I'm lusting for a 1" tape machine

[millzners]

Someone wanna talk me off the ledge?  I'm of the generation that grew up recording digital, going back to highschool.  I've never actually physically seen a reel to reel recorder.  The only experience I have recording analog is via an old consumer cassette deck that we made our first recordings on before we realized the sound cards on our parents' PC's had input jacks.  We went off the deep end from there.

Anyway, I've grown tired of plugins and staring at waveforms and constantly tweaking and editing every little thing and always concerned about the newest plugin or the newest update to my DAW.  I want a 1" 8 track Otari and a couple home-made preamps and the satisfaction of getting a good take and knowing that's the end of it, no more tweaking, slicing, or fine tuning.  I'll still use the computer b/c it's a good tool and it's great to get scratch takes and compose things with, and I'm sure I'll be reamping soft synths to tape...  But I just can't resist the urge to buy a tape machine any longer.

Any serious analog aficionados around?  Has anyone already been through this same story and have good/bad stories to report?  I'm pretty much set on an MX-70, which means I'll probably be hunting for one for quite some time. 

 

[pucho812]

Otari 1" machines are nice. very nice indeed. But you may also consider sutder's, MCI's and ampex machines. 1" is the professional standard of 1/8" an inch per track.

 

[pstamler]

And Scully. "Brown Sugar" was recorded on a 1" 8-track Scully, and doesn't sound half bad.

Peace,
Paul

 

[pucho812]

And Scully. "Brown Sugar" was recorded on a 1" 8-track Scully, and doesn't sound half bad.

Peace,
Paul

I did not know that. interesting

 

[lassoharp]

Go for it.  My history is opposite of yours.  I've used virtually all analog since 1989.  When I started with Logic/mac several years ago it was a challenge to get the same full pleasant sonic character back into the recordings.  With analog I could get it with modest mid grade outboard gear.  With the DAW it required using the top shelf stuff and more meticulous engineering.

1" 8 track is an excellent format.  I own a Scully 8 track that sounds wonderful - when it's working.  To the next point - they are relatively high maintenance.  Investigate your service tech options and use someone who knows your model well. 

If you're mainly doing personal recording, recording to analog and then dumping to DAW is an outstanding work method.  DAW seems to handle transfer much better than tracking and you can reuse the master tape many times before serious degradation.  This obviously saves big $$ on tape costs.

 

[gar381]

Once 8 track (or 2"-16) NEVER BACK !!

(But then I'm an bit of a biased old fart and have known the joys of 2" 16.  Digital sounds like
#%$@*& crap to me.)

GARY

 

[pucho812]

Once 8 track (or 2"-16) NEVER BACK !!

(But then I'm an bit of a biased old fart and have known the joys of 2" 16.  Digital sounds like
#%$@*& crap to me.)

GARY

yeah it's like driving a real sports car and then going back to a junker

 

[man-bot]

A 1" Otari would be nice for sure!  I too was an all digital user (post my Tascam 424 era) for probably the past 10 years, finally decided to try the tape way a few months back and bought a Teac 80-8.  

Certainly not anywhere near as nice as the Otari, but 8 tracks on 1/2" tape.  The tape cost an be a bit prohibitive (1/2" rolls of RMGI run about $120 a pop new in Toronto - thats about 30 mins @ 15 IPS) but working in the format is great. I have found my (amatuerish) mixes have come out a heck of a lot better going from my soundrcraft board to tape (mixed back trhough the soundcraft to digital stereo track).  The whole process seems easier as far as recording and the sound seems far less harsh... there is the whole maintenance side, but for me it has been worth it.

If I could justify spending the cash to go to a 16 track deck (or more) I would in a heartbeat... but 8 tracks were enough for a lot of the music I love so I'm sure I can learn to make it work as well!

Go for it!

 

[phishman13]

Someone wanna talk me off the ledge?

Looks like everybody is chipping in to throw you the hell off! haha, sorry.

I have a Tascam 38 (8 on 1/2") that is getting to the point where its starting to fall apart bit by bit.  I love it however, when its working.  So I have been having your exact same feeling of finding a nice 8 track 1" machine to replace it with.  Something that is in a little bit better shape, and that you don't have to tear apart just to calibrate.

Like lassoharp said, I can try a lot less hard to make my tape recordings sound good, but have to keep tweaking and changing and audition different gear to get what I want straight to PC.  This of course is reciprocal in making my habits when recording analog meticulous, so I can't bash that method b/c I'm at least learning how to make things sound great no matter what the medium.

 

[ethervalve]

Any serious analog aficionados around?  Has anyone already been through this same story and have good/bad stories to report?  I'm pretty much set on an MX-70, which means I'll probably be hunting for one for quite some time. 

I love, Love, LOVE my MX70. The transport is great. It sounds awesome. It's really quick and easy to align.
But just to let you know there are two very common issues with these machines that can add a few hundred unexpected dollars to the cost of ownership.
1) each channel card uses has three unsealed relays that corrode and create this weird 'whooshing' noise. If you're not using noise reduction, you only need to replace 2 per channel. There's a sealed modern omron replacement that costs about $4.
2) the early versions of the audio card used a propriety IC that's prone to get noisy and 'crackly.' The replacement ICs were still available when I checked last but I think they cost nearly $100 each IIRC.
Also, if the pinch roller goes gooey, Athan Corp in San Fransisco has a really well made synthetic replacement.

 

[usekgb]

Dredging up an old topic but.....  I replaced two of the three relays on all of my audio cards today with the sealed Omron relays, and the random crackling noise went away.  I'm glad I found out about those relays going bad.  I was banging my head against the wall trying to figure out what was wrong with my MX-70.

 

[Spiritworks]

I envy you the MX-70. I currently have an MX5050mkIII that I am in the process of "getting on the road". 

 

[usekgb]

I've had the MX-70 for years, but nobody has wanted to do any projects on tape until now.  When I fired it up, it had relay problems.  Thankfully, my talent was very understanding and willing to wait until the repairs were completed.  This just motivated me to get it all done very quickly.

 

[jensenmann]

I was so sad when my Tascam 85-16 died. Of course in the middle of a production so I instantly bought a HD24 to not lose the artist. The day it arrived tracking started all over again. After the first take the artist looked at me like someone just stuck a knife in the middle of his heart. He was shocked (as I was). We finished the production and he never came back again. The sonic difference was so unbelievable huge. Digital was a big dissapointment for me and at this stage it was the second time this happened. In my old company we ran a small basement studio with a Fostex B16 and later changed to ADATs. That already hurt and was the reason I bought the tapedeck for my personal use.

 

[Orpheus]

I find that even "prosumer" stuff like a Tascam 38 and decent outboard makes a production almost mix itself. Without using buzzwords and stupid cliches that's the only way to put it. Rather than sitting and endlessly twiddling billions of plugins that seem to do everything except the one (indefinable) function to make the song greater than the sum of its individual parts, it just *fits*.

I bought both my decks a tascam 38 (1/2" 8track) and Otari mx5050 1/4" (2track) locally in pristine shape for very very cheap. It took some persistence and time but it happened. The tascam came with  both dbx units, a bunch of snakes, about a dozen reels of tape, a Yamaha Pm-430 mixer and a crappy 80s drum machine for $500 (!) The otari I got for $300.  Just my observation of the second hand scene in my area (Southern Ontario), finding a wider format machine might be more difficult and likely more expensive. Your mileage may (and likely definitely will) vary.

Try getting an MX5050 2track if you can, just to tide you over until you can find the multitracker of your dreams. If you still want to mix in DAW its totally great to track to, you can use it for fun tape effects like delay and flanging, its *super* easy to calibrate and since its 1/4" you can try many many different formulations of tape affordably.

 

[usekgb]

You may hate me for this.....  I picked up my MX-70 16 track with remote and snakes for $300.  The original buyer had backed out, so I was able to get it for a song.  $200 for some relays, $25 for lubricating oil, and it works great.  I'm really excited to be doing tape again.  There is definitely some magic "glue" in tape that is missing in the DAW.  I really don't even use the DAW for much.  Mostly just tracking and applying light compression and eq and stem summing before it goes back to my mixer and outboard gear.

 

[riggler]

I've got an Ampex 300 stereo machine here, and simply running a mix through it just works some real magic! I am biased up for the RMGI 911 tape and it's pretty cool. I have a smaller 601 stereo machine that I record orchestra with and I'll tell you what, it's jaw dropping!

 

[millzners]

I love when these old threads pop back up.  I never did get a "real" tape machine.  I was talking to the guy at JRF Magnetics and hunting on ebay at the time I started this thread,  but I wisely chose to back off when someone gave me an old Sony prosumer thing.  It's a total piece of crap for recording or mixdowns, but I've got a plan:  hook up a control voltage input to the motors and use it to generate some Boards of Canada warbling tape machine effects. 

I figure if I can make use of a toy tape machine I'll prove to myself I will actually use a real one.  I was afraid I'd spend just shy of $1000 on something I wouldn't have the patience to use.

 

[RRSounds]

Just a note that the Beatles' "Sgt. Pepper" was recorded on 1" 4-track tape, at 15 IPS (Telefunken and Studer decks). That was the standard at EMI at the time. No need for NR with ¼" audio tracks!!
David

 

[pucho812]

Just a note that the Beatles' "Sgt. Pepper" was recorded on 1" 4-track tape, at 15 IPS (Telefunken and Studer decks). That was the standard at EMI at the time. No need for NR with ¼" audio tracks!!
David

That machine, well those machines at emi were modified. Some mods were obvious like add wheels to make it easier to move. Other mods were adding a connector to plug it up with an oscillator when doing vari-speed and a reverse switch was added to playback tape recorded previously on a different machine which would store tape oxide out.