Mackie ultramix schemo needed !

[lolo-m]

Hi,
I bought an ultramix automation by Mackie. I would be interrested by getting the schematics to maybe be able to change the VCA's for better ones or to change a few components to get a better sounding device... It's maybe totally worthless but anyway, I hate not to have the schematics of any gear I own...
I know some of us will say it's an ugly sounding automation because it uses VCAs, some others will say exactly the oposite so I don't really care about that... It is cheap and seam to be what I'm looking for. I will have to listen it to make my own opinion.
Any help is welcome !

 

[helterbelter]

Interesting...I'd like to see that schemo as well.

I do have an Ottomix on the shelf, which should be a close relative to the Ultramix. But , the ottomix is pretty identical to the B-ringer Cybermix, circuitwise. I'm curious what the ultramix is like.

I'll have a look when I'm able to draw the circuit of the ottomix, maybe that'll help when you open up the hood of the ultramix.

(Oh, btw, it's very close to the schematic that THATCORP has published as recommendation for the VCA.)

 

[strangeandbouncy]

HI,


Ia m also interested to see schematics! have a Sony MXP2000 with eternal access to the channel vca's, and would LOVE to be able to automate it.



      Kindest regards,



    ANdyP

 

[helterbelter]

Hahaha, that's also the reason why I got into it. controlling the channelVCA's of my console. It's just not that easy, at least not in my case....

 

[helterbelter]

Lolo-M

check this.
http://www.thatcorp.com/datashts/dn116.pdf

Both the cybermix and Ottomix use the same circuit for audio. Only the componentvalues differ a bit. My guess is that the Ultramix will be the same, maybe with balancing and debalancing opamps added.

 

[lolo-m]

Lolo-M

check this.
http://www.thatcorp.com/datashts/dn116.pdf

Both the cybermix and Ottomix use the same circuit for audio. Only the componentvalues differ a bit. My guess is that the Ultramix will be the same, maybe with balancing and debalancing opamps added.

Thanks !
Interresting link for sure...
I hope this is the same circuit too (using That chips) but for sure there's no real balancing/debalancing feature in the ultramix. According to Mackie's site, it seam that the Ultramix have a balanced impedance in/out feature like this :
http://www.dself.dsl.pipex.com/ampins/balanced/balfig4b.gif
This works well when you don't have to drive too long cables so I won't certainly mod that... Studio's cables are never more than 5 meters... A real balancing/debalancing feature won't change a lot and maybe will give more noise due to additional opamps.

 

[nrgrecording]

Found something on the web...

If you want to upgrade to new vca's:
http://www.thatcorp.com/datashts/dn124.pdf
http://www.thatcorp.com/datashts/dn137.pdf

 

[phishman13]

Yeah the ultramix is loaded with a THAT 2150 for each channel.  I have one, popped the hood to see what it looked like.  I think its pretty similar to the schematic on the THAT corp site.  I think helterbelter has it pretty much nailed.  Didn't really look too hard however. 

Lolo-m, have you had luck with getting it to happily work with your computer?  If so, what's your config?  I don't have a pc with win95 or a mac with os9 to really give it a shot, but I tried having a friend of mine install in on a win95 comp and copy the folder to my XP computer (heard that worked at the mackie forums), it opens, but won't recognize the remote control so it won't work at all.  Not sure if its a software issue or hardware issue, just wondering about your experience.

I would however love to see some schematics.  Especially the midi to cv sections. (not that i know what the hell i'm looking at when it comes to the digital)  Or at least a midi implementation chart, or what parameters and channels are what CC's.  I just want to figure out a way to use it without its proprietary software, like write midi info into tracks in my Logic session with my MCU and route it out to the ultramix for console automation.  No special software, no need for its remote control.  More tightly integrated than having to have an old doorstop win95 box plus a monitor just to automate my console.

 

[lolo-m]

phishman13,
I didn't receive the Ultramix yet so I can't say anything about it except what I red elsewhere  :-[...
As I've got many old PCs at home (yes, I know, my house is full of old things because I can't throw away anything), and as I also have a Win98 I will use an extra computer to use the Mackie thing... But if you want to skip the Ultra Pilot, the MIDI implentation is explained there :
http://www.mackie.com/pdf/archive/ultramix_ApCI.pdf

Good to know there's THAT 2150 in it as it'll be easy to change them for 2180  ! Ahhh my banker will be angry again... Maybe should I think about a huge 2180 group buy  to save a few euros :...

 

[helterbelter]

Well... I'm pretty sure there are people using the ultramix with a Cubase midimapper plug-in. It's possible to use with the Otto as well.

The thing is... I've got that midimapper on a DD floppydisk for Mac, and I don't know somebody that can open it to copy it for me.....

But.
i've got a cybermix as well. The automationprogram for it was also written for Windows '95, but it does run on XP. It sure looks like ****, hahaha. My guess is that when you download the ultramix program from the Mackie site and install it, you should be able to run it.

 

[phishman13]

Considering all the stuff that I "can't" throw away, you'd think there would be a old win95 pc in there...

thanks for the info about running it around the software.  I will try and mess with it sometime soon and see what I can get happening.

Just be ready to desolder 32 that's vcas.  They are of course not socketed, so it will take forever, but totally possible.

Good luck with yours Lolo-m!

Helterbelter, have you had luck running it on XP?  I'm just curious as to what you did to get it working.  I tried running the .exe file from the website and it just makes an empty folder and the program won't work.  And the mac version is a .hqx file and my mac won't open it.

 

[lolo-m]

I've seen somewhere that Mackie's program can't install on a NTFS partition. You must have a FAT32 partition to get it installed properlly. Check if it is a FAT32 or a NTFS formated drive.

 

[phishman13]

that might be it. it was my main internal drive that was ntfs.  Experimentation time!

 

[smallbutfine]

Also consider running older OS'es in a VM (virtual machine). The virtualization stuff really evolves quite fast and can be very helpful in situations like this (if the 'compatibility modes' do not work). I guess you can even have a virtual fat32 disk without much effort.
In times of multicore processors it is an easy way to avoid dedicated hardware and sometimes you even get inter-program communication thru virtual hardware.
This is especially comfortable if you can connect virtual midi ports beween your host OS and older legacy systems.
Lots of the software of older days even runs fine in emulations nowadays thanks to modern processor power! That's the way I got even older atari stuff working on a WinXP machine. At a friends house I even saw the good old 'Notator' running inside XP...hehe, funny!
(I think in not too many years from now I will run linux as a host for everything....)

As for the older mac stuff, i once noticed that many d/l's on the web seem to be corrupted. I think this is due to lack of demand, customer feedback and server care over all the years...I always found even that corrupted execution fork stuff in downloads turned me off from the macs early...too much work to get stuff unpacked and working, too often...
Again there are good emulators for older mac OS's on linux. More and more it helps to get rid of unreliable older hardware.

Kind regards,
Martin

 

[phishman13]

Well, i fired up my ultramix today and had some good results.  I gave up on the software for it, b/c I don't need it now.  I hooked up my little uc-33e midi controller and sent it the cc's it wanted to see and got it to work for me!  I ran 2 outputs from my interface to my console tape ins, then insert to 1 & 2 on the ultra-34 rack.  When it receives cc0 and cc1 on channel 16, the midi light shows status and the channels change gain!  Now to test the rest.

Now I just need to figure out how to route a midi channel from logic to it and write cc automation inside logic.  I'm new to logic, considering ver 8 was my first!

And let me say Lolo-m, I can't really tell much difference from when the vca is inserted and when it isn't.  I will do further listening tests, and I'm all around sure that a vca upgrade WOULD help, but its not too bad from the get go.

 

[phishman13]

SO, I lied....

The VCA's are THAT 2181LC's.

Pictures coming soon.

 

[phishman13]

Here we are on VCA Avenue

 

[phishman13]

And the whole box.

 

[phishman13]

As far as the analog circuitry goes, everything is surface mount except the VCAs, their trimmers, and the electrolytic caps.  It looks like all the opamps are labeled 4560.  This could be the limiting factor on the audio path.  I guess you could change em, but (for me) the hell with de/soldering all those surface mount ic's.  There isn't much room to work.

 

[helterbelter]

Ah,well, the unit looks decently setup. Way better than the B-ringer for sure !

SMD opamp  replacement isn't that difficult, but I doubt it if it'll be worth the bucks that you'll spend on it. Maybe the caps are worth a replacement, can't see what's in it.

Better make sure that the fadermoves are the way you like it. (no zippernoise, etc.). If this is what you need, then decide if you're going to mod it, or not.