Superlux S502 MK2 test, teardown and improvements

[jean-luc brion]

"Then subtract the resulting omni signal from both prefiltered ORTF signals."
Why subtract?

 

[Emmathom]

Hello everybody, I'm an unlucky owner of a S502MKII from 2020 with uber high sensitivity to radio magnetic interferences (see spectrum capture attached). I also own a S502MKI wich doesn’t have this problem. My setup is clean, simply switching from the MkI to MkII brings the interferences. I can manage to lower/avoid those interference on the MkII by adjusting mic placement and recorder position relative to mic, but it remains unusable for me.

@MicUlli I would be interested in 2 boards, do you think the new boards would solve the interferences issue on MkII?

That's exactly what I read on Thomann customers' reviews... interferences with MkII and none with MkI... But I guess it comes from the circuitry, not the capsules, so @MicUlli 's board should solve that

 

[bremusound]

Thread pitch = 0.5mm ! Thread outer diameter = 19.3mm
Finally managed to measure it today…

 

[Emmathom]

Thread pitch = 0.5mm !
Finally managed to measure it today…

Which body ? MkI or MkII ?

 

[bremusound]

Which body ? MkI or MkII ?

MK II

 

[Barry Farmer]

You've just bought a mic for around £140, which compares favourably with the Schoeps $2500 item. You now wish to spend the Lord knows how much cash to convert your mic into something it never was. Just get on and record something and enjoy the mic for what it is - a very useful, very cheap mic. (Or start your own microphone company, if that's what you'd rather do!)

 

[k brown]

Hi,
i want to draw your attention towards a trick. ORTF recordings with cardioid capsules sometimes have a lack of low frequencies. This is a drawback if you want to record for example choir+organ. For the S502 MKII it was tested and proven to work well.
Simply add an omni mic (well known for deep bass response) to your setup, place it in the mid of the ORTF capsules. Then do a mix in your DAW:
Apply a 1st order highpass @ 70Hz to both ORTF signals AND a 2nd order lowpass @ 70Hz with Q=0,5 to the omni signal. Then subtract the resulting omni signal from both prefiltered ORTF signals. The resulting omni signal must be adjusted carefully of course. Then you get the "space" from ORTF combined with the "depth" of the omni..
BR MicUlli

I never understood the point of this.

Most good SDC cards are only down about 3dB at 50Hz; easily EQ'd.

 

[jean-luc brion]

I never understood the point of this.

Most good SDC cards are only down about 3dB at 50Hz; easily EQ'd.

I rather like the idea, but I don't understand why we have to subtract...
we remove the bass from the cardioid, why don't we add the bass from the omni..?
Hein pourquoi ?
Vais je dormir cette nuit ?

 

[MicUlli]

I never understood the point of this.

Most good SDC cards are only down about 3dB at 50Hz; easily EQ'd.

Of course it can be done. But you also amplify wind noise and mechanical shocks. Omnis are a lot better in this aspect..

 

[MicUlli]

I rather like the idea, but I don't understand why we have to subtract...
we remove the bass from the cardioid, why don't we add the bass from the omni..?
Hein pourquoi ?
Vais je dormir cette nuit ?

This is filter theory. If you add a 2nd order highpass and a 2nd order lowpass the resulting signal has a notch at the crossover frequency. If you invert one of the filtered signals the resulting frequency response is constant..

 

[jean-luc brion]

Yes
Je vais pouvoir dormir cette nuit
Merci

 

[kingkorg]

Of course it can be done. But you also amplify wind noise and mechanical shocks. Omnis are a lot better in this aspect..

Wtf? And the capsule itself being more sensitive downthere won't pick that junk as well? Being omni helps? You just have to win every single argument no matter what, don't you?

I never understood the point of this.

Most good SDC cards are only down about 3dB at 50Hz; easily EQ'd.

You are 100% right! Only difference is omnis in general have the capability of going all the way down to 1hz. But that’s not the point here.

 

[kingkorg]

You've just bought a mic for around £140, which compares favourably with the Schoeps $2500 item. You now wish to spend the Lord knows how much cash to convert your mic into something it never was. Just get on and record something and enjoy the mic for what it is - a very useful, very cheap mic. (Or start your own microphone company, if that's what you'd rather do!)

If you present huge amount of irrelevant and meaningless data, most people seem to stop questioning you. Even if the data is wrong.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gish_gallop

 

[MicUlli]

Wtf? And the capsule itself being more sensitive downthere won't pick that junk as well? Being omni helps? You just have to win every single argument no matter what, don't you?

You are 100% right! Only difference is omnis in general have the capability of going all the way down to 1hz. But that’s not the point here.

Ah, kingkorg is back
And yes, he comments my arguments as usual. Here a picture from DPA. Interpretation is not that difficult

 

[kingkorg]

Ah, kingkorg is back
And yes, he comments my arguments as usual. Here a picture from DPA. Interpretation is not that difficult

Last time i followed your advice was when i bought into the story that SB acoustics driver is flat, confirmed by your measurement... Fortunately i managed to return the items and not lose any money.

Cherry picked data by dudes like you is what keeps me coming back.

In response to your DPA picture, and much of the data posted by you.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_sense

To anyone else, sceptical in mind, the posted graph doesn't say basically anything about the testing conditions, nature of the microphones besides rough pattern description. What wind are we even talking about?!?!?!? Back to gish galloping...

 

[k brown]

Ah, kingkorg is back
And yes, he comments my arguments as usual. Here a picture from DPA. Interpretation is not that difficult

I didn't see anyone denying that omnis are more wind resistant than cards (incidentally, the most inherently wind-resistent of all are PZMs [but not BLMs]).

Anyone doing nature/outdoor recordings will have their mics in a blimp/zepp/'dead cat', etc., so the point is a bit moot.

________

But, I think we've derailed this thread enough . . .

 

[Rossi]

It is a well known fact that pressure transducers are less sensitive to wind noise. Just google "omnidirectional microphone wind noise"

The (German) caption of Ulli's image precisely specifies the wind at 10 m/s. The more reputable manufacturers usually have a wind machine in their labs for tests and measurements like the ones shown in the above post.

 

[kingkorg]

It is a well known fact that pressure transducers are less sensitive to wind noise. Just google "omnidirectional microphone wind noise"

The (German) caption of Ulli's image precisely specifies the wind at 10 m/s. The more reputable manufacturers usually have a wind machine in their labs for tests and measurements like the ones shown in the above post.

The only thing that comes up is that DPA paper. The two microphones are different in many aspects, the capsule diameter as well. They are both end address which doesn't help prove anything.

It claims that omni is besides being less sensitive at very low frequencies from the rear also somehow less sensitive at 100Hz and can somehow tell what is wind and what is regular sound coming from the rear. And also by over 30db!!! I don't have to explain at least to you what 30db is, and that the test is flaud in this regard. Besides, this is not the point of the paper at all.

The OP's claim is that somehow omni knows how to intelligently reject mechanical shocks! And that you boost the noise along with shock noise if you boost the cardioid, which is true, but somehow omnis are better in this regard?

The only difference that matters in those graphs is that the wind noise difference between 0° and 180° is roughly the same in both mics. They havent plotted reference signal (whatever sort of audio) coming from 0° in order to prove their point. We are not recording the wind, but some kind of audio the wind is interfering with.