That is an overly generalization and I totally disagree.
And for sure for you to state that then you don't know all the plugins I know or you never used all the outboard gear I've used over the years, or you have something against software and computers.
There's many plugins, there's many hardware units, in plugins as in hardware there's bad units, good units and great units, so I find that over generalization about "all" plugins completely wrong.
There's many plugin emulations, some of them are actually not that good (Waves emulations for example), but there's some brands and specific plugin emulations that are simply amazing, there's also many many plugin units that are not emulations and don't exist in hardware.
Personally in my professional experience the pinnacle of ridiculousness of the discussion between plugins vs hardware came in 2011 were I was producing a record in Abbey Road's Studio 3.
I had 4x Fairchild 660 compressor units in the studio, 2 of them are in the studio rack and 2 of them were brought in for my sessions. I used the Fairchilds in the recording, then I tried the Bombfactory plugin emulation and for my needs the plugin didn't sounded better it sounded much better and I skipped those 4 really expensive units.
After that the discussion between plugins and hardware was over for me, I've used it all in terms of hardware I enjoy all the good things, sometimes I use it but I don't miss any of it nowadays, specially after UAD.
In reality sometimes people that say they like plugins are attacked by other people saying that they like it because they never used the hardware units, I find it's actually the opposite, people that defend hardware like if it was the last Coca Cola in the desert are normally people that never used most of the well known hardware units and dream about having it and think it would make them miracles.
I've used it all, there's no miracle involved in hardware, Plugins keep constantly evolving and yes that are plugins as good as the original units, there are also plugins that do many amazing things that no hardware unit ever did and that there's no equivalent in the hardware world.
I attach photos of the Hardware I had at my disposal in Abbey Road Studio 3 in 2011, all great stuff that I like a lot and had the pleasure to work with, but don't miss any in 2022.
It's not about hardware or plugins, both are tools, it's about having the tools you need and how you use them.
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That’s certainly an impressive list. I’m curious if you can be more specific on what you liked better about the plug-in version of the Fairchild? Where I tend to find I disagree with most people on this debate is what better means. For most engineers better gear means things like better s/n, lower thd, from a perspective that a result should sound as close to the source as possible (I’m not trying to put words in your mouth). The resur
That is an overly generalization and I totally disagree.
And for sure for you to state that then you don't know all the plugins I know or you never used all the outboard gear I've used over the years, or you have something against software and computers.
There's many plugins, there's many hardware units, in plugins as in hardware there's bad units, good units and great units, so I find that over generalization about "all" plugins completely wrong.
There's many plugin emulations, some of them are actually not that good (Waves emulations for example), but there's some brands and specific plugin emulations that are simply amazing, there's also many many plugin units that are not emulations and don't exist in hardware.
Personally in my professional experience the pinnacle of ridiculousness of the discussion between plugins vs hardware came in 2011 were I was producing a record in Abbey Road's Studio 3.
I had 4x Fairchild 660 compressor units in the studio, 2 of them are in the studio rack and 2 of them were brought in for my sessions. I used the Fairchilds in the recording, then I tried the Bombfactory plugin emulation and for my needs the plugin didn't sounded better it sounded much better and I skipped those 4 really expensive units and used the plugin instead.
After that the discussion between plugins and hardware was over for me, I've used it all in terms of hardware I enjoy all the good things, sometimes I use it but I don't miss any of it nowadays, specially after UAD.
In reality sometimes people that say they like plugins are attacked by other people saying that they like it because they never used the hardware units, I find it's actually the opposite, people that defend hardware like if it was the last Coca Cola in the desert are normally people that never used most of the well known hardware units and dream about having it (which I totally understand) and think it would make them miracles.
There's no miracle involved in hardware, Plugins keep constantly evolving and yes that are plugins as good as the original units, there are also plugins that do many amazing things that no hardware unit ever did and that there's no equivalent in the hardware world.
I attached photos of the Hardware I had at my disposal in Abbey Road Studio 3 in 2011, all great stuff that I like a lot and had the pleasure to work with, but I don't need any of it 2022 for mixing.
I still like to record/track with great Mic Pres, EQs and compressors before it hits the recorder (PT).
It's not about hardware or plugins, both are tools,both are great, it's about having the tools you need and how you use them.
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I was attempting to post from my phone last night and accidentally posted a reply in progress. I apologize in advance for the lack of posting skills such as the reply to quote feature. I'll try again:
There's so much to say, it's hard to know where to start or end. Of course, what we're debating is subjective and I'm not actually sure we disagree. Obviously, to have an opinion on anything requires a certain amount of generalizing or it would be near impossible to have a conversation about anything.
"you don't know all the plugins I know or you never used all the outboard gear I've used over the years, or you have something against software and computers"
This is true on all accounts, though I could easily say the same(minus the bit about computers).
"there's also many many plugin units that are not emulations and don't exist in hardware".
I agree. There are also many hardware units that don't exist as a plugin. And as you've said, even the same model hardware units can sound dramatically different; I think this is a feature. Their are things we can do with software that we can't with hardware and vice-versa. However, I would argue that the way we end up using/reacting/bonding (to name a few), has as much to do with the sound as the air it moves.
Hardware gives us a more unique sound:
As I'm sure you noticed, your fairchildren all sounded different which I would argue is another reason hardware is better. Is there an EP-3 plugin setting that has the same pinch roller I hand selected to have the perfect amount of warble, with a shorter tape loop to get the right timed sound on sound, that's over-biased(under?) with SM-911? Again, I play my hardware in real time. I don't remember what Space echo plugin my friend uses(while his hardware RE-201 collects dust), but I immediately noticed that when you switch repeat settings it doesn't do what the hardware does when you switch. Can you pluck the spring reverb tank in the plugin? Does the plugin emulate the echo with the worn heads(I realize there are various degradation settings on tape emulations)of his machine...or my less worn RE-301...or the one on the shelf in my repair queue? Again, what did you like about the Fairchild plugin better than the other 4? Do you think the improvement you heard is going to better compliment everything you work on ever? I think relying on more and more software results in us to stop considering these things and I'd argue it's a disadvantage. Your hardware is different than my hardware which adds to my sound. Why work at Abbey road if everything can be emulated better via plugin in the comfort of your own home? Do you tell your guitar players to leave their amps at home because the amp simulator is better? Why not get everyone together to decide what guitar sounds best, then just make that one guitar; Then you can hang them on the wall right next to the rack full pre-worn jeans that all perfectly mimic the pair of jeans that Jimmy Hendrix wore! Why even have a guitar player(ironically, I currently make electronic music though I rarely use midi)?
One of the private studios I worked at in my 20s(as an assembler, not an engineer)had a couple fairchildren that I never got to listen to extensively. However as Head of Assembly part of my job was to hand select the EF-14(no, not VF)tubes and mount the capsules in all the U47 clones. All this was done by ear. They all sound different. They all sound good(except the ones that didn't). One was even good enough to get Paul McCartney to rerecord all his vocals through for that covers LP he did.
We play and react to hardware differently which I think adds to more creativity and enjoyability:
We simply react differently to physical things. These differences I'd argue result in better music and a more enjoyable experience. I think there are several reasons for this but I'm mainly focusing on unpredictability and limitations. When I plugged my sampler into my H910 the other day I noticed that the sampler output pot was scratchy. That scratchy pot through the H910 ended up being a major component in my track. I've had the same experience with my Echolette tape delay;a scratchy pot and motor noise made the track, though completely accidental. I was recording a CS-50 that had a voice out. I discovered that when arpeggiating through a couple phrases, the space where the dead voice came in, resulted in an unexpected complexity that I wouldn't have achieved otherwise. Would you argue that a guitar player plays the same standing next to an amp that they do with an amp sim or a piano player paying a midi controller? How do you play feedback? If you record the midi data tracking fader movement(I admittedly tend to automate this) in real time does it ever look the same the as when you draw it in? I would argue that the visual representation of the fader automation results in correcting something you otherwise wouldn't(one might be inclined to replace a non linear manual crossfade with a visually perfect automated fade). Simply turning two "knobs" at once in real time is a challenge with a plugin! One pass of me tweaking my Re-301 as I record in real time would be horribly tedious to replicate ITB. Hardware changes, and it's a good thing. These days I repair vintage synthesizers for a living. After refurbishing Arcade Fire's CS-80 the thing is a living breathing masterpiece of ingenuity and craftsmanship! It reacts to it's environment(primarily temperature heh heh). Sure, I don't want to lift the thing or pay for one...but there's something about candy colored sliders that make you want to touch them, and how the feel that determines how you move them; Similarly to how thick strings help influence how you bend them. Would your recommend we all vote on what the best sounding guitar is and just make a plugin version? Furthermore, as a repair man, when they brake it's fun to fix. You don't have to wait for the service dept. to answer your email about proprietary software issues, or wait for the firmware upgrade before the thing you paid for actually works like it was advertised.
It's easier to bond with physical things. This bond makes a better story and effects our perception:
This is the most overlooked point by engineers imo: Sound is perception. It's not just moving air. We hear differently when we have a full stomach or when we're tired. Our ears fatigue at different rates depending on whether we enjoy what we're listening to; When we have wax in our ears, or we've had too much caffeine, or our allergies are bad. Almost everything I own I've repaired. It's increased my knowledge of how my tools work on a fundamental level and made me appreciate them more. More importantly its created a bond. My console sounds "better" because I replaced the noisy faders with P&G, buffered the VU meter driver, upgraded the opamps, transformer balanced the I/O, replaced several pots, added shielded cable...BUT it also sounds better because it has custom wood end-cheeks and a leather arm rest that I made with my dad because it directly invokes a fond memory. My '78 P-Bass sounds better because of the heavy body. But it also sounds better because of the small stain on the headstock from the time I accidentally split my bandmates head open during a live show on tour. There's now a story that helps create a bond, that improves the players perception, which effects the playing. I'm sure you'd agree as an engineer, that how you perceive what you're hearing directly effects what you do to a mix. Call it bias, placebo, whatever. Just don't pretend it doesn't matter; A lot.
In the next few years we'll most likely have AI that has gotten to the point where we can just push a button and get a unique song we love. The algorithm will monitor our reactions and continue to grow in ways that give us songs that will be even more sonically impressive that the last. I for one am going to miss all the other bits that came all with it. This doesn't even get into the limitations part of the argument. As the late, great John Hassel said (paraphrase), "Style develops from what we can't do."
One last thing: These plugin vs hardware debates never happen without cost coming into play. I think this is a straw-man argument. I don't have a Fairchild because I can't afford one, so a plugin might be a good solution. If that's what you're claiming then I agree. But if you think that your Fairchild compressor plugin is truly better than having a real one, then you have to take money out of the equation. You're entitled to your opinion and no offense, but if you find yourself in a room one day with a computer and Fairchild plugin on one table, and a real Fairchild on another, with a sign that says "Take One", and you pick the computer, then you're an idiot. And I sure as hell don't want you touching my mixes.
"It's not about hardware or plugins, both are tools,both are great, it's about having the tools you need and how you use them"
Agreed.