Searching for legal facts on gear

wkbdgeorge · Mar 24, 2010

Hi everyone. I have a question about the legal side of pcb designs that are clones. How has Purple gotten away with cloning the 1176? How about Retro and their sta-level and other products? Drip is also in the same boat. I don't want to start a debate on right and wrong and all that bs. What I'm looking for is legal standpoints on how gear like this can be accepted or rejected. How close is too close for the law? What are the work-arounds? Looking for facts, not opinions like you would find on gearslutz.

pucho812 · Mar 24, 2010

retro can do it as those products are no longer on the market and I am sure the trademarks/patents are finished as the original patent holders are long dead. I can't speak for the rest other then I am positive the only similarity outside of looks for the 1176 and the mc76 is the fact they use fets.

Echo North · Mar 24, 2010

http://www.groupdiy.com/index.php?topic=33758.msg412859#msg412859

There is some history in the first paragraph.

Mike

Skylar · Mar 24, 2010

pucho812 said:
...I am positive the only similarity outside of looks for the 1176 and the mc76 is the fact they use fets.

I thought MC76 circuit was identical to the 1176 circuit.

A quick glance at the schematics supports this.

Here's a snippet:

Kingston · Mar 24, 2010

They're the same thing, only MC76 does (did?) it better from quality control stand point (parts).

I guess it's just fact you can't patent a "standard electronic circuit", whatever the real legal definition is. Purple audio didn't use trademarked names and made their own PCB. I guess that's solid enough from a legal standpoint. And it serves customers who don't want to risk it with a shady vintage -who knows how long till it bites the dust- 1176.

Echo North · Mar 24, 2010

The signal path is the same.

Purple added a better stereo linking circuit, meter circuit just to name a few things. You can read about a lot of this stuff on the product page.

It's also important to note when Purple started making the MC76 (1996) no one was making an 1176. It wasn't till 2001 when the naming rights were purchased from Harman that they went back into production (explained in the link above).

Like Pucho said, even if this stuff was patented, they would have expired by now.

Mike

klett · Mar 25, 2010

also should be noted that the FET limiter concept was published by Siliconix prior to 1176 coming into being... the MC76 was re-engineered so all new pcb payout, amplifier topologies were the same, board layout was ground plane instead of serpentine ground... little changes in HOW schematic was put into physical form, some component updates, better caps and so on...

Stagefright13 · Mar 25, 2010

The Purple schematic may support the original 1176 design. But is FAR superior. Look at the schematic again... And the layout is also far superior.

I think they wanted to reproduce a classic compressor that was no longer available. And obviously missed in the recording world. And I am sure the patents are WAY up on the 1176 and LA2A. So I think they made a good choice on this one.

Hey I can use old Godzilla video now without fear of copyright in my videos. Is why ya can buy "The Attack Of The 50 Foot Woman" cheap now.

John

Sammas · Mar 25, 2010

klett said:
also should be noted that the FET limiter concept was published by Siliconix prior to 1176 coming into being... the MC76 was re-engineered so all new pcb payout, amplifier topologies were the same, board layout was ground plane instead of serpentine ground... little changes in HOW schematic was put into physical form, some component updates, better caps and so on...

Not to mention that there are actually multiple versions of the 'original' 1176. Well, at least those sold with the '1176' brand name.

pucho812 · Mar 25, 2010

and from REV A to REV F there are differences... If it's a unit in current production to avoid lawsuit change 10% of it and do a new layout and look and you can get away with it me think.

what about all the Neve clones out there?

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