will you help me make PCB's?

[mkruger]

i am looking for someone to help me make a few circuit boards. I need 5 boards made. One 3"x3.5". Two 6"x10". Two 3"x4". They are one sided with large traces and spacing. .062 board. very simple designs and boards.

I can supply all the materials including the etching tank and solution. My deadline is apraoching fast in February and I have gone way over my budget. If you require money then please let me know how much.

If anyone is interested in helping/teaching me i would really appreciate it. I live in Orlando, FL, so if you're close and could help me that would be great! but i can mail stuff if necessay.

I have been trying to use press-n-peel. I was sucessful only once and now i can't get it to work anymore after many many trials and a lot of money wasted.

Thanks!

-mike

 

[Svart]

wow that press n' peel stuff is terrible. I tried through 2 packs of the stuff and got 0 boards perfect.

what you need is the photoresist type of board. i have pretty good results with these. just laser print onto a transparency, get a fish tank uv light, a peice of glass(non uv coated of course..) lay the glass on top of the printed stencil which of course is on top of the exposed board, let it sit a few minutes, put it in the developer, rinse, put it in the etch chemical, let it work, wash it, scrub off the resist and drill it.

i bought the chemicals and uv light for less than 30$, the transparencies are around 5-10$ for 25, the boards are around 10-15 for 6x9 single sided.

just a thought. :thumb:

 

[mkruger]

the boards have to be specially sesitized right? do you know a good website tutorial for this method?

what's funny is that i made 2 boards that came out absolutly perfect with press-n-peel. they looked like they came from the factory. after that it just didn't even come close to working.

 

[Svart]

i just buy them with the stuff on it. peel off the protective plastic and you're ready to go!

 

[rich]

http://recording.org/users/kev/HowtoPCB.htm There's several links to sites that teach you how to make really good pcb's at this website. The eletricstuff link is really good with lots of tricks.

 

[electronaut]

MKruger,

You can buy photosensitized boards from a company that used to be called Kepro Circuit Systems, which is now D&L Products. (Kepro went out of business, and some guy took it over.)

http://www.kepro.com/

If you call them and order the "Dry-Film Resist" boards, the process will be fairly easy, and the instructions that come with the materials will tell you everything you need to know.

Basically, you print a transparency, as Svart said, and in a dark-room, expose the board to ultraviolet light. (The exposure time is dependent on the power of the light -- the instructions will spell it out.)

Then you develop the resist by agitating the board in a tray of developer for a minute or so. Then, turn the lights on, drill out all the holes, and etch. Works like a charm, assuming your exposure was good.

I have done this probably at least 20 times and have had perfect results nearly every time.

Good luck!

EDIT: Looks like D&L has their own website now: http://www.dalpro.net/

 

[asm]

also keep in mind when you drill the boards to go for solid carbide bits.

i've heard several people saying they only get several dozen holes out of a steel bit, but several thousand out of carbide.
cost isnt that much more. and the size will help keep the cost down.

i think drillbitcity.com or yahoo store's drillbitcity has some really nice solid carbide in wire sizes.
goodluck. ive got a uv table, so i really want to get into pcb making in the future.

if anyone knows where to find the boards in different colored soldermask then let me know. where can you get red, blue, black, ect soldermask. instead of the ulgy yellow or green.

thx.
taylor

 

[electronaut]

[quote author="asm"]if anyone knows where to find the boards in different colored soldermask then let me know. where can you get red, blue, black, ect soldermask. instead of the ulgy yellow or green.[/quote]

Several board fab houses will do other-than-green solder mask, albeit usually for a hefty charge. I believe it is another photographic process, and it needs to happen after the board is exposed, etched, drilled etc.. It's probably silk screened onto the board, if I had to guess...

 

[asm]

word, i know. :sad:
i saw pcb pro have a pull down of blue, red, black, ect in their soldermask capabilities, just didnt know if it was only high-end stuff doing it.

i think alesis or avalon have done some boards in black or red if i remember correctly. i think it looks SO badass. :green:

good idea about the silkscreening color, i'll check into that.

:thumb:

 

[pstamler]

One warning: the D&L (nee Kepro) boards have very short shelf life. When I tried boards that I'd had sitting here for six months, I got nothing; the guy at Kepro told me three months was about the maximum to expect. So use 'em or lose 'em!

Peace,
Paul

 

[electronaut]

[quote author="pstamler"]One warning: the D&L (nee Kepro) boards have very short shelf life. The guy at Kepro told me three months was about the maximum to expect.[/quote]

****! That's bad news for me. :sad:

 

[FrankSL]

What do you guys use to cut boards to shape?

I always make bad things cutting sensitized boards before exposition if I need a little board...

Frank

 

[Vetsen]

I can help you out. I would be happy to etch/drill these for you. I should have enough pcb material for all of these boards. But it's not fiberglass. it's more like phenolic material.

Or I can wait for you to ship your PCB material to me. Either way, let me know.

Vetsen

 

[mcs]

[quote author="pstamler"]One warning: the D&L (nee Kepro) boards have very short shelf life. When I tried boards that I'd had sitting here for six months, I got nothing[/quote]
That's the case with all the boards I have worked with. I think you should store them in a fridge also (some of them at least).

Best regards,

Mikkel C. Simonsen

 

[CJ]

I bought the carbide set and they are all toast.
Most of the small ones got snapped when drilling the first or second hole.
I will go for steel next time.
I would rather get 24 holes than none. Plus , a lot cheaper.

Tried end mills , that was a loss also.

cj

 

[RemcoV]

Drill-wise i always use something we call out here a spear-drill.
It's also carbon so it lasts long and it has a pretty short shaft so it doesn't break easily.

http://www.beunhaas.biz/thelab/drill.eps
I'm doing something like 2 months with a drill in my dremel (plus drillpress). Important thing is to keep it at a low speed. 6000 rpm is more then enough. If you go higher in RPMs the drill break easily.

Greetz
Remco

 

[Vetsen]

Has anyone tried these? They have worked great for me. And at a great price. You do have to be careful not to break them, but they cut nicely.

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=44924



Vetsen

 

[Gustav]

[quote author="electronaut"][quote author="asm"]if anyone knows where to find the boards in different colored soldermask then let me know. where can you get red, blue, black, ect soldermask. instead of the ulgy yellow or green.[/quote]

Several board fab houses will do other-than-green solder mask, albeit usually for a hefty charge. I believe it is another photographic process, and it needs to happen after the board is exposed, etched, drilled etc.. It's probably silk screened onto the board, if I had to guess...[/quote]

I just finished a small run of black G9 and PeQ1. Its the same process as green, but I have to clean up a machine, put in black, run the black boards, and clean up the machine in order to run green again. That adds a few hours to the process.....The usuall green soldermask is also applied in a photographic process, and its also added after the board is drilled etched etc. There was a different process solidifying the soldermask, but that was just putting it on a different conveyerbelt.....I dont know what was different there.

The center glassfiber stuff layer in the boards are usually greenish for regular boards and yellowish for multilayer mid layer boards where I work, you can get them in different colors, and that color does not show on the finished double sided or multilayered boards. Suppliers sometimes have fun and send red for christmas, yellow for easter etc). It only shows on one side of single sided boards, not on anything else.

Im almost out of SSL boards. Thinking about doing a blue run of those next..... that black stuff looks mysterious and evil.

Gustav

 

[Gustav]

[quote author="mcs"][quote author="pstamler"]One warning: the D&L (nee Kepro) boards have very short shelf life. When I tried boards that I'd had sitting here for six months, I got nothing[/quote]
That's the case with all the boards I have worked with. I think you should store them in a fridge also (some of them at least).

Best regards,

Mikkel C. Simonsen[/quote]

Never thought about putting boards in the fridge.....cool PCBs. :razz:

The usual time on the silver plating should be app 3 months after the vacuum seal is broken, if you keep it relatively sealed up between soldersessions...after that you need to go to work with an eraser, and larger quanteties come back to the factory for reworking.

The HAL tin/led plating (which is on its way out in europe because of enviromental laws) should last a whole lot longer to my knowledge.

Gustav

 

[Gustav]

[quote author="asm"]also keep in mind when you drill the boards to go for solid carbide bits.

i've heard several people saying they only get several dozen holes out of a steel bit, but several thousand out of carbide.
cost isnt that much more. and the size will help keep the cost down.

[/quote]

I cant remember how many holes we get on each drill, cuz the newer drill machines count the usage and measure the drill width automaticly. I do remember starting up drilling on an old CNC machine that we had a label on the back of each drillcase to keep count on how many holes were on each drill, and it was certainly a few thousand at least. After the drill hit a certain amount it would be discarded to make sure we were drilling the correct holesize.

Like I said - The new machines can measure the drill to see if its lost width now, so I dont think usage is counted anymore, but drills are hardly ever discarded because they snap, only because they are worn out. If you are not too critical and treat the carbide drills nicely they should last a long time.

Gustav