Post edit - Tree Audio op-amps available to customers only

[hissandhum]

Just an update for anyone wondering about this, and to the moderator of this message board.

After some confusion, and doing what I should have done originally - speaking directly with Ian - Inward/Tree do in fact supply the SPA690 op-amps but only to customers that own products that already contain the proprietary SPA690s - which is great news.

I jumped the gun there after reading this information on this message board:

http://groupdiy.com/index.php?topic=37929.0

Specifically this part of it which was an email from Ian:

'The SPA690 is an all discrete amp block designed by legendary audio designer John Hall. These are proprietary and Inward does not sell these. We also use cinemag transformers.

-Ian Gardiner
Boutique Audio’

My mistake.

Just to clarify, they are available for a very reasonable replacement cost to existing customers. I read that and thought that was that, no dice, and was seeking to make sure I had replacement parts for my desk. I wasn't ever going to try to reverse engineer them for any other reason than to solve a problem that never actually existed! Besides, I'm told that it's folly to even try to reverse-engineer them due to the packaging of the blocks.

Without knowing the ethics of it all, it appears I have been naively wanting to reverse engineer them. For those who don't know, like I didn't, this is akin to audio sacrilege. Just like copying an indie band's record that need the money they earned by dubbing them at half speed cassettes from 180g 'audiophile' vinyl. Just not cool, as someone said below.

Sorry for any confusion on my behalf.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfwN0X8YnWo

Regards,
Lawrence.

As I'm sure you're all aware, companies close some day and the cost of their parts skyrockets. Just look at the VF14.

 

[PRR]

> I searched beforehand

http://groupdiy.com/index.php?topic=37929.0  ??

Transformers don't die for decades. Well-made modular op-amps should last longer. Personally I would not be paranoid. But if you feel un-supported, send it back or sell it.

 

[emrr]

I'm sure they sell parts on an as-needed basis, as does/did API.  Maybe they only repair themselves.  There may be good quality control reasons for this, it's not uncommon.  What's their turnaround time?  Is that really  problem?  Those are the questions I'd ask myself. 

 

[gridcurrent]

But the madness that is the unavailability of the SPA690 op amp, is to me at least, completely absurd. I don't care why that is, I've accepted it - and understand that Tree Audio don't want anyone copying it, but I think it's frustrating to sell something and not offer the op-amps to purchase should you require them. If I've been informed correctly, they are an essential tonal point in the circuit and using a different op-amp could effect the coherency of the channels when running them in stereo, panned hard and left.

So, my question is - because the SPA690's are unavailable to buy - could they be reverse engineered from the ones I already have? Is it too risky to take one apart?

Mr. Firlotte has a lot invested in his discrete operational amplifier.  It was allegedly designed by or with Mr. John Hall.  In my opinion, it would be very un-cool to reverse engineer even if for your own use.

There are many discrete op-amps available that would work just fine in your application, and available here in the Forum's marketplace.  As good as the Tree thingy is, think about the zillion great sounding recordings done with the various renditions of the 2520.

Buy a few 2520's or whatever clones as spares.

 

[pucho812]

Well where do I start on this, I know all the guys at tree audio on a personal and professional level. I can assure you have nothing to worry about on your product purchase and should you require any servicing, they will gladly handle it.

I looked at your list of concerns and most of them are unnecessary. Unless there was a manufacturing issue, your transformers will last you well beyond the life of you owning the product.  I can't speak for the opamps but having first hand experience with them,  I can tell you they will last you and if there is any issue, tree will replace it.  I would say about the only thing you need to worry about is tube life but tubes can last you long while depending on use, but I wouldn't worry so much. Enjoy your purchase and go create music. Tree has you covered on the support side even if it is only a two man shop.

 

[hissandhum]

Just an update for anyone wondering about this, and to the moderator of this message board.

After some confusion, and doing what I should have done originally - speaking directly with Ian - Inward/Tree do in fact supply the SPA690 op-amps but only to customers that own products that already contain the proprietary SPA690s - which is great news.

I jumped the gun there after reading this information on this message board:

http://groupdiy.com/index.php?topic=37929.0

Specifically this part of it which was an email from Ian:

'The SPA690 is an all discrete amp block designed by legendary audio designer John Hall. These are proprietary and Inward does not sell these. We also use cinemag transformers.

-Ian Gardiner
Boutique Audio’

My mistake.

Just to clarify, they are available for a very reasonable replacement cost to existing customers. I read that and thought that was that, no dice, and was seeking to make sure I had replacement parts for my desk. I wasn't ever going to try to reverse engineer them for any other reason than to solve a problem that never actually existed! Besides, I'm told that it's folly to even try to reverse-engineer them due to the packaging of the blocks.

Without knowing the ethics of it all, it appears I have been naively wanting to reverse engineer them. For those who don't know, like I didn't, this is akin to audio sacrilege. Just like copying an indie band's record that need the money they earned by dubbing them at half speed cassettes from 180g 'audiophile' vinyl. Just not cool, as someone said below.

Sorry for any confusion on my behalf.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfwN0X8YnWo

Regards,
Lawrence.

As I'm sure you're all aware, companies close some day and the cost of their parts skyrockets. Just look at the VF14.

 

[hissandhum]

Well where do I start on this, I know all the guys at tree audio on a personal and professional level. I can assure you have nothing to worry about on your product purchase and should you require any servicing, they will gladly handle it.

I looked at your list of concerns and most of them are unnecessary. Unless there was a manufacturing issue, your transformers will last you well beyond the life of you owning the product.  I can't speak for the opamps but having first hand experience with them,  I can tell you they will last you and if there is any issue, tree will replace it.  I would say about the only thing you need to worry about is tube life but tubes can last you long while depending on use, but I wouldn't worry so much. Enjoy your purchase and go create music. Tree has you covered on the support side even if it is only a two man shop

Hi, please read the modified post, and an explanation for my post.

You're totally right about Tree Audio and the guys there. That's why I've gone to great length to rectify this post.

But, no one - and I mean no one at all - can guarantee anything will last forever! Reliable isn't infallible, and things change, right?

Dramatic example, but I bet the people that bought spare VF14's and whatever else could be bought, were told not to worry about the life or availability of their microphone's parts, and they're glad they ignored that advice and made sure they had stock. The Tree Stuff is that great that DO want to be making music on it for the next 50 years if time permits me to.

Reading that email got me thinking 'Oh dear, best figure this one out'.  Geddit? There's no malice at all there.

But you