Dav BG1

[lagoausente]

Matt, who told I was not thinking about building the Green pre? It was the first thread I have opened today, and before this one. It´s logical I will not be asking there for a schematic or pcb the already exists, but the fact that you are not reading me about the Green doesn´t mean I was not doing to build. It is the first I going to build as everybody suggested.

In the other hand, about cloning the DAV you may have reason, I gived just an opinion about what Frank asked, nothing more. I´m not more interested on building a DAV clone, than building a Green than upgrading my Mp20. I just want to do all, along the time, just that.
I have looked already at the Kev desing, and i found it interesting also. My main interested is just this:

Seize the oportunity that you have already experience on desings to learn posible diferences beteen the DAV, Green the Kev project and any other preamps based on similar IC, and fine out if the fervour of some guys for this box it´s justified or not. And THATS ALL MY INTENTION!!!
And please, don´t try to read minds.., I was reading the Green pre thread before reading this one..

PD: I´m also interested about getting a very low noise DC-DC converter , if you have experience on this and can help i would thank:
http://www.groupdiy.com/index.php?topic=20083

 

[SALSA]

FWIW

Main differences and similarities I've seen in SSM2017 designs like Kev's, a number of Rane preamps, SPL GoldMike, TLAudio C1, Elektor etc. :

• - a different protection schema at the input
  - different value and type of the capacitor(s) in the gain control
  - with or without servo
  - in many cases followed by a fixed gain stage (SPL = tube)
  - diferent power supply capacity (capacitor value + psu voltage)
  - in most case they output to a DRV134 or similar

Cheers,

Mike

 

[matta]

And please, don´t try to read minds.., I was reading the Green pre thread before reading this one..

Great! So was I, I mean reading the thread, not reading people's minds :green:

RE trying to discover the differences between the various IC pres and doing tests A/B's etc, it is not my thing. I'd be interested in lsiting the samples, but I have better things to do than make them.

I have over 18 pres now!!! Most of which are DIY, Green Pres, Neve's, API's, Hamptones and racked some older modules from the likes of Telefunken and Spectra Sonics, so my pres are covered for now... onwards and upwards to other projects :thumb: Wrapped up my 1176, GSSL and onto the LA-2A now...

Cheers

Matt

 

[lagoausente]

RE trying to discover the differences between the various IC pres and doing tests A/B's etc, it is not my thing. I'd be interested in lsiting the samples, but I have better things to do than make them.

I have over 18 pres now!!! Most of which are DIY, Green Pres, Neve's, API's, Hamptones and racked some older modules from the likes of Telefunken and Spectra Sonics, so my pres are covered for now... onwards and upwards to other projects Heck Yeah! Wrapped up my 1176, GSSL and onto the LA-2A now...

Nice really.
But also there are other guys who have posted his interest on the issue. I mean sample comparisons, and some "mystery" around the box for the reviews/price ratio.
Forgetting the "pcb cloning" and centering the discussing about pure techichal issues, I just think as interesting to find if it´s any type of compression, or frequency depending compression on it. Hearing the samples I can apreciate clear less attack than the other preamps, aswell a sweet sound but at the same time detailed. Very low levels on vocals can be heared better, like the room reverb o the tail, and even still much less agressive than the other pres.
My Mp20 has a knob called IDDS, something that controls the current of the drenador of...(don´t remember exactly) that is designed to get a more "warm" sound, and try to reproduce the valve sound.
I thought on the DAV circuit that maybe could have something like this, but fixed.
Returning to the "legal" discussion, I think would be more correct to use this circuit only to get another new one improved. I mean, if has a game like the IDDS current one, but just different or new technique would be a good thing to take it out to any other new desings.
My opinion is that if you don´t want to public the schematic it´s really no so important. If the guys that have experience on designs, can discuss it privately, and find something "new" in it, that can be useful for any other new or existing pre, would worth the pity.
There are two thoughts about this box,
1) it´s just another INA217 based design
2) it´s a IC based with something special.

I just think it´s 2nd option, and seems there are other guys who have expressed the same feeling along the thread. Just depends now on guys who have access to the box/schematic and who have knowledge and experience to determine if it´s option 1, or 2.

 

[craigmorris74]

I don't think there's going to be a magic bullet in there that makes this thing great. There are successful implementations of tone shaping features on premps, such as the Chandler Germanium feedback control, and the Portico "Silk" button. One is a very basic circuit adjustment, the other was made by Mr. Neve. All the "warm" knobs on low-end boxes are typically for marketing purposes.
Sounds like we have a case of a nice IC in a simple, clean circuit with solid, carfully chosen components. If you do the the same thing, you'll get something along those lines, as in the Green Pre, Seventh Circle C84, etc.
I would be stunned to find the DAV pres used some kind of gimmick circuit to achieve their great sound. I know that's what you're fishing for, but I doubt you'll find it.

 

[lagoausente]

Sounds like we have a case of a nice IC in a simple, clean circuit with solid, carfully chosen components. If you do the the same thing, you'll get something along those lines, as in the Green Pre, Seventh Circle C84, etc.
I would be stunned to find the DAV pres used some kind of gimmick circuit to achieve their great sound. I know that's what you're fishing for, but I doubt you'll find it.

For being just another IC, have got very good result in the real world: http://www.gearslutz.com/board/showthread.php?t=69393

It has an extrange clean warm that takes the details up.


I´m going now for the Supergreen. Maybe I´ll make the Dual Mic pre after.

 

[glbaudio]

here a pict from a BG2 (4 ch version) buyed recently...as u can see now they mount That 1510

 

[bockaudio]

Thrilled I sold mine, not that it helps you fix one. IIR it had an issue with running true balanced, or something non-pro on the output interface.

 

[lagoausente]

Wow!  have passed 10 years!!!..

Forgot to tell Matt I built long time ago both, Green and Ina217 preamps in a 4 four channel rack. Replaced the Ina with the That chip that´s mote linear then the Ina
Also modded the Presonus with ADA4627 opamp (using a dip soic adapter).
 
FWIW,  if Matt is still around.., they sound totally different, and  both my Apollo integrated preamps and even my Usbpre2 portable interface are for me quite better.
The "BG-x" Ina/That preamp sounds very clean but too bright. I omitted the Opa275, so I guess if have something to do in the sound, since the datasheet of the Ina chip says it´s all for DC offset output voltage and don´t affect the sound, but I wonder.

I used the external Presonus M80 for supply both the Presonus and the DIY rack.
I´m plenty of preamps now, so if anyone is interested I could put it on the blackmarket (the four channels without Psu).
The green is the "supergreen" one, used low esr caps, Wima caps and the best components recomended, also upgraded the opamps.