Waves making wavez...

[iomegaman]

Probably not a big blip on folks radar here since I think the majority are mostly analog...but Waves has managed to create quite a kerfuffle with going strictly to subscription only...

My first Waves purchase was in 2000 from Banjo Center came in a shiny black box with manual and disk, it was "The Renaissance Collection" it cost me $399 and was non-returnable...I went home and loaded into my Win2K machine and started up Cakewalk and tried to insert a plugin to get started...immediate BSOD...this was back when they were with PACE and used a challenge/response authorisation...

For 2 weeks I was on the phone with Pace/Cakewalk/and Waves...in the end the president of Pace sent me a mug for my troubles...never did get it to work without crashing my computer...seems AMD at the time did not play well with PACE...my loss and Banjo Center would not accept open software...

Believe it or not 2 years ago I was cleaning out some boxes and found my registration and notes from 2000...

I emailed Waves and explained the situation...they activated my Ren Collection and for $14 let me upgrade the whole thing to the latest version, then I asked to transfer it to my newer email account and they gladly did so...I was impressed and a 20 year old purchase came back to life for me...

Still love the Renaissance Collection...and honestly in the last few years have rejoined the Waves bandwagon after swearing them off in 2000...they teased me back with all those $29 specials or bundles at reduced cost...I own the Ren/Studio/Abbey/Platinuim collections and a handful of odd ones...


I was honestly surprised that they honored 20 year old software and for a few bucks promised to get me the latest version on my MAC computers...(I have since stopped building my own PC's and buy Steve Jobs appliance, the transition was made by building my own 2012 Mac Tower but that was the last computer I will probably build).

Anyway, I know Waves is pretty big in the LIVE SOUND market and I've built a Waves DIY server vai guys here suggestions and it works nice but I don't really need it...

But this seems a bit "shoot yer self in the ass" by eliminating the WUP that everyone complained about...

I never really saw WUP as the enemy, just the cost of doing business with modern software and computers, and truthfully I never upgraded plugins I didn't use...

But some of the classics (Abbey Roads/Schoeps Omni/Studio Classics/etc) I always kept up to date...

I hate fiddling with plugins and a mouse...so the Waves stuff was quick and dirty (or clean) depending on need.

But it seems the days of being able to update are over...they have basically said "Whatever version you have now is the end of the road for our support, for anything else you need to subscribe"...

Its not really the subscription thing that bothers me...thats temporary economic model in the industry that already has a sell by date...

The tragedy here is a company that at one time seemed to care about its base has basically said "C-Ya" unless you subscribe...

I loathe subscriptions...fought tooth and nail to keep my ProTools current WITHOUT sending them money every month...

I guess version 14 is where I get off this ride.

 

[AnalogPackrat]

I hate that business model, be it software or cars or tractors (John Deere and their battle to "own" right to repair after selling equipment) or anything else except true services like phone, internet, gas, electricity, insurance, etc. The end user gets screwed in manifold ways.

 

[fazer]

I agree Iomegaman. Personally I stop using waves ages ago. The subscription thing is over for me to.

 

[pucho812]

I think the big issue is that there was zero advanced warning combined with no other available options.
If you didn’t upgrade your perpetual you can’t now.
Subscription only gets pricy in the long run if you do it for everything.

 

[iomegaman]

I think the big issue is that there was zero advanced warning combined with no other available options.
If you didn’t upgrade your perpetual you can’t now.
Subscription only gets pricy in the long run if you do it for everything.

Yeah I think its the way they burned us users who have been paying WUP to keep the plugins we use functioning on newer systems...they also basically eliminated having more than one license on ANY machine without paying full pop for it...I JUST moved all of my main Waves plugins to my new M2 MBP, from my Mac Mini M1...because I am transitioning to a newer machine with more ram...but its supposed to be a slow cautious process so I don't break any projects...Waves basically made this scary as hell.

 

[pucho812]

Yeah I think its the way they burned us users who have been paying WUP to keep the plugins we use functioning on newer systems...they also basically eliminated having more than one license on ANY machine without paying full pop for it...I JUST moved all of my main Waves plugins to my new M2 MBP, from my Mac Mini M1...because I am transitioning to a newer machine with more ram...but its supposed to be a slow cautious process so I don't break any projects...Waves basically made this scary as hell.

Yup

 

[analag]

I WUPed my collection which is like 90% of their catalog last year. I did it to bring them all together, meaning making it all V14. The idea of subscription is for suckers in my line of thought. I'm not even going to get into the middle eastern like mayhem mentality they pulled on us customers who spent money on perpetual licenses.

 

[iomegaman]

All of the Waves plugins I use are v.14...there are some verbs and a few odd ball plugins I never got the hang of that I didn't update...I think I need to create an offline installer for everything and tuck it away somewhere safer than Waves...also need to update and install Soundgrid plugin in spite of not using it much just to make sure I have it if I do need it...no telling what happens next...

I suspect they pretend like everything is fine and dandy until the bleeding becomes obvious...SVB bleed out rather quickly and they were a damn bank.

 

[fazer]

I think the big issue is that there was zero advanced warning

I saw one YouTube that said if waves reconsiders this they can say it is an April Fools Joke.

Avid wanted the subscription model but allowed the perpetual to continue for another year. I’ve been using a cheese grater Mac and holding out for a Mac studio M processor support. Not sure which way to go. Been using the same computer since 2013. I doubt I’ll get 15 years out of whatever comes next.

 

[fazer]

This just in. Waves is bring back the perpetual license. Just got the email.

 

[boji]

It's the trend. I've noticed when the product attracts a younger demographic (Spotify), or deals in government contracts (Office365) the rent-seekers tend to win.

 

[iomegaman]

I saw one YouTube that said if waves reconsiders this they can say it is an April Fools Joke.

Avid wanted the subscription model but allowed the perpetual to continue for another year. I’ve been using a cheese grater Mac and holding out for a Mac studio M processor support. Not sure which way to go. Been using the same computer since 2013. I doubt I’ll get 15 years out of whatever comes next.

I built a 2012 MP and used DosDude1 hack to load it up to Catalina I think...it has 64 gigs of ram and I installed a TitanRidge Thunderbolt card that I flashed to add Thunderbolt...the whole system was pretty darn stable...


When the mac Mini M1's came out i bought the cheapest entry level at around $600...8 gigs of ram 256 hard drive...it outperformed the 2012 MP by about 20%


I recently went with a MBP 14" M2 with 16 gigs of Ram...its another 20% from the mac mini M1...
I do use a few NVMe USB-3 drives because I'm not interested in paying Apple extortion prices for hard drive space...

Other than that the machine is flawless...running huge projects onto a big TV screen and using a Razor hub for additional Thunderbolt/USB ports...

Ventura latest, ProTools 2023.3 (now ARM silicone) about 20% of my plugins don't work yet but I have too many anyway...

I was kinda impressed with how well the M2 performs and operates...boot time it about as long as it takes to put sugar in your coffee...

I'm in the same boat with Avid my perpetual update plan ends this year in Dec. but I will not be going subscription with them...if they force it I'm done.

Hopefully the industry is paying attention to this Waves fiasco...

You can sell subscriptions, just don't kill of outright ownership of perpetual (which of course is an illusion anyway, but we WANT our illusion)

 

[pucho812]

This just in. Waves is bring back the perpetual license. Just got the email.

Yes. I admit I thought they did this on purpose. Scare people into an upgrade.
However this does give me an idea for hardware

 

[iomegaman]

Yes. I admit I thought they did this on purpose. Scare people into an upgrade.
However this does give me an idea for hardware

I initially assumed it was some clever marketing switch and bait, however Occam's Razor here, I think it was just the monkey-ups listening to hired consultants who believed they were the first ever to invent subscriptions...

The reason I think this is because the Waves website is a clusterfig right now...you have to go in loops to even find the Waves Update information and it STILL says the only option is subscription...

If it were 3d chess they would have been ready day one to plug things back in...this feels like a webpage re-write by code monkeys trying to save stuff they trash-canned...

 

[pucho812]

Anything is possible.
Funny how in large markets like l.a., NYC there are rental companies where you literally subscribe and have gear delivered for a limited rental time and for fee. I guess subscription based hardware is o.k.?

 

[AnalogPackrat]

Anything is possible.
Funny how in large markets like l.a., NYC there are rental companies where you literally subscribe and have gear delivered for a limited rental time and for fee. I guess subscription based hardware is o.k.?

Because there's no monopoly on 1176, LA-2A, etc. People can buy or make and own them while the rental companies and their clients do their thing.

 

[iomegaman]

I think the hardware rental market might be a bit different, especially if you are gigging for some client that has a budget...there are some pieces of gear I do not own that I would LIKE to rent but the Tucson market is hardly a dot on the music industry map...
In those cases Access Analog is probably right for the price.

No one really reads the Eula's we're probably renting software as it is we just don't notice it.