Woa...

[pucho812]

https://www.prosoundweb.com/channels/av/counterfeit-pro-audio-gear-factory-raided-in-china/

 

[Fuzz Face]

https://www.prosoundweb.com/channels/av/counterfeit-pro-audio-gear-factory-raided-in-china/

Soundpu. What a great name

 

[rock soderstrom]

Soundpu. What a great name

;D

 

[pucho812]

Soundpu. What a great name

they also have voxpu ;D

 

[boji]

The dbx comp sounds pu pu as oem.  The counterfeit might be a lo-fi gem.  :

 

[pucho812]

I hate to say it but this is what can happen when you manufacture in china.

 

[boji]

Not that my pcb's would turn any heads,  but sometimes I wonder about overseas pcb fabhouses.  There's no language on many of the websites that ensure confidentiality, etc. . It's best to assume designs will be plagiarized if one takes the discounted route and the pcb has any market value.

 

[pucho812]

Not that my pcb's would turn any heads,  but sometimes I wonder about overseas pcb fabhouses.  There's no language on many of the websites that ensure confidentiality, etc. . It's best to assume designs will be plagiarized if one takes the discounted route and the pcb has any market value.

I don't think that would be the case. You would have to have a finished product so they see what it is and what it do I think. I don't see them nicking a PCB layout from just a Gerber unless they know what it is for, then I could see it. But otherwise would just be a PCB.

 

[fazer]

Good old globalization.  I wonder when they will be making vintage La 2a’s.

 

[pucho812]

or an 1176, or pullet or other ;D

 

[Fuzz Face]

The Pu-Tec EQ with essential interspecies transformation

 

[boji]

lol Putech.

 

[zamproject]

Hello

I hate to say it but this is what can happen when you manufacture in china.

At some point I asking myself if this is counterfeit or a subcontractor factory that have the chain running at night producing extra unit for black market / own pocket ...
I'll like to see inside assembly compared

Best
Zam

 

[JohnRoberts]

I hate to say it but this is what can happen when you manufacture in china.

The Chinese government has institutionalized overt IP transfers for any joint ventures, part of the ongoing trade negotiation is to address this abuse. Perhaps this news article about busting a copycat is some positive PR for these negotiations.
====
The classic guitar amp story was a major industry manufacturer building guitar amps in Korea (south) that decided to pull up stakes and move production to India to save a few rupees per unit. The small contract manufacturer in Korea watching his livelihood walk out the door, decided to rebrand the un-patented or otherwise protected products under a different new brand and keep his lights on and workers eating.

As the industry joke going around back then said, "park spelled backwards is krap"  :.

JR

 

[cyrano]

It's easy to blame the Chinese...

Less than a year ago, a factory producing fake cigarettes was raided. Just 20 km from where I live. They had been in "business" for four to five years. Paid no licenses to the brand, no VAT, no taxes...

Many years ago, the largest vinyl pressing plant in western Europe was in the village where I live. They ran on 50% "legal", 50% "illegal" pressings for popular stuff. That even got reported in "Der Stern", under the heading "largest piracy operation in Europe", IIRC.

I was working for WEA, at the time. When I spoke to the top about it, they shrugged and told me that most record shops would go broke if they didn't allow it. One of the WEA brass also happened to own a chain of record shops.

When the pressing plant finally did get raided, years later, machines were confiscated etc.  The owner joked it was cheaper to see the machines hauled off by justice than to get rid of them himself. Just one week after that, they were pressing CD's. That plant is still in business, pressing CD's for all major labels.

 

[Phrazemaster]

It's easy to blame the Chinese...

Less than a year ago, a factory producing fake cigarettes was raided. Just 20 km from where I live. They had been in "business" for four to five years. Paid no licenses to the brand, no VAT, no taxes...

Many years ago, the largest vinyl pressing plant in western Europe was in the village where I live. They ran on 50% "legal", 50% "illegal" pressings for popular stuff. That even got reported in "Der Stern", under the heading "largest piracy operation in Europe", IIRC.

I was working for WEA, at the time. When I spoke to the top about it, they shrugged and told me that most record shops would go broke if they didn't allow it. One of the WEA brass also happened to own a chain of record shops.

When the pressing plant finally did get raided, years later, machines were confiscated etc.  The owner joked it was cheaper to see the machines hauled off by justice than to get rid of them himself. Just one week after that, they were pressing CD's. That plant is still in business, pressing CD's for all major labels.

Wow! Interesting story! Thx for sharing.

 

[john12ax7]

Many years ago, the largest vinyl pressing plant in western Europe was in the village where I live. They ran on 50% "legal", 50% "illegal" pressings for popular stuff. That even got reported in "Der Stern", under the heading "largest piracy operation in Europe", IIRC.

This is not good either,  but manufacturing counterfeits is worse.  With content piracy there is a direct loss of  revenue,  but since the product is often an exact duplicate there is no damage to the creators brand name.  There is no future loss of revenue if the piracy stops.

On the other hand, manufacturing cheap knock offs has a two fold effect.  Loss of revenue,  like content piracy.  But also damage to the brand itself which can then cause future revenue loss,  even after the counterfeiting stops.

Edit: I should clarify that the long term knock off damage really stems from using  the actual brand names on the product.

 

[JohnRoberts]

This is not good either,  but manufacturing counterfeits is worse.  With content piracy there is a direct loss of  revenue,  but since the product is often an exact duplicate there is no damage to the creators brand name.  There is no future loss of revenue if the piracy stops.

On the other hand, manufacturing cheap knock offs has a two fold effect.  Loss of revenue,  like content piracy.  But also damage to the brand itself which can then cause future revenue loss,  even after the counterfeiting stops.

Edit: I should clarify that the long term knock off damage really stems from using  the actual brand names on the product.

In 15 years at Peavey I saw many examples of very poor quality knock-offs, some even spelled the Peavey name wrong, while they were unmistakably pretending to be the brand. Hard to imagine these being taken seriously. OTOH I have heard about actual products (drums) being pulled from actual Peavey contract manufacturer production lines and tooling (in Taiwan IIRC), then shipped into other countries for sale (Italy IIRC) attempting to escape detection.  Since Peavey had well established distribution in over 100 countries they didn't get away with it. 

Since then Chinese manufacturers have learned how to make higher technology products, with better attention to finish and detail. Peavey used strategies like hidden extra serial numbers to control transshipping (where valid distributers would sell product into other distributer's markets).  Counterfeits are probably harder to control with modern web sales.

Caveat emptor

JR 

PS: I just bought a new heat pump for my casa... The good quality (Japanese) brand was manufactured in Thailand. 

 

[cyrano]

That's my point. It's all a mishmas.

A couple of years ago, a lot of fake Gucci bags were confiscated. They were turned over to a non-profit defending the brand. Someone at the non-profit sold them in stead of destroying them. He got caught and ended up in jail.

Most of the fakes were Chinese and nobody would take them for real. Some were Italian and at least as good as real. A family member who sells leatherware at markets was very much pleased when some of the fakes he bought at auction turned out to be the Italian ones.

Behringer gets cloned too, these days. But some of these clones are originals, from the same OEM the Behringer's come from. And it's even licensed by Behringer. When the ADA8200 came out, there was a merginally cheaper one from Phonic. Same inside, different brand, different colour.

ìt's not black and white. There's a lot of grey and even some other colors in there.

When you create a discrepancy like Gucci' prices, but nothing special in manufacturing, you create an opportunity.

If audio fools want an old DA like a TDA1741, the Chinese will oblige and even create a "gold label" one.

I'm not saying it's good. Only that it's to be expected.

 

[JohnRoberts]

Behringer gets cloned too, these days. But some of these clones are originals, from the same OEM the Behringer's come from. And it's even licensed by Behringer. When the ADA8200 came out, there was a merginally cheaper one from Phonic. Same inside, different brand, different colour.

OEM = original equipment manufacturer so Behringer is the OEM for Behringer SKUs. I don't recall Uli ever private labelling other people finished goods but many of his designs were derivative (to put it kindly).  :

Back last century before Uli built his own factory in China, Peavey used the same CM (contract manufacturer) as Behringer.  When I visited the factory they did not show me the floors where Behringer SKUs were being built. IIRC he took up two whole floors of a 7 story building.

They told a different story than Uli did about why they parted ways on less than friendly terms, I won't repeat the 2nd hand gossip, but it sounded plausible based on my excellent experience with their process and professionalism.

ìt's not black and white. There's a lot of grey and even some other colors in there.

When you create a discrepancy like Gucci' prices, but nothing special in manufacturing, you create an opportunity.

Reportedly Jeff Bezos says "your (profit) margin is my opportunity".  :

If audio fools want an old DA like a TDA1741, the Chinese will oblige and even create a "gold label" one.

I'm not saying it's good. Only that it's to be expected.

The only reason they make counterfeit goods is because people buy them.  People still believe there is such a thing as a free lunch and they can get something for nothing.

JR