Making a psuedo surround decoder

[kent]

Hey guys,
I've been a bit of a lurker lately but I'm hoping the DIY projects will get some time when the weather cools off. In the meantime maybe someone can help with this.

This is a bit oddball but necessity is the mother of invention. I would like to build a box which is a psuedo-surround decoder. I say psuedo because it only needs to reproduce 3 channels of audio and not 4 or 5.1. My scenario is this: My band plays to some recorded sequences of backing tracks. In the past weve had everything on a sampler and did it all via MIDI but now we're looking to make life simpler and just use an iPod (just for you PRR!). The downside is that stereo ping-pong stuff and the like sounds so great and the band wants to keep that. This means using the left channel for click and the right for tracks is out. I thought of using Dolby surround for encoding would work but it appears that I can't get a discreet third channel for the click. I can certainly flip phase and do other tricks in Pro Tools if necessary but I can't seem to figure out a way to encode and decode 3 seperate channels using phase and differencial amps.

Anyone got any thoughts?

Cheers,
kent

 

[SSLtech]

You basically can't do it.

Dolby surround using analog encoding is an image-steering trick. It makes 2 channels of information appear from 4 locations, but there is no fully isolated discrete seperation. If you have something like a click that you want to remove, it would have to be encoded out-of band or some similar method... and frequency-dependant encoding is going to bugger that up for you, so you're basically SOL.

Keith

 

[Kev]

I think you will have to think about an upgrade from stereo CD playback to a DVD and use say a Kareoke format.

This will also give you the option to have some video play back for the band.

I have been working on this for some time and haven't found the best balance of software ... which will relate to ProTools easily and work on both platforms. The solution should fast and easy and consistent.
The DVD/file/format should also have fast access and ONE SHOT play for each track.

does this make sense ?

I failed with all the small Hard Drive MP3 style units as none gave more than 2 channels of playback ... regardless as to what the advertising said ... Creative STUCK .... :sad:

I'm busting to get a solution to this.

 

[kent]

Kev,

I've thought about the DVD option but it would also require a reciever with a decoder built-in. At a certain point it starts getting more convoluted than just running a sampler. Our drummer has a hard enough time with that thing. It would give the 5.1 discreet channels though which opens up some possibilities if nothing more than extra control for the FOH guy.

Spinning that iPod wheel is just so damn EASY!

I'll keep thinkin' on it.

cheers,
kent

-maybe one of those Sony or Tascam 4 track Minidisc players?[/img]

 

[Kev]

yep
as I said
I haven't found the right solution yet.

The DVD is definitely cheap and easy to replace. Most units have the decoder built in.
I'm sure we can find a software to make the right sort of file.

The Midi Disc is a dead format and we must be able to find a Hard Drive alternative.

IPod is cool but they will never give multitrack O/P.
Creative lied about the surround on the Jukeboxes.
:sad:
to be expected really

The DIY recorder talked about here might give us the option to develop a simple playback unit with 4 O/Ps.
It needs to be fast and easy to use ...
Standard file types with a cool LCD type screen
so
the drummer can use it too
:wink:

 

[kruz]

i myself found in your same situation and i bought an old Akai DR-4
They are damn cheap nowdays but they were super pro stuff.. with excellent ADDA too, and built like a tank.

 

[kent]

Good option, Kruz!

I know some bands around her that use ADATs and the like but I'm thinking that it's gotta be nonlinear. Set lists seem to change in mid-set :?

cheers,
kent

 

[Kev]

yes,
I have a couple of friends that still using the ADAT as a playback device.
They use the extra tracks for playback options for when band members are unavailable.

I do think the time of the ADAT is over and I'm sure there is a DVD or Hard Drive option staring us in the face.

 

[kruz]

a DR-4 (or DR-8, or even the DR-16) are really pro piece of hard disk based multitracks..
one of the smartest thing i was used to use on my DR-4 was the lotactors.. it's as easy as jumping tracks on a cd player.. but a lot faster! almost immediate.
DVD's in my opinion are not really reliables.. they easily tend to scratch their surface.. and that's unrepairable.. any HD based unit is usually more solid