How are y'all getting your TT jacks and cable? I assume nobody here is paying 10 bucks US for a cable that you need 48 or more of in some instances. What's the solution here?
DIY TT/Bantam Cables
- Thread starter StarTrucker
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tgs
Well-known member
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- May 30, 2013
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If it's something I learned from switching from 6.3mm to bantam patches, it's that there's nothing cheap about it. Someone will probably want to shoot me but I've been using Hosa cables mostly and you get an 8-pack for like 50-60. So a bit cheaper than what you mentioned. I've also made some of my own TT but only for special connections (mainly TT to XLR). But it's definitely not a cheap workaround in any sense as the connectors are very expensive.
NoisyIndividual
Well-known member
Last time I investigated this, I also found the rewireable connectors very expensive.
And you need to be careful as some require additional tooling as well, which may or may not be obvious when you buy them.
Unless things have changed since then, pre-made moulded cables are way way cheaper, and you can cut them in half to make bantam to XLR converters.
Such is life.
And you need to be careful as some require additional tooling as well, which may or may not be obvious when you buy them.
Unless things have changed since then, pre-made moulded cables are way way cheaper, and you can cut them in half to make bantam to XLR converters.
Such is life.
soapfoot
Well-known member
I use these molded ones from eBay… multi-colored assortment with gold-plated connectors (not sure who makes them)
They’re the cheapest and probably low quality but they work fine
TT cables are the most annoying expensive thing almost no matter how you do it
They’re the cheapest and probably low quality but they work fine
TT cables are the most annoying expensive thing almost no matter how you do it
pucho812
Well-known member
I roll my own. it's pretty easy over all.
I use canare cable, I'll have a part number when I get home. it's basically their quad cable with braided shield.
I also use redco ends which assemble exactly like a standard 1/4" switchcraft connection with a screw on boot.
I have made them for myself and my place, I have made them for clients. They all like the end results.
I can easily do a picture book PDF on how to do so if you are interested.
I use canare cable, I'll have a part number when I get home. it's basically their quad cable with braided shield.
I also use redco ends which assemble exactly like a standard 1/4" switchcraft connection with a screw on boot.
I have made them for myself and my place, I have made them for clients. They all like the end results.
I can easily do a picture book PDF on how to do so if you are interested.
Guilty of using Hosas myself. More colors on the ends, cheaper than anything. I do have Mogamis for the longer patches but honestly don't hear a difference. Had a few Hosas die, but just chucked them and still wound up ahead.
If I were in a pro and not a project studio, I'd probably want the top notch stuff for reliability.
Also, since we're talking cables and TT and it's only slightly off-topic - I just just finished soldering 12 DB25s and wanted an 8 channel TT fanout from RCA, and another from XLR for my tape machines to patch bay. Really was over soldering at this point and found these guys: https://www.harpooncables.com/
Quality job, pretty inexpensive considering. The cable doesn't have the flex of a mogami, but I'll take it.
If I were in a pro and not a project studio, I'd probably want the top notch stuff for reliability.
Also, since we're talking cables and TT and it's only slightly off-topic - I just just finished soldering 12 DB25s and wanted an 8 channel TT fanout from RCA, and another from XLR for my tape machines to patch bay. Really was over soldering at this point and found these guys: https://www.harpooncables.com/
Quality job, pretty inexpensive considering. The cable doesn't have the flex of a mogami, but I'll take it.
+1. I do same as Pucho. Must be an LA thing. I’ve tried Hosa- about 20% were wired to invert polarity and all failed within a few weeks of regular use. That was 10 years ago, so maybe they’ve gotten better.
So am I missing something when Samson TRS patch bays are 85 bucks on reverb? DIY TRS cables are dirt cheap. Got 5 switchcraft 9625 bays with my console purchase and wondering what the main reason is to go forward with TT besides it being "pro industry standard"
pucho812
Well-known member
Simple, can get more connections in a 1ru if you are using TT.
NoisyIndividual
Well-known member
Back in the day I used to wire Protools installs in colleges and Universities.
I used to estimate on being able to make 100 connections per day on site, that is wiring 100 XLRs, or 100 cables to a TT bantam patchbay, 12 x DSUBs, whatever. All fully sleeved.
Of course the days work also involved measuring and cutting cables etc, but that turned out to be a pretty good indication of what you could do in a day.
So I could have made 50 bantam patch leads on site for the price of a days wireman labour, but then you have to buy 100 bantams, cable, sleeving, solder etc.
Now here I could order 50 bantam patch leads for £111.60, inc tax and delivery, less than a daily wiremans rate labour alone.
https://www.designacable.com/rean-n...UKNr2Dq6r8g1iZ8yat09t4XK4heqdquEaAlh3EALw_wcB
But yeah, the point of Bantams is you can get 96 of them in 1U so you can have a reasonable sized rack instead of a monster.
I used to estimate on being able to make 100 connections per day on site, that is wiring 100 XLRs, or 100 cables to a TT bantam patchbay, 12 x DSUBs, whatever. All fully sleeved.
Of course the days work also involved measuring and cutting cables etc, but that turned out to be a pretty good indication of what you could do in a day.
So I could have made 50 bantam patch leads on site for the price of a days wireman labour, but then you have to buy 100 bantams, cable, sleeving, solder etc.
Now here I could order 50 bantam patch leads for £111.60, inc tax and delivery, less than a daily wiremans rate labour alone.
https://www.designacable.com/rean-n...UKNr2Dq6r8g1iZ8yat09t4XK4heqdquEaAlh3EALw_wcB
But yeah, the point of Bantams is you can get 96 of them in 1U so you can have a reasonable sized rack instead of a monster.
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I would love to know what canare cable you are using and how you find the redco ends. Have you used the Neutirk ends and do you have an opinion about the redco vs neutrik? I was just about to pull the plug on ordering a bunch of Neutrik ends and I'm not seeing that the redco ends are significantly less expensive.
Honestly, I would take as much information about building these as possible.
Be careful with Neutrik bantams. The Neutrik plugs with the chrome sleeve thing on the back end of them need a special tool to close them up.
These are the plugs I was looking at. Thank you so much for the heads up Rob Flinn, that would have been a costly mistake for me - I had the instructions for the plastic sleeve cables.
https://www.mouser.ca/ProductDetail/568-NP3TT-1-B
I didn't realize that you needed an $800 USD tool set to put them together.
I'm not sure why but Don Audio has the same kit on their website for 143,42 €
Not sure why there would be such a difference in price.
These ones don't require that tool just an RG58 crimping tool: NP3TT-P-AU-B - assembly instructions here
https://www.mouser.ca/ProductDetail/568-NP3TT-1-B
I didn't realize that you needed an $800 USD tool set to put them together.
I'm not sure why but Don Audio has the same kit on their website for 143,42 €
Not sure why there would be such a difference in price.
These ones don't require that tool just an RG58 crimping tool: NP3TT-P-AU-B - assembly instructions here
pucho812
Well-known member
(Canare part number)
Canare L-4E5C
(Redco TT with screw on metal boot)
https://www.redco.com/Redco-TT-Bantam-Male-Solder-Type.html
1. Remove the outer jacket on the cable. As you only have so much in the TT end, I measure, mark it and cut.
2. Debraid the shield and remove any non needed materials in the cable. Canare runs some cloth threads through the cable, I imagine for some sort of physical protection. only remove up to the where you removed the outer jacket. I debraid with a dental pic I picked up at the auto parts store for working on engines.
3. Trim the wires to length. White is always tip, blue is always ring. the two whites tin together, the two blues tin together. The middle connection is tip, the upper connection is ring, the ground connection is crimped.
4. Tin connector
5. Solder wires to connector. The middle connection is tip, the upper connection is ring, the ground connection is crimped.
6. Best way to crimp the grounds is have the deb raided shield folded back over the outer jacket.
7. Once soldered and crimp screw the boot on.
So here is an example to give you an overview.
The Neutrik TT's with the plastic boot do not need a special tool to close them unless they have changed designs. I usually just solder tip and ring and then I crimp the TT shaft with the shield running outside of the cable jacket. I have been doing it that way with a BNC crimper for a long time. Then the plastic boot just slides over and locks into place. the pain in the ass is if you have to take the boot back off for any reason. That might be the special tool you mention. I have gotten around that with a flat screw driver but it leaves the boot looking ugly.
Nevermind we are thinking two different TT designs from Neutrik.
I have used the following. It has the plastic boot I mention.
https://www.redco.com/Neutrik-NP3TT-P-B-NP3TT-P-B1.html
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To be clear the type that need the special tool are these https://www.neutrik.com/en/product/np3tt-1-b
& this is the tool you need https://www.neutrik.com/en/product/hx-tt-1 which in the U.K is available for £520 excluding VAT (ouch) from Canford audio. £520 is actually the cheapest U.K price, I have seen them for much more than that !!
I have terminated loads of the other type (https://www.canford.co.uk/Products/43-198_NEUTRIK-NP3TT-P-B-BANTAM-JACK-PLUG-Black) that you are talking about & they are no problem. I always specify them when I build cables for clients.
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moamps
Well-known member
The real reason why TRS patch panels are not used over bantam is that bantam panels are far better and more reliable (they were created back in the days of manual analog telephone switchboards). TRS should not be used for microphone patching (especially with phantom power on).
pucho812
Well-known member
telephone and TT still exhibit the same issue of patching when phantom is on. This is because one side shorts to ground as you connect in. The Same happens in a TRS environment.
In General most TRS bays consist of TRS jacks soldered to a PCB. this is for easy changing of the normals on most setups, just flip the PCB around. The problem here, is over time, the TRS jacks break at the solder connection to the PCB causing drop outs or worse. At a gig long ago, we had a room specifically wired with lots of TRS patch bays from DBX, Behringer, etc. We eventually tossed out all brands except behringer, oddly enough their 1/4 TRS bays never broke but the others, I would have to resolder jacks every month.
pucho812
Well-known member
thank you for that. always good to learn new stuff. As you have done both kinds from Neutrik. Is there an advantage to the one you mention?
moamps
Well-known member
You're talking about another problem here. I'm talking about the easier creation of metal oxide dirt diodes on TRS contacts that create interruptions and interference in the small signal from the microphone.
As I said TT patch bays are far more reliable and TRS can't be compared to them at all. Quality TT bays have crossing normalling contacts, while TRS bays are plain BS in that sense. Also TTs have far greater contact pressure forces and are made of far better material. TRS contacts are often made of iron alloy with a poor chrome finish or similar. My 2 cents.
