Langevin Tube Console

[emrr]

Inward Connections did a reissue in the late 1990's the AM-5116-C, didn't last long before Manley shut them down for using the Langevin name. I've never seen one. Somewhere I'd seen commentary about it, I believe Cinemag did the transformers.

I doubt there's any significant difference in the A and B versions, many times designations change because of a physical mounting method.

The Manley MIC/EQ 500 COMBO, without saying it, appears to have been pretty much a 5116-B / 251-A combo with an output stage added. Haven't dug into whether it could be the same output transformer with the tube change.

I have had an ancient DIY clone made with UTC A-10 and A-24. It worked fine. I've seen an original with an A-24 replacement also, though I imagine that would be a huge pain in the ass to mount.

 

[csikora77]

Hmm. Interesting. I thought about contacting Manley to see if they have data for the transformer at the very least and would be forth coming with such. Or if they could make one? Or contacting Steve Firlotte. I think right now David is onboard to do this. And thank you CJ! What you have may just be enough that David will wind them! If we do it he says he may make enough to have a small stock on the Cinemag website for others to purchase.
One question CJ, it looks as though the 5116 input transformer you documented above is the 432-B. That is the correct transformer for the 5116B module, the push pull design. So I am hoping the output transformer is from the same module? Making it the TF 129-A ? Or 329? Could you clarify that before I send this over to David?
Thanks so much everyone.

 

[csikora77]

Also from my understanding I thought somewhere I saw the difference between the 129-A and 129-B was that the B had the tertiary winding. But I may be imagining this at this point. I’ve read through dozens of data sheets and online posts. In the schematic I have verified that there doesn’t appear to be one. So I think we are good with the specs on the 129-A.

 

[emrr]

No tert in the 5116-B/C

 

[csikora77]

No tert in the 5116-B/C

Thanks! This might actually be possible!

 

[My3gger]

It seems we have confusion across the forum between AM5116 and AM5116b, two different preamps with different sets of transformers.
CJ's transformer documents for "AM5116" are different from transformers on Langevin AM5116b. I suppose this is correct schematic for AM5116:
https://www.technicalaudio.com/pdf/Langevin/Langevin_type5116_original_version_schematic_correct.pdfAnother interesting thing are two pretty much the same preamps, Langevin AM5116b and Electrodyne 201-A. Their transformers are marked differently despite having the same taps.
Csikora77, do you have schematics of 5116 and 5116b? It is late here, i'm getting a little confused with transformer and other info.

 

[csikora77]

It seems we have confusion across the forum between AM5116 and AM5116b, two different preamps with different sets of transformers.
CJ's transformer documents for "AM5116" are different from transformers on Langevin AM5116b. I suppose this is correct schematic for AM5116:
https://www.technicalaudio.com/pdf/Langevin/Langevin_type5116_original_version_schematic_correct.pdfAnother interesting thing are two pretty much the same preamps, Langevin AM5116b and Electrodyne 201-A. Their transformers are marked differently despite having the same taps.
Csikora77, do you have schematics of 5116 and 5116b? It is late here, i'm getting a little confused with transformer and other info.

I have the schematics for the the 5116B and 5116. The input transformer part number that CJ referenced in his drawing is in fact the correct transformer for the 5116B. That part number is TF-132/432b. I can confirm as I’m staring at one right now.
I saw an old post in the forum about how someone sent him an output transformer for a 5116B so I am assuming and hoping the drawing he posted is actually for the output of a 5116B. Not the 5116. There is no part number on the drawing as there is for the input transformer. So if CJ can confirm which of these transformers he was referencing I think we are actually ok. I do not have a catalog of reference of the transformer part number for the 5116 but the one David referenced was not the 129-A or 129-B. It was a different number altogether. Also I have confirmed there is no tertiary winding used in the 5116b.

 

[emrr]

It is unfortunate the 5116 and 5116-B are named as they are, it’s because they fit the same tray. The 5116 is more related to the 116. The 5116-B is more related to the AM-16 in one way at minimum. Hahaahhaa

 

[CJ]

I never saw what those transformers came out of, so no experience with the actual electronics

 

[tony hunt]

csikora77 I have interest in four valid replacements for these.
Have you considered sending one of your defect outputs to David at Cinemag for a tear-down and to get the sizing useable for these miniature trays?


I have one 5116-B output stamped 3129 B here, measurements below. The 2 is not legible and is assumed.

The schematics show TF 129 / 329 B so I guess there was some cross over or screw up with the numbers. The old literature states 20.000 Ohms to 600/250 secondary up to +26 DBM operating level.


3129 B Lead out left to right underneath: 10 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 1
(with view of underside and amp handle to the right, wire feed though at the bottom)

Readings taken with my simple Fluke 114

1 input from Plate
2 input CT
3 input from Plate
measuring 2.020k (1.007k -CT- 1.013k)


Output strapped for 600 Ohms:
4 to 9 measuring 148.6 Ohms

Output strapped for 250 Ohms:
5 to 8 measuring 92.9 Ohms

Outputs:
4 strap to “A” for 600 Ohms
5 (strap to “A” for 250 Ohms instead of output 4)
4 to 5 measuring 28.1 Ohms

6 strap to “A” link to “B” for 600 Ohms
6 to 9 measuring 46.7 Ohms

7 strap to “B” (ink to “A” for 600 Ohms)
7 to 4 measuring 74.6 Ohms

8 strap to “B” (strap to “B” for 250 Ohms instead of output 4)
9 strap to “B” for 600 Ohms
9 to 8 measuring 28 Ohms

10 internal screen

 

[My3gger]

I have the schematics for the the 5116B and 5116. The input transformer part number that CJ referenced in his drawing is in fact the correct transformer for the 5116B. That part number is TF-132/432b. I can confirm as I’m staring at one right now.
I saw an old post in the forum about how someone sent him an output transformer for a 5116B so I am assuming and hoping the drawing he posted is actually for the output of a 5116B. Not the 5116. There is no part number on the drawing as there is for the input transformer. So if CJ can confirm which of these transformers he was referencing I think we are actually ok. I do not have a catalog of reference of the transformer part number for the 5116 but the one David referenced was not the 129-A or 129-B. It was a different number altogether. Also I have confirmed there is no tertiary winding used in the 5116b.

You are probably correct about CJ's transformer info being for AM5116b, not AM5116. Calculation of output's turns ratio suggests it is for AM5116b, 5116 output should also have tertiary tap. If i'm wrong again it is EMMR's fault because he added AM-16 to the confusion
I recall someone mentioning very difficult repairs of 5116b because of thin pcb and other troubles. Electrodyne 201-A is pretty much the same amp except for being built for easier repairs. Universal Audio 1016 is very similar, use of either 12BH7 or 12AY7 output tube for different tasks is interesting.