PCB using 3D printer

Is it possible to use a 3D printer to lay down the etch resist on blank circuit board? 

If so it would make prototyping one-off's easier, and it would do registration between top and bottom on two sided boards perfectly.

My question is 1) will the stock melt enough to be sealed agains the copper.  2) has anyone tried it?  Will the stock be removable at the end?

This just seems so much easier that photo and toner transfer methods, and the printers are getting cheaper and can handle pretty large areas.

bb

We have a 3d printer here, but we also have a pcb milling machine, so they probably won't want to try. I found this on the web:
http://techcrunch.com/2013/11/11/ex1/
A 3d printer for pcbs, but that lays down the trace, not the resist.

there is a kickstarter going on for the very subject... 8)

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/cartesianco/the-ex1-rapid-3d-printing-of-circuit-boards

pucho812 and walter

Thanks - both links are for product EX1, it lays down traces in a two parts that react to form conductive silver. I don't want to be on the brave new world of "does this stuff last, will the traces fall off I.E. will the traces be durable and how resistive is the material and how expensive etc.  (Think of those conductive trace repair pens).

I saw a 3D printer in "You Do It Electronics" in Newton Highlands, and it seemed to have very precise placement capability and I began to wonder, here is the idea in more detail.

I do self etch but it has several problems.  1 hazmat disposal  (but my town does that ).  2 - toner transfer I get bad traces unless super thick. 3 Photo resist - works ok, but very time consuming multi step process.  4 - lastly - both photo and toner methods DON'T allow registration of the top and bottom images very well.

I am pretty sure the material used in the FUSING 3D printers is waterproof but (but will it resist ferric chloride? or another etch?).  I just want to know whether it "sticks" to the base surface well enough to seal against etch. 

I suppose if I do 1 sided, I can use a heat gun from the bottom and get a better fuse (I do this with the toner process with some success.) but for two sided boards that would be a problem.

I am imagining that I could use a 3D printer like this:

1) Print the Negative image of the TOP COPPER (registering the part by sliding it against an angle stuck on the table/platen).  Then do the BOTTOM COPPER.
2) Etch the board
3) Remove the 3D part (a really thin 3d part... (how to dissolve? Acetone?)


(Optionally - Print a silkscreen legend for placment. Print a solder paste stencil for Surface mount.(probably couldn't use it as soldermask, because it melts)?

I know these printers are "slow" but In this case we are talking about printing a very thin layer, perhaps only several layers of material.  I think this could take what is a time consuming process, unreliable process, with lots of steps and different materials and make it simply "print and etch".  Still have the etch to dispose of, but if it worked well, it would be much nicer for prototypes.

So my question for someone with the knowledge or the ability to test is:

1) Will the fusing material resist etch (I typically use ferric chloride).
2) Will the fusing material stick to the copper or will it just fall off?
3) Can the material be removed and how? (Acetone? Heat? Peel off?)
4) Is the material porous?  How many layers to print to get a good seal against etch?
5) Anyone want to try? ( I could help,  send a test file etc, and a two sided copper board.)

You may be the pioneer on this front, which puts you in the enviable position of being the first to try it - probably the only way you'll really know.

Will "You Do It" allow you to try out their machine on a PCB?
If I had a 3D printer, i'd be trying it straightaway and let you know.  Hopefully someone here will chime in.

Answers:
1.) Yes
2.) Yes(?) Mabye? Is copperclad sufficiently similar to kapton tape? No experience here, just hopeful thinking.
3.) Yes, but experimentation required. Not acetone, something more physical / less chemical.
4.) I'd start with 2 layers.
5.) I wish. Eyeing those 3D printers. Can't justify it as a business expense just yet....

questions said:

1) Will the fusing material resist etch (I typically use ferric chloride).
2) Will the fusing material stick to the copper or will it just fall off?
3) Can the material be removed and how? (Acetone? Heat? Peel off?)
4) Is the material porous?  How many layers to print to get a good seal against etch?
5) Anyone want to try? ( I could help,  send a test file etc, and a two sided copper board.)

Click to expand...

After watching the video:
  The EX1 is super amazing. But I'd probably never buy one. Y?  1.) Surface mount is for people with better eyesight than me. 2.) Inkjets clog like a mohterf**kr. 3.) 30 minutes to print a small design renders the EX1 useful for prototyping only. And prototyping with copper clad is already pretty easy.

But Bruce - YOUR IDEA is actually a really good one.
With 3d-printed etch resist, you could quickly whip out prototypes or small custom runs without messing with Press N Peel, or Pulsar toner transfer paper. And you'd get high resolution, thin traces - as good as photoresist without messing with UV exposure, developing chemicals etc. 

+1 on this being a good idea - probably even the best idea yet for using 3dprinters in our area...

Jakob E.

Heads up, a $200 3D printer is on the horizon:
http://www.qu-bd.com/

gyraf said:

+1 on this being a good idea - probably even the best idea yet for using 3dprinters in our area...

Click to expand...

I have designed and printed collet knobs, and am going to print small convex diffusion rings for going around the base of a capsule holder inside a headbasket. I have also printed a small speaker chamber and have a desktop folded horn full range enclosure rattling around in my head. There are uses for us!

don

ps. I have never self etched but if there is a way to paint or draw the stuff on, some machines can be adapted to hold things other than a hotend.

hakanai said:

ps. I have never self etched but if there is a way to paint or draw the stuff on, some machines can be adapted to hold things other than a hotend.

Click to expand...

Well, a light plotter comes to mind.

kato said:

You may be the pioneer on this front, which puts you in the enviable position of being the first to try ...h

Click to expand...

Well as my dad always says... The pioneers get all the best arrows ...

While we are at it how about A nice face plate embossed look using the 3-D material as the ink. on a faceplate.

Black anodized plate nice printing in some light color. Would it stick? I'm really surprised that nobody has one of these yet. I saw one for 750 bucks at our local electronics store you do it electronics

Another v. good idea.

Still trying to suss if stickage is ensured.
A smooth surface covered in kapton tape is recommended. although some use 3M blue painters tape. A heated platform is required for ABS. Seems you should be able to stick down the PCB in such a manner to allow heat transfer, if it's even required with PVA.

The Flashforge is looking like a bargain. It has said heated platform and can maintain temps of 120˚ while printing. it's stupidly cheap, but there's no engrish language support.

this would be great if it works!  just did a toner transfer pcb today and was thinking how much more pleasant it would be printing right on the copper-clad.

I was thinking in conductive marker in any 2.5D or 3D cartesian robot, for prototyping, will be quicker than any other method, one pass should work and no need for any special expensive tool, not a extruder nor this ink jet, (I'm planing to build a CNC) but for anyone with a 3D printer or CNC could be easily done... even the 2D with an solenoid would do the trick, for small boards with 2 old CD readers may be enought!

JS

Besides how well the "stuff" adheres to the black anodized panel, you have to consider how sturdy the "stuff" itself is, so that it doesn't flake off when fingertips brush across it for years and years.

White silkscreen printing on black anodized panels has been the norm for decades, and I see older mixing desks where the lettering has worn off in areas with heavy usage (like around the CR speaker level control pot).

Bri

Apparently something called Ninjaflex, an elastomeric rubber filament, will print resist for FR4 copper clad board and flexible boards too.

From the article

PLA, Nylon, ABS and most common filaments used for 3d printing do not stick to copper well enough to lay down a pattern that can be etched to create a circuit board. A fairly new elastomeric rubber filament is now available that sticks quite well to copper. It is called Ninjaflex. In fact, it sticks quite well to almost anything including acrylic, blue painters tape, and glass.

A circuit board pattern can be drawn in a free program like 123D Design and then extruded to a thin thickness and saved as an STL file. It can then be printed on top of a thin copper clad board or plated conductive fabric: step 1 pic. It can then be etched in the standard way with a Ferric Chloride solution.

Click to expand...

http://www.instructables.com/id/Make-Flexible-Circuit-Boards-Using-A-3D-Printer/