Dongle DAC as balanced output

[Tubetec]

I found the 'invert phase second output ' checkbox on the sig generator in REW ,
That allows any sound card provide a mono balanced out from the standard stereo unbalanced connection .
A quick check showed a -6db signal between each output and ground ,which is just whats expected .
It also has a psuedo balanced input option which subtracts the noise that appears on the second input from the primary input .
there both very usefull features .

The better DACS with TRRRS are much more money , x5 , x10 or more the price of the Apple , it just doesnt add up for me .

The Apple device requires no driver , there is no native Asio ,
Many of the functions of the DAC remain hidden , including other sample rates and DSP processing parameters .
Im giving WISCE from Cirrus a try ,
Seems like health and safety in the EU limits the Apple dongle output to 0.5V , the USA model is different .

 

[Tubetec]

https://piunikaweb.com/2021/01/28/i...option-to-turn-off-headphones-safety-setting/

 

[thor.zmt]

Apparently, the ones with a 4.4mm TRRRS have two balanced outputs, so no need for two separate units nor for ASIO aggregator.

Correct, hence my recommendation.

The CS43131 is an "all in one" chip (DAC, Headphone Amp/Line Driver and Powersupply from a single 5v or Battery input.

Very little chance to mess up anything as essentially nothing left to the discretion of the the "designer" if using standard designs.

It offers well over 120dB SNR and and better -100dB THD, 2V out into 600 Ohm SE and comes with a balanced dual mode for two chips designed in.

Balanced mode gives 4V (+14dBu) line out with ability to drive lowish impedances, including for example a pair of Jensen 1:1 line insulation transformers to isolate computer and audio.

While Cirrus Logic badged, the chip is basically a Wolfson Micro design (British) and has the same sound quality as the other WM chips.

Thor

 

[thor.zmt]

The better DACS with TRRRS are much more money , x5 , x10 or more the price of the Apple , it just doesnt add up for me .

First, you only need one dongle, so it's 2.5 x to 5 x the price of the Apple thingy, which drops your SNR by an extra 6dB for free and is decidedly "consumer grade" in the negative sense of the word. Plus, when Apple decide the dongle is obsolete and you need to buy a new one it just stops working.

And the more expensive dongle gives balanced output from any source and app and has genuinely high end performance better than many affordable Pro sound cards, for so little money that it is hard to gave a decent night out in Thailand for the money, never mind Europe or the States etc.

Thor

 

[Tubetec]

The Apple headphone adapters are different in EU and US ,
The EU version only puts out 0.5V , the US version puts out 6db more at 1V , its all EU health and safety related .
In any case I'm not looking to drive headphones with it so hearing damage isnt an issue .

I contacted Apple to try and get full technical specs on the differences between the US and EU models ,
they have opened a case and say they should be able to arrange to supply me with the US version if I want .

Using the apple dongle in mono balanced gets me back +6db , thats +8dbv from the apple , It might be enough for my needs in this instance .
Im waiting for E1DA's Cosmos Dac to become available before spending any money .

Ahahah , the cost of the apple dongle wouldnt buy me two pints of beer here in Ireland ,
Cheers all the same Thor !

 

[abbey road d enfer]

Im waiting for E1DA's Cosmos Dac to become available before spending any money .

You may have to wait a long time. Ivan has been lead astray by the decibel-splitter brigade.

 

[Tubetec]

How has the Cosmos ADC worked out for you Abbey ?
Hopefully it hasnt been relegated to door stop duties yet .

 

[thor.zmt]

Im waiting for E1DA's Cosmos Dac to become available before spending any money .

Well, on paper at least the CS43131 in dual Mono balanced mode gives on paper -115dB THD&N @ 0dBFS and has over 130dB DNR.

And even better, it doesn't use ESS DAC. In my view, these ones generally measure great but sound between so-so (only for use in low end consumer gear) to hilarious dummy sound (totally unnatural and fake with music).

I always preferred Wolfson Micro to ESS by a large margin. In the end up to you.

I charge 60 USD / Hour basic rate. The time I'd have to invest on getting the apple stuff to work and the sheer hassle factor vs. one hour worth of work, to quote the long defined first choice holiday add: "I know what my first choice would be!"

https://m.pt.aliexpress.com/item/1005004981325571.html

This looks pukka enough. Check measured performance.

But as they say in the kingdom of Oz, different strokes for different blokes.

Speaking of Apples and dongles, some comic relief:



Thor

 

[abbey road d enfer]

How has the Cosmos ADC worked out for you Abbey ?
Hopefully it hasnt been relegated to door stop duties yet .

Certainly not! It's part of my current set-up, with a Topping E30 DAC. Using Flex ASIO aggregator.

 

[Tubetec]

Youre not wrong Thor ,
Ive already wasted lots of time running round to different places scrounging up this and that , then more time trying to get the USB c device play nice with Antique Windows , it obviously needs a two part driver, the section relating to the HID volume remote which was sensed, installed correctly and allowed access to the Windows audio mixer the first time I plugged the device in , then the audio driver tries to load and the device appears as Apple USB to 3.5mm audio but the device drivers wont start and that ends up knocking out the remote function ,

The device itself only reveals the functionality to the OS as the sense wires find either remote , headphones or mic attached ,
Once you prang the driver detect and load sequence the device remains hung up and broken on the system ,
It seems to me the basic building blocks to make this device function are there within Win 7 , its just they get loaded up and archived in the wrong sequence and that breaks the OS's abillity to load the device until you reload the entire USB stack , its usually easier just to start with a fresh install of windows at that point ,

Ive been round this loop many times , with this and other consumer garbage I try to repurpose , its a bit like graffiti on a toilet wall that says wall that says "bang head here' , for me its all about the challenge and giving two fingers upto the power ,

If I can trick windows into only loading one component of the Apple dongle at a time , then extract the various system files required at each stage
I may be able to repackage those components into a proper working driver with software called Libusbk , thats the theory anyway ,


Abbey,
I believe Ivan Cosmos has now sorted out the issue with the ADC Comtrue USB bridge and native Asio functionality ,
he now provides a Windows firmware driver update so the Flexasio work around isnt required .

 

[Brian Roth]

https://external-content.duckduckgo...23ffe696097a0aaa602374ea0dc29ac70c&ipo=images

<g>

Bri

 

[abbey road d enfer]

Abbey,
I believe Ivan Cosmos has now sorted out the issue with the ADC Comtrue USB bridge and native Asio functionality ,
he now provides a Windows firmware driver update so the Flexasio work around isnt required .

I believe we're not on the same page here.
I use FlexASIO as it allows using two drivers for separate DAC and ADC. I don't know exactly what the issue was with the Comtrue driver, but I think it is what I use, aggregated with the Topping driver within FlexASIO.
AFAIK, an aggregator is mandatory when using separate ASIO drivers...? I never considered it as a workaround, just a necessary niuisance.

 

[Tubetec]

Yes your right sorry , the Comtrue driver isnt Asio compatible and will always require either Asio4all or Flexasio .
Ivan did make several firmware updates to the ADC which came after you purchased your unit , it does open up a few extra features and makes some minor changes in other parameters , he probably does reccomend the updated firmware for best performance .

The thing about the Cosmos ADC is it was concieved as an audio measurement device from the outset ,not a hifi add-on , there isnt the usual bandwidth imitation you find in consumer gear ,


As far as getting Windows 7 to say bonjour to the Apple dongle dac headphoness ,only limited success,
I have found a stable USB HID driver that allows the Apple headphone remote to control the volume in windows and the play/pause functions within the itunes software , which I had to download and install -(
No sound driver


You can read the descriptors of any USB audio device with this really handy tool from Thesycon ,

https://www.thesycon.de/eng/usb_descriptordumper.shtml
Cant I just put a shell around what the descriptor dumper s***s out and turn it into usable driver on my system ?
Windows 10 allows driver creation with legacy OS compatibility ,
Universal Windows Drivers for Audio - Windows drivers,
I cant allow WIN 10 into my life , maybe someone else might give it a try if they have the hardware lying around .

 

[abbey road d enfer]

The thing about the Cosmos ADC is it was concieved as an audio measurement device from the outset ,not a hifi add-on , there isnt the usual bandwidth imitation you find in consumer gear ,

That's my principal reason for choosing it, also with the absence of any knobs.

 

[Gold]

How has the Cosmos ADC worked out for you Abbey ?
Hopefully it hasnt been relegated to door stop duties yet .

I just installed the Cosmos ADC. It came up in 1 channel mode. I downloaded the Tweak software and was able to change it to 2 channel mode, but when I close Tweak it reverts back to 1 channel mode. I don't see any way to save the last used settings in tweak. Anyone else seeing this?

 

[Tubetec]

Ive been on a break from everything online lately , Apple updates gazumped my data allocation for the month in 24 hours flat , so I decided to take a break from the online world for a while .
Ive been able to get the Mac pro 6.1 up and running but still have an issue with the internal Nvme SSD drive , which is encrypted and not available .

As expected the Apple dongle dacs are picked up by mac OS quickly
My latest idea is to use them to create a spring reverb natively without he need for drivers or heavy processing on the mac,
L,R configured as balanced output should drive the spring fairly well and the mic input works as the recovery channel .
A custom wound drive coil would would be nice as off the shelf impedences dont suit all that well the dongle output .
The dongle itself can easily live inside the reverb tank , keeping the signal path from the recovery transducer down to a few cm , the mic input features an input with variable frontend gain via software, over a range of 33db .
A usb hub could allow several spring tanks be used at once remotely , the nice thing is no heavy reverb algo needs to run on the computer so saves on processing power and of course you can easily apply eq or compression/gating via VST to the drive or recovery channels if you want , so lots of sonic possibillities there .

More info to follow once I dig out a few different reverb tanks I have stashed away for testing .

 

[thor.zmt]

Ive been on a break from everything online lately , Apple updates gazumped

Maybe time to embrace Linux?

Thor

 

[Tubetec]

Mac OS is brand new to me , so I might as well get the basics down while I'm at it .
I would like to try linux for a dedicated recording setup at some stage .