Baltimore police have racial bias, Justice Department reports
- Thread starter kambo
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I have been following this and several of the police have been acquitted already in separate trials. However they have been pretty much convicted in the press, so the public will be very unhappy if they do not get their pound of flesh.
I am not sure if the federal report will mollify the public, or further inflame them.
Baltimore police are already working on reforms, something like $10M extra funds budgeted to help correct known issues (total city budget >$B).
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There was a protester struck by a car (in the street) at a BLM anniversary protest in Ferguson, then several gun shots from the crowd fired at the car as it sped away.
This is still an inflamed situation and we are having a long hot summer in several cities.
JR
PS: I probably should let sleeping dogs lie...
I am not sure if the federal report will mollify the public, or further inflame them.
Baltimore police are already working on reforms, something like $10M extra funds budgeted to help correct known issues (total city budget >$B).
=======
There was a protester struck by a car (in the street) at a BLM anniversary protest in Ferguson, then several gun shots from the crowd fired at the car as it sped away.
This is still an inflamed situation and we are having a long hot summer in several cities.
JR
PS: I probably should let sleeping dogs lie...
JohnRoberts said:
thats not nice...
my understanding is, in general Police Officers are responding according to their trainings... if you dont teach and train them properly, how exactly you gonna convict them...
(obviously u cant commit a crime and say i didnt know the law )
JohnRoberts said:
i think every city/state needs to do this.
there is no harm on extra education and knowledge. at the end, everybody will benefit from it.
I know I am repeating myself but bad apples in police departments everywhere need to be culled out.kambo said:
The Baltimore police chief says he has fired 6 officers this year already for bad behavior.
They are already working to fix this, the federal report appears a little political to me, but pretty much everything from this administration looks like political messaging of some sort.
I hope the report is calming and not inflaming tensions that are already high.
JR
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mattiasNYC
Guest
JohnRoberts said:
The officers acquitted in Baltimore recently were all part of the same case regarding Freddie Gray. If this had been a non-police organization you could possibly have tried to convict the organization as a whole rather than allow the suspects to play ignorant or blame each other. For those who don't know what I'm talking about just google Freddie Gray.
By the way, I do understand why there were acquittals, and I'm not 100% sure anyone should have been convicted or if all should have been on 'lesser' charges.
JohnRoberts said:
Firing officers "for bad behavior" is one thing, and better than nothing, but far from what some of them deserve. We all know cops got each others backs so it's no wonder the populations that perceive disproportional mistreatment think firings are farts in the wind and nothing more. A cop responsible of manslaughter gets to walk, or perhaps gets fired. Now try the reverse with a civilian responsible of manslaughtering a cop.....
JohnRoberts said:
mattiasNYC said:
There is so much more I'd rather talk about...
In case you haven't noticed we are in the middle of a political campaign so pretty much everything is political.
I'll repeat one more time for the cheap seats... we should not look at the police as us vs. them. Bad cops need to be rooted out and local community relations between the good police and good citizens mended.
JR
JohnRoberts said:
1+
problem is Police doesnt know the Law and Constitutional rights... did u watch the video i posted?
its not about good cop bad cop... cops getting fired because of internal issues... not because of shooting or
extreme use of force....
high rank Police officers are always defending their patrol Police officers, for extreme use of force, or unnecessary shooting, because they have no idea about the Law nor Constitutional rights either....
poor training from top to bottom!
if they are ignoring Law and Constitutional rights on purpose, thats very very dangerous!
PS: on two old reference cases : on one with the Diabetic guy getting slammed against the car etc....
if Supreme Court decided that the Police Officers were guilty.... than that case would be a reference case to
whole USA... then no Police Officer would be able to touch you.... its very very complicated!
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mattiasNYC
Guest
JohnRoberts said:
Well, you can tell yourself that this is all about individual rotten eggs, but I've given you plenty of sources showing clearly - from the horse's own mouth - that there's something systematic going on. Punishing the odd cop for acting according to the discriminatory commands by his superiors does nothing to get rid of the "us vs. them".
If the police themselves not only view it as but base their policies on "us vs. them" then just how can you make this into an election-year political issue? This has been going on for years.....
...as I showed you.
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mattiasNYC
Guest
kambo said:
I have to disagree with that. I think a lot of commanders and higher-ups in the police departments know the law pretty well. But there's a difference between what the law and the constitution says and what happens in practice. You can literally commit manslaughter using a technique banned by the NYPD and not only get support by the NYPD and police union, but then demand support from the Mayer and when you don't get it turn your back against him like a little child.
They know they're on the edge or other side of the law. They just don't really care as long as they think they'll get away with it.
They are the law until the legal system does something to show otherwise... and they know it.
PS: Look at the 12 officers suing the NYPD/New York over being punished for not obeying orders they considered to be unconstitutional. It shows clearly that police officers know what's going on a lot of the time.
mattiasNYC said:
that is even worst!
i used the comment of "because they have no idea about the Law nor Constitutional rights either.... "
because, they sounded like they had no idea...
if they know the law and Constitutional rights and acting as the way you are saying, than this is very very dangerous!
isnt it criminal ?
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mattiasNYC
Guest
kambo said:
It's dangerous and some of it unconstitutional. They don't care. Because a lot of people don't care. People don't care because it always happens to "them". "They" probably did something wrong and deserve it. "We" don't have anything to fear.
I try not to argue about what people think, let alone why they think something. It is difficult to impossible to know for sure even when people tell you (cough).mattiasNYC said:
Seems there are plenty of facts to argue about here. I am concerned about how inflamed this issue may become as politicians stir the pot and try to leverage off the heat for personal gain. (sorry I am making unknown speculations about "why" politicians are injecting themselves.... mea culpa)
JR
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mattiasNYC
Guest
JohnRoberts said:
Taking care of the cause gets rid of all the symptoms. None of this is going to go away any time soon, because people get more and more used to filming encounters and then posting them online. We see more and more of the official lies that were previously "buried" automatically. It's not the films being made public that are the problem, or the politicians using the events for personal gain, it's the abuse and discrimination.
I am repeating myself again but of course the bad apples need to be removed from a job that involves deadly force.
Body cameras can reveal bad behavior.
JR
Body cameras can reveal bad behavior.
JR
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mattiasNYC
Guest
Should the commanders in NYC that tell officers to violate the US constitution be removed as well?
The US constitution is the ultimate law of the land (this land).mattiasNYC said:
I think anybody who defies the constitution needs to be corrected (including the administration), while this needs to be handled through the judicial process (they need to follow the constitution too.)
Too many in government these days think the constitution is just an archaic suggestion.... it's the law.
JR
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mattiasNYC
Guest
JohnRoberts said:
Ok, so what is your position then on the stop-and-frisk policies that were deemed illegal because they discriminated - purposefully - against particular races, AND on the fact that they were instituted and mandated by the leadership?
Is that too just "bad apples"?
At what point - in your own words - does something the police do move beyond "bad apples" to something institutional?
I've argued that one before too...
Jr
Jr
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mattiasNYC
Guest
JohnRoberts said:
Yeah, and the last I recall was that you were supportive of unconstitutional profiling. So, with that said, how on earth can you view this as just a bunch of individual bad apples when you even support some of it?
It just rings incredibly hollow.
