got resold, it was the fact that it was worth more as parts than a complete guitar.

 

[Mbira]

You put an amp up on Ebay with buy it now, and it sold within a day.  Congrats!

All the rest is drama you can choose to be a part of or not.

 

[wtmnmf]

You put an amp up on Ebay with buy it now, and it sold within a day.  Congrats!

All the rest is drama you can choose to be a part of or not.

Yup.


The guy that asked you to do the deal outside of eBay was asking you to do something in violation of both of your user agreements and had you done it, it could have got you banned.  If you're really pissed at that guy, just copy eBay the emails he sent you.  I think I'd just adopt the philosophical position proffered above. 

 

[livingnote]

Yah there's no blaming people for taking advantage of the fact that you screw yourself, eh?

It's part of the thing...humans are like when they go to an apple tree, it's there, and they take it.

There was this funny story about when (I think it was US Steel) got sold - they were on a boat,
and the guy selling was told to write a number on a piece of paper and hand it over, and he did.
Pretty serious number with a lot of zeroes...the buyer accepted.

Now the guy who had sold said "I should have added another zero", and the guy who bought said
"I woulda paid that gladly".

But teaches one to appreciate one's own work, eh? My Neumann once cost 500'000 DM, and
it was manual labor quality that made it so costly. Kinda puts DIY in a different light altogether
re value.

I had a guy here too once, wanted me to do everything free, and I was gullible enough to help
him a-z. Just saying "I can't do this anymore" was enough for him to bombard me with hate mail.

Guys like that? "Fuck you", delete.

 

[emrr]

I know vast numbers of people who make their living flipping ebay purchases for higher money.  It's different terrain, but similar to buying wholesale and selling retail.  If you price wholesale, or bids only make wholesale, then that's what you get.  Knowledge is power, and people specialize in particular knowledge so as to make a living. 

People who make a living this way have to part things out many times, unfortunately.  Long ago I parted out a Fender amp head as an experiment in buyer behavior.  At the time (1998?), market value was around $200.  As a parts pile, it brought about $700.  Guess what; one guy bought most of it, with the intention of putting it back together.  The same week, he had his choice of identical complete and working amps for around $200.  You can't really explain these things, but understanding these habits makes a lot of people a living. 

We can't always know what something should sell for, and the time invested may be more than it is worth.  You want it gone?  It's gone.  It's hard not to be precious about things you owned, but you have to let them go completely.  If you're not sure, price an item crazy high and see what sort of real offers surface via dialog.  The sore looser is definitely a taunter, and should get a life.    Sorry you had to deal with him. 

 

[okgb]

I think what galled the op was the fellow coming down
and appearing sympathetic and like him , but almost lying
with a happy face

My kids would want to have a yard or garage sale ,
but i couldn't put up with people offering me  10 cents
when i was only asking a quarter
If i'm going to give something away [ or take a loss ]
I'd rather give it to the salvation army thrift shop where
it will help someone
If you have Value village store where you live , they Use the diabetes
association to get donations [ via the public thinking they are doing good ]
they give them something of course but seem to be doing good business
marking the junk up .

Sometimes i'd rather throw it away than sell it to certain types
at least with the craigs list and Kijiji you can keep it local

 

[emrr]

I think what galled the op was the fellow coming down
and appearing sympathetic and like him , but almost lying
with a happy face

Yep, forgot to address that.  Seems to come with the territory.  Doesn't have to, but sharks get excited and some people don't know when to shut up.  The flip side is the guy who seems very skeptical, and tries to get the price even lower, then does the same thing.  That, and everything in between the two.