Newbie questions on Peter C's Green Pre

[matta]

Hi Guys,

I've been hanging around this board for about a month with the odd post here
and there. I am a total Newbie to electronics and building my own gear, but
I'm thinking about getting my feet wet with a build of 2 of Peter C's Green
Pres. I believe from reading they are easy to do and pretty cheap. The other
bonus is Peter lives here in South Africa and I know the parts are readily
available having spoken to him.

I guess my main concern is that I am a total Newbie. I've seen Kev's pages
on the Pre and it is informative but they are for an older version of what
Peter is selling now (I plan to buy 2 of his PCB's). Has anyone else built
the current PCB version that didn't know jack about electronics?

You guys seem very helpful and time and again I've seen people help out
others who get stuck and this sense of community is really encouraging. I
guess my fear is not knowing enough to build them. I've read over the
various Metas but just don't know where to start, i.e a site that explains
how the resistors and caps work (although Kev's page helped alot, thanks
Kev) but maybe I don't even need to know this to build this project and will
learn as I go along?

Can you solder on a cap or resistor the wrong way round? And how do you know
which is the right way round? The PCB board looks really well labelled and
the parts list describes which each part is which, but what if I solder it
on wrong and blow something up?

I'm sorry for the long post, any words of encouragement would be most
helpful, along with any comments from Newbies that took this on as their
first project.

Thanks

Matt

 

[tony dB]

Hi Matt,

Try to read as many articles and posts around here. That will give you some more insight in electronics and the way stuff works. In a few months i started hanging out at the previous forums and this one, I learned way more then what i learned taking eveningschool in electronics for 6 months, since the most around here is very practical and less theoritical.
Then there are the real Masters of diy, who's posts you might find a little "to deep" at the moment, but soon they all will start making more sense to you.
Don't give up, you're about to discover a fascinating hobby, that will save some serious cash in the longer run.
As soon as you'll understand a little more about electronics basics, you'll see it is really not that difficult at all. (it is just a lot if you want to learn it all :grin: )

Cheers,

Tony

 

[asm]

agreed. definately pratice on perfboard (or whatever the name of the one with pads is) and a cheap bag of resistors before you move up to caps and things that can be easily damaged by heat.

also helps to have a nice solder gun to. i went from a horrible radioshak 15w pen style to a nice used weller adjustable temp unit.
BIG difference. if your going to be doing alot of soldering, throw down the 50$ or so on ebay and get a nice used weller, haako, ect. digital temp isnt necessary but nice.
takes 90% of the frustration out when learning to solder.
also helps to have nice solder to. common is 60/40, but 63/37 is said to 'flow' a little easier. ive used both and i like the 63 for smaller joints.

goodluck!

 

[matta]

Thanks you all for your helpful words.

Jaakko, your idea on using prototype board sound great. I had thought of
getting a small DIY project just to practise my soldering, it never occurred
to me to just buy a bunch of resistors and caps and just practice on
perf/peg board which is prob. the cheapest and easiest way of learning. I
found a great PDF on the web on soldering, can't remember where but if I
find the URL I'll post it.

I guess I get a bit worried about thowing myself in because I have a power
supply for my guitar pedals that has like only 4 resistor and a couple caps
and a transformer and its blown and I have no idea how to fix it or figure
out what the problem is and here I am about to tackle building a mic pre amp
with a heck of alot more on board! Maybe I should try and fix my pedal PSU
with your help and make it my first project?

asm, thanks for the direction with the soldering iron. I had written down to
get a Weller or equivalent as all have is a solder gun which has the
accuracy of an archer hitting a target at 10,000 feet... i.e not very
accurate.

Well thank you all again, it is so great to be surrounded by people who are
so willing to share their knowledge. I'm hoping to learn alot and who know
maybe oneday I'll have a studio full of gear I way able to build myself,
which is a rewarding thought.

Cheers

Matt

 

[clintrubber]

About soldering, I just want to say it goes better after you're done with a few joints.

I thought this held only for guitar-solo's ?! :shock: ... unless you recorded them of course - the next day you heard what crap it was.

 

[badperson]

Hi,

I just pm'd peter saying i'd be interested in a pcb.

what does the green pre sound like? I have an rnp, I figured if my green pre build goes ok I can use it and sell the rnp.

How do they compare in sound?

thanks!

bp

p.s., I did a search and didn't really find anything.

 

[PRR]

> I have no idea how to fix it or figure out what the problem is and here I am about to tackle building a mic pre amp

Apologies to my friends in Dearborn: Any fool can assemble a FORD, but it takes real experience to FIX a sick Ford.

In car assembly: you drop the crank in the block, the pistons in the holes, the chrome on the hood, and on to the next car. Since the parts are new and 99.44% good, if you get them in the right place it will probably work.

But if it don't work, figuring out the problem is hard. No-Start? Could be a dozen things. Which ones? Which to check first? Here is where experience counts: if an old Ford won't crank, but will honk, smack the thingie on the inner fender. There is no school for that except "Standing and cursing in the cold" University.

However. Even at Ford, the assemblers didn't do it right every time, especially on start-up (new model-year or any Monday Morning). And in DIY, every project is a "start-up" and prone to mistakes that you would sort-out after doing 500 cars. So post here. Be ready to show clear pictures of your work so others can spot your crossed wires or gloppy solder mistakes.

A Green isn't that simple. Get a $7 11-part CK001 blinker from CanaKits http://www.canakit.com/ in the Electronics Kits, LED Displays aisle. Look around and find one of the $15 projects too. These are good warm-up practice projects. There may be another brand closer to your side of the world. Velleman http://www.velleman.be/ or http://www.vellemanusa.com/ is distributed world-wide. Both websites suck (too many products to wade through; no prices) but the kits are good and you probably have a dealer in your country. Ah: http://www.velleman.be/ "WhereToBuy" Kits -- COMMUNICA, Pretoria, 012/322.76.13 and ELECTRONICS 123, Waverley - Pretoria 012/332.23.56 http://www.electronics123.co.za/

> a power supply for my guitar pedals that has like only 4 resistor and a couple caps and a transformer and its blown

My SACITC.U. education says: if nothing looks toasted, ohm-meter the transformer primary and secondary. If ohm-meter juice won't go through, then wall-power juice won't come out either. And that seems to be the #1 failing in cheap wall-warts. (After over-tortured or cat-bitten cords, of course.)

 

[Ethan]

The great thing about the more experienced people here, or should I say SACITC Alumni, is that they never seem to spout off a "I-can't-believe-you-don't-know-something-as-simple-as-that" kind of attitude. I've always seen a general welcoming: "try it, and we'll help you along". That attitude towards helping and teaching is invaluable. If only the majority of professors in academia could be so motivational... :roll:

 

[Gus]

do you play guitar? If so look at the beginner npn boost petal at Aron's stompbox page. Its a fun little booster I designed as a beginner project that might be useful.

 

[matta]

Hey Guys,

I put in my order with Peter today! Thanks again for the great info.

PRR, I checked out the Velleman site. COMMUNICA have an office here in Cape Town and I think I'll be getting all my parts from them for the Green Pre and will try pick up a kit to practice on. Thanks for the advise on the PSU, will check it out. I need to get a volt meter first, I went looking today but I think I need to visit COMMUNICA as hardware stores seem to suck for that kind of thing. I also looked into the Weller soldering iron, the price I was quoted for the basic model was R1,500, which is $250 US! Someone recommenced a company called Quik (spelling?), I believe they are not as accurate as the Weller, but better than hardware store iron. Any thoughts?

Jaakko, smoking joints around the soldering iron never did anyone any good... smoking a joint around electricity is about as clever as sticking your fingers into a wall socket, LOL!

Hey Gus, do you have the link to Aron's stompbox page? I am a guitarist so wouldn't mind checking it out.

Thanks again to everyone for your support.

Cheers

Matt

 

[Gus]

http://www.diystompboxes.com/forums/stompboxforum/

Aron has lots of good stuff in schematics.

 

[peterc]

Hi Matt

As PRR has said, the Green is not that simple. It is not a difficult cct to build but there are a lot of components to get through, about 180.

If you proceed carefully, it can be done, but it is quite a complex project as a first time build.

I use a Magnum soldering iron (locally made), the Weller's in this country are a complete ripoff. The local agents are known for over-pricing their products.

I have the basic stand-mount Magnum station, costs about R700-00. This is my second one (first one was stolen), it's very good iron, as good as a Weller. In some ways nicer as the temp control is a small pot on the shaft. Communica or Mantech do a non-station model for about R240-00. A friend has one, it seems good.

Regards
Peter

 

[Kev]

[quote author="matta"]... I've seen Kev's pages
on the Pre and it is informative but they are for an older version ... [/quote]

There will be a Green MkII page at the new place
but I just don't have time right now.
(there is a part page now ... but hidden)

So I guess that doesn't help.

There is talk of a meta file for the MkII but even so there is enough here at the LAB to get you started. Pete is never far away.

 

[josan]

Meta, Meta, Meta, green pre meta ....................

 

[Kev]

:green:

Then you really should say
META - Green MkII - by volunteer required

 

[matta]

Hey Guys,

Since I started this newbie thread and there have been a few requests for a Green Pre Meta I decided I'd start one: http://www.groupdiy.com/index.php?topic=5150

I'm not sure if Ethan or Gyref will add it to the list of META's. I'm not sure what the criterion for a good META is but I hope it passes, I just wanted to help out. Thanks for all your help so far.

Cheers

Matt

 

[peterc]

If Ethan can set this up, I'll look after it.


Peter

 

[jcharles00]

well, i've been searching through all the green pre threads here for about an hour, so i figure i'll ask....

the parts kit from ptownkid came with a bag of those little box shaped caps, some labeled 1J63, 1M63, and 1K63. I've searched here and elsewhere on the net but can't find a guide to deciphering these codes. some sites tell me that the values are .1 uF, 1uF and .1 uf respectively, but don't give a detail to the letter code. moreover, why are there two different .1uF models?

also, i've got 3 63V 47uF caps and then ~10 50V 47uF. how do I know where to put which? (assuming it matters)

i appologize for my lack of knowledge on this subject. hopefully someone can point me in the right direction.

 

[Ptownkid]

I'll answer you questions tommorrow, it's time for bed.

http://www.electronics2000.co.uk/data/itemsaf/capmarks.htm

Please feel free to e-mail me if you need any help.

cheers

 

[smallbutfine]

I did not begin with the Green V14 now, but having built a Green MK I nearly from scratch with improvising on cap values etc, i'm sure, the 63V caps are for the path of the 48V phantom power on the psu pcb (as 50V may have a critical tolerance and lifetime would be drastically reduced). On all other places 50V should be more than OK.
The boxed caps are film resistors with different tolerances (5%, 10%, 20%). There can be different qualities of caps used in the green, Peter recommended where to use film caps in the BOM. Some people use them whereever possible, but in some places (non-audio path...) you can use ceramics, too. Actually not even the manufacturers of film caps are sure what code to use for the values (as i know, at least wima has an own way to do it...), so if you don't have an LCR meter and I don't know ptownkids kit, i assume he will give you a better answer concerning the corresponding partnames on the pcb as soon as he's up again... :grin:

Kind regards

Martin