Celestion G12T-75

[rob_gould]

When I was a kid (15 years old) I built a 4 x 12 cabinet for a technology project, using G12T-75s as the speakers.  I borrowed a Marshall 100W head to test it with and it worked and sounded great.

After a few days of every window in the house shaking, my parents insisted I give the borrowed head back.  For the last 16 years the cab has sat unused in various bedrooms and spare rooms.  It's literally never been plugged in since those first few days I had the head to power it.  Following the recent effort of dragging it through another house move, I have decided to break up the cab.

I have long stopped being a daily guitar player and taking an interest in the scene, having converted to the dark side (house and techno - eek!) of music writing over a decade ago, but when I built this cab, these speakers - Celestion G12T-75 - were well respected, and used in some of the top end Marshal cabs I believe.

Is that still the case? And do you expect that people would buy these speakers second hand?

I was hoping that people on here who know more about such things would be able to advise on whether or not the fact they're over 15 years old but effectively unused makes them worth any real money or not...

I intend to keep one or possibly two for a small DIY valve combo project which I'll get to at some point, but the others I may as well get rid of.

Cheers!

Rob

 

[okgb]

Some metal guys like these and they seem a reasonably popular modern celestion ,
not like greenbacks but better reputation than the bright gm 70's , or the cheaper
seventy /80's  you should do o.k.

 

[rob_gould]

Nice one - thanks for the input.

Following on from that, I wonder is anyone has a recommendation for a nice valve 1 x 12 or 2 x 12 to build?

I toyed with the idea of doing an SLO clone not too long ago but it kind of fell by the wayside as I had lots of other projects.  I'd be interested to here about anything people have built though...

 

[okgb]

May want to look for a cheaper tube amp in the format you want and mod it ,
otherwise a few of the places making kits seemed to phase them out but
search guitar amp kit , should find a few things

 

[deuce42]

Yeah agree its a favourite speaker for metal players. Its got a scooped mid sound naturally.

Guitar gear goes in fashions, like the 80's and early 90's were the backdrop of rackmount guitar preamps, you wont even see one today.

Most of guitar "fashion", these days is very retro vibey, old school stuff. Accordingly ,the speaker of choice are things like Vintage 30's and stuff to replicate green backs but handle a bit more power.

If I was going to do anther guitar amp, I would go for a Fender Super Reverb blackface circuit - I think the ultimate clean and blues tone and there are kits on the net out there. If you want a harder edge sound, my vote goes to the SLO.

 

[rob_gould]

Just the kind of advice I was looking for - thanks gents.

With my metal days well and truly behind me, it seems I might get a better result flogging all of the G12T-75s and getting a different speaker for my project anyway...

 

[emrr]

I think Celestion changed all of their tooling and production since yours were made, so there will be some people drooling to have those, for whatever reason.  Be sure to advert accordingly. 

 

[okgb]

True , and NOT chinese

 

[deuce42]

I think Celestion changed all of their tooling and production since yours were made, so there will be some people drooling to have those, for whatever reason.  Be sure to advert accordingly.

Yep totally - for example: I ebay'ed off some g12t-75's out of my 80's era marshall quad when I wanted to replace them with vintage 30's. I was staggered at the insane price people bought them for. As always, anything made more than 25 years ago in audio is apparently the holy grail and must be sought by the next generation. They simply must have it for cred. This is the case with older celestion g12t-75's.

I would seriously go for the Vintage 30's, and i say this being a real obsesesive with guitar speakers and cabs -  my amp building and experimenting have taught me that its my most important variable, at least to my ears and for my projects. I have experimented with many speakers but always find the vintage 30's to be the best overall, even when I wanted to like other more pristine, expensive, or boutique ones better. I keep coming back to V30's as the best balance of everything and price.

The good news is making guitar valve amp projects is one of the most resource packed parts of the internet! I mean there are so many sites with really helpful stuff and people making guitar projects, its almost impossible to be lost or without info.

This may also be outside the ambit or your thread, and completely unsolicited advice since your question is about speakers, but just out my experience I would say pay a lot of time and attention to your choice of output transformer as well if you build a project. A lot of the good stuff in a great valve amp is in that xformer. I love magnetic components "classic tone" brand. Affordable and they sound sublime


***** AND LASTLY - said purely for the sake of amusement, yet curiously and secretly combined with a tinge of my own jaded, emotional damaged vault of diy inner personal hurt/pain, of course for which I feel the need to express here despite any rational person seeing how transparent my ramblings are:  -  whilst I drool over Mesa Boogie designs and find them just such amazing sounding amps (particularly their more vintage focussed stuff like their Mark Series), they make for the worst possible diy projects ever.  This is because there is a lot going on inside them and getting a project right requires some sort of hybrid collective skill balance between the following personal attributes:

a) Extreme patience
b) Brilliant base of tube knowledge,
c) A Buddhist like calm and meditational serenity during the more "challenging moments" of soldering and construction,
d) Possibly possessing a slight propensity to bipolar disorder or other psychiatric condition that verges on creative genius. 

End of sermon

 

[bruno2000]

I think Celestion changed all of their tooling and production since yours were made, so there will be some people drooling to have those, for whatever reason.  Be sure to advert accordingly.

Yep totally - for example: I ebay'ed off some g12t-75's out of my 80's era marshall quad when I wanted to replace them with vintage 30's. I was staggered at the insane price people bought them for. As always, anything made more than 25 years ago in audio is apparently the holy grail and must be sought by the next generation. They simply must have it for cred. This is the case with older celestion g12t-75's.

I would seriously go for the Vintage 30's, and i say this being a real obsesesive with guitar speakers and cabs -  my amp building and experimenting have taught me that its my most important variable, at least to my ears and for my projects. I have experimented with many speakers but always find the vintage 30's to be the best overall, even when I wanted to like other more pristine, expensive, or boutique ones better. I keep coming back to V30's as the best balance of everything and price.

The good news is making guitar valve amp projects is one of the most resource packed parts of the internet! I mean there are so many sites with really helpful stuff and people making guitar projects, its almost impossible to be lost or without info.

***** AND LASTLY - said purely for the sake of amusement, yet curiously and secretly combined with a tinge of my own jaded, emotional damaged vault of diy inner personal hurt/pain, of course for which I feel the need to express here despite any rational person seeing how transparent my ramblings are:  -  whilst I drool over Mesa Boogie designs and find them just such amazing sounding amps (particularly their more vintage focussed stuff like their Mark Series), they make for the worst possible diy projects ever.  This is because there is a lot going on inside them and getting a project right requires some sort of hybrid collective skill balance between the following personal attributes:

a) Extreme patience
b) Brilliant base of tube knowledge,
c) A Buddhist like calm and meditational serenity during the more "challenging moments" of soldering and construction,
d) Possibly possessing a slight propensity to bipolar disorder or other psychiatric condition that verges on creative genius. 

End of sermon

Built many a tube amp, and I agree!
Best,
Bruno2000

 

[rob_gould]

I think Celestion changed all of their tooling and production since yours were made, so there will be some people drooling to have those, for whatever reason.  Be sure to advert accordingly.

Yep totally - for example: I ebay'ed off some g12t-75's out of my 80's era marshall quad when I wanted to replace them with vintage 30's. I was staggered at the insane price people bought them for. As always, anything made more than 25 years ago in audio is apparently the holy grail and must be sought by the next generation. They simply must have it for cred. This is the case with older celestion g12t-75's.

I would seriously go for the Vintage 30's, and i say this being a real obsesesive with guitar speakers and cabs -  my amp building and experimenting have taught me that its my most important variable, at least to my ears and for my projects. I have experimented with many speakers but always find the vintage 30's to be the best overall, even when I wanted to like other more pristine, expensive, or boutique ones better. I keep coming back to V30's as the best balance of everything and price.

The good news is making guitar valve amp projects is one of the most resource packed parts of the internet! I mean there are so many sites with really helpful stuff and people making guitar projects, its almost impossible to be lost or without info.

This may also be outside the ambit or your thread, and completely unsolicited advice since your question is about speakers, but just out my experience I would say pay a lot of time and attention to your choice of output transformer as well if you build a project. A lot of the good stuff in a great valve amp is in that xformer. I love magnetic components "classic tone" brand. Affordable and they sound sublime


***** AND LASTLY - said purely for the sake of amusement, yet curiously and secretly combined with a tinge of my own jaded, emotional damaged vault of diy inner personal hurt/pain, of course for which I feel the need to express here despite any rational person seeing how transparent my ramblings are:  -  whilst I drool over Mesa Boogie designs and find them just such amazing sounding amps (particularly their more vintage focussed stuff like their Mark Series), they make for the worst possible diy projects ever.  This is because there is a lot going on inside them and getting a project right requires some sort of hybrid collective skill balance between the following personal attributes:

a) Extreme patience
b) Brilliant base of tube knowledge,
c) A Buddhist like calm and meditational serenity during the more "challenging moments" of soldering and construction,
d) Possibly possessing a slight propensity to bipolar disorder or other psychiatric condition that verges on creative genius. 

End of sermon

Wow - cheers Deuce - some great advice in there. 

I'm happy to trust your Mesa-Mantra!  Sounds like it'd be diving in at the deep end a bit

 

[okgb]

It's the switching  [ different values on the same tubes ] which tend to complicate allot of newer designs
you could made the modes into separate channels or just start with a single channel .
The speakers are more subjective , I have a pair of V30's that , to me have a spike of brightness [ peaky ]
in them , I'd gladly trade for greenbacks , more even, perhaps duller

 

[Johan]

The speakers are more subjective , I have a pair of V30's that , to me have a spike of brightness [ peaky ]
in them , I'd gladly trade for greenbacks , more even, perhaps duller

+1  I prefere G12T75 over V30 for this resaon, but it is subjective and down to taste...as long as you chose with your ears in the real world you'll be fine.
...I nearly punched a guy once after he argued for a long time how superior the V30 was over my 75's and it turned out he only tried them on (Line6) ampfarm... ...what the hell...?...
J

 

[okgb]

It does have the word vintage after all , so it HAS TO be great ,
not sure about the Heritage , where it falls soundwise

 

[fazer]

I have some G12 H30's from 1971,  I love them for tone but they have been played for years.  I have some greenbacks and there good but not like the H30's  I have a  vintage 30s in a new Gibson Cab (2x10 and 2x 12)  It depends on the head but they have always felt to be overly bright.  they have gone better over the years but the H30's are what do it for me.

 

[MagnetoSound]

... not sure about the Heritage , where it falls soundwise

I think it falls in, maybe ... long, long ago? ... or in, like, yore?  ;D

 

[desol]

From what i remember, when i worked in a music store(for 5 years) greenbacks were about $125 cad ea. So, with exhange rates, used, etc....probably $75 ea?...or something like that.

 

[deuce42]

I find the greenbacks to be great at hard crunching chords and wide open sounds, but at high volumes in band set ups sometimes I want a bit more spike.  Yes you can hit the treble knob on your amp but I find speaker clarity to be a very intangible thing.

I found the G12's to be very old school and nice for vintage tones, but using very high gain sounds made me think the speaker was a bit thin.

I accept the V30's may be feel bright on face value, but when playing in a band context I find they just have a bit more clarity at high volume and cut through. Its just my experience to my ears and life would be boring if we all liked the same thing.  It is absolutely a matter of opinion as we all agree, especially as we all hear sounds differently. My vote just ends up with the V30 after many attempts, including scumbacks and webers which were amazing speakers and far superior sounding for some things and not working for me with other styles of playing.  Eminence produce great stuff, especially those alnico legends 10 inch cones that emulate old jensen Fender bassman speakers. 

Just for encouraging an interesting discussion about how much speakers and cabs influence a sound,  how about the Marshall jtm45 and the Fender Bassman. Its such an interesting comparison even if it has been discussed many times. - They are  almost entirely the same circuit (12ay7 v 12ax7 in the first tube position and slightly different feedback loop), but otherwise one's a direct copy of the other's circuit. To me they are two completely different animals. Two completely different things.  I mean they feel completely different to the touch and response of the amp.  The 4 x 10 open backed pine cab on the bassman is a very different thing to the Marshall quad box sealed.  At high volume as well the character is even more pronounced on each of them. One really does sound like classic american bandstand and one really does sound like psychadelic hendrix -  even if you were only listening without physically seeing which amp was being played. 

In my mind thats what I love about guitar amps - a circuit is only one part of the sound and only really the technical sound if you like - but the 3D quality of an amp which makes people feel good hearing it when cranked live is about its directional spread, its percussive thump, and its harmonic content. All of these variables come from non electronic matters such as vibrating wood, moving air, and volume of space of the speakers.

 

[okgb]

A couple of good points , the difference between a big closed back cabinet and combo's effect on the speaker
curiously mesa produced half & half cabinets that didn't seem to take off , it can be tough
trying to find a speaker balance for clean & dirty , I know My own attempts at mixing speakers
in a 4x12 have been unsatisfying . I may like greenbacks more because I'm used to them but
pushing the treble in an amp is increasing gain , and you play different depending on volume level
It's a little tough trying out different speakers and living with them for a while , and then i get dizzy , fall down
and hit my head and F'it