New Projects (pics)

[TomWaterman]

Nice work Handcrafted! The olimex boards look good, how did they take to soldering?

Ruairi, 500 series are interesting to lots of peeps as they may have racks already - however I've said before that a new rack should be coming with almost infinitely more flexible I/O, higher power ratings / voltage rails and will possibly accept 500 cards with an adapter as well as the new stuff.....3U though instead of 4 so its still a squeeze for controls/meters.

You may very well hear of this in a few months, its been discussed here before....but again to quote Kev "I've probably said too much".

I've also been planning a system but with an external PSU and wider modules so moving coil VU like Sifam AL20 can fit and am deciding whether to go ahead or wait for this 'promised land of new subrack'.

It seems silly to have two or three similar racks...trouble is satisfying everyones needs. Thats why DIY is so great you can design for your own specific need and not anybody elses. It only becomes a problem / balancing act if you plan to sell anything.

If 500 series are no good for what you want to do, then do it different!

Tom

 

[edanderson]

[quote author="Ptownkid"]
That is a very poor comparison....he is talking about one piece of metal that does not affect whether someone wants and eisen audio pre or a handcrafted tone pre.
[/quote]

if the HT kit didn't have a bracket or had one that didn't fit, i'm sure that would make a difference in some people's minds. by copying the eisen board dimensions and switch/pot/jack/screw layout, it is guaranteed to work with that bracket.

[quote author="Ptownkid"]
and yes, the dimensions of a bracket to fit an api lunchbox are not hard to get, nor is it difficult to draw it up in autocad.
[/quote]

you would think so, but both API themselves and OSA have ****** up 500 series card/chassis dimensions at one time or another, leading to incompatibility problems.

and buying an eisen kit and copying it is certainly easier than figuring it out yourself. just like ordering a parts kit from you is easier than ordering all the parts for the green pre from individual vendors. putting those kits together isn't "difficult" but i'm sure you charge money for that service just the same.

i don't think HT really did anything wrong by copying the eisen kit if he were just going to use it himself. but if he's going to sell PCBs that specifically work with the eisen bracket, why not buy the brackets from/with eisen? not only is it easier and cost effective, it also is the "right thing" to do.

[quote author="Ptownkid"]
Let's not forget the fact that we are cloners...
[/quote]

i would argue that the eisen kit goes beyond a simple clone. with all the transformer choices on there, and cap choices, and configuration choices, it isn't like he just copied a 312 circuit. you could make a quad eight preamp if you wanted to. or the hardy one opamp pre, from the 990 app notes. if HT or someone comes up with a working sphere opamp, you could make a sphere preamp.

the HT board, on the other hand, does seem to be the dual servo circuit, straight out of the jensen/hardy app notes. unless i'm missing some added refinements that weren't mentioned. the dual servo is a solid circuit, and i'm sure the HT board will sound great. and, in fairness, HT isn't done with his kit yet, so there could be more to come.

mechanically, the eisen kit was tested to be compatible with API racks. jens owns an API lunchbox and some API modules. purple audio makes the biz in the same building, and has a large library of schematics and drawings. but you can't take a biz or 512 back panel off and put it on an eisen pre. jens came up with his own layout which was compatible with the others, he didn't just copy them.

in the end, i hope eisen, HT, ptownkid, and all DIYers who try to make it commercially succeed. but straight up copying is lame.

ed

 

[Ptownkid]

[quote author="edanderson"]putting those kits together isn't "difficult"[/quote]

aaaaaaaaahahahahahahaha, man i wish THAT were true.


Back to the topic at hand

yes, straight up copying it is a tad underhanded, and the better route would be to talk to eisen.

 

[Emperor-TK]

Does anyone else catch the irony here....API form factor? I think that 'lil L-bracket is getting too much credit...

-Chris

 

[laitue5]

[quote author="Emperor-TK"]I think that 'lil L-bracket is getting too much credit...[/quote]

And I have a similar L-bracket on a McCurdy EQ module.

 

[SSLtech]

[quote author="Ptownkid"][quote author="edanderson"]putting those kits together isn't "difficult"[/quote]

aaaaaaaaahahahahahahaha, man i wish THAT were true.[/quote]
I have to say; having done this sort of thing myself, I'm on Ed's side on that one.

There's nothing to putting thise kits together than I can't teach to an 18-year old intern.

Don't flatter yourself.

Keith

 

[usekgb]

[quote author="ruairioflaherty"]Handcrafted Tone (dude do you have a real name?)

I've put fairly serious thought into the idea of a DIY 500 series rack as I'm sure you have but I think the low power rails are a limiting factor for 500 series DIY. If I were going to (and I will time and money permitting) build a rack system I would design it to address the shortcomings of the 500 series most notably the low rails and the small front panel are. As has been discussed before I like the idea of-

-A 4U rack (this means longer front panels, more room for eq knobs, meters etc)
-high (er) voltage rails (+/-24v? and 48v) with regulators on board each unit ala 7th circel
-A deeper chassis to allow deeper units (in a perfect world one could even design a mating unit with regulators to allow 500 series modules to be used in the rack)


There are plenty issues that would need resolving to make this a reality but if it worked it would have all of the advantages of the 500 series (bar buying a rack off the shelf $$) and none of the disadvantages. Porting existing designs like the G1176, 990 servo pre (with full 24v rails), 1272ish pre would/could/might happen over time and the larger module size would allow more flexibilty for new projects.

I liked the sentiments expressed by Soundguy on here a while ago when he said that for him DIY was not about saving money but rather about building a box the way he wanted to and making it better - I would like to apply that to the 500 series but for now this is just talk Jens and Handcrafted are out there doing it for real,

cheers,
Ruairi[/quote]

Many of these issues have been taken care of already in the DBX 900 series or the Aphex 9000 series rack systems. They have +- 15v and +- 24v rails. A voltage doubler could be built in to the boards to get +48v and regulators could be added to get +-18v if required. Also, there are quite a few of these boards out there and Aphex is still making the 9000 series racks and cards to go in to them.

Cheers,
Zach

 

[Ptownkid]

[quote author="SSLtech"][quote author="Ptownkid"][quote author="edanderson"]putting those kits together isn't "difficult"[/quote]

aaaaaaaaahahahahahahaha, man i wish THAT were true.[/quote]
I have to say; having done this sort of thing myself, I'm on Ed's side on that one.

There's nothing to putting thise kits together than I can't teach to an 18-year old intern.

Don't flatter yourself.

Keith[/quote]

Kiss my ass dude, you have NO CLUE as to how much effort went into it.

 

[Greg]

Everybody just take it easy here...

No one is going to deny that effort and much time goes into putting together kits. My parts list took alot of time and effort to make, but they weren't "difficult" to make.

Let HT and Eisen figure this out... similar to the situation I ran into with JLM Joe when I made the Hotrod boards.

 

[Ptownkid]

Time is most definitely a variable of the degree of difficulty.

Regardless, I hate when someone else thinks that they can make an assumption as to how difficult something is for someone else based on how hard THEY find a task. That has to be one of the most ignorant things a person can possibly say.

Not to mention, I don't appreciate being insulted by someone for no reason.

 

[Handcrafted Tone]

alright guys, :wink: ,It takes a lot of time to put a kit together. If you learn this stuff on your own, it takes a lot more time and effort than having some one teach you how to do it. I'm proud to say I was a newbie here less than a year ago, and everything I know I owe to this comunity (and a TON of research)

btw I'll state again, I'm not planning on offering this pre as a kit, but it would include mounting hardware.

[quote author="ruairioflaherty"]Handcrafted Tone (dude do you have a real name?)
[/quote]

Hey Ruairi, my name is Rob (it's my signature). My handle was higginsrob before I decided to offer boards here. I would love to make designing/building gear my career, but as of now it costs 10x what I'm getting back.

A "better" rack system is a great idea, but I'm not the guy who's going to build it. It will take a dedicated person a boat load of time and money to build a rack system that is half as rugged and dependable as the API/Brent Averill/OSA racks. +24v rails would be great to clone vintage modules, but for anything new I'm not concerned by any lost headroom. I'm not running out of headroom with 16V. And after all that time and money... will anyone buy it? Don't get me wrong, if I had $5K to throw away I'd take a crack at it, but it seems 500 series is a much safer bet. Building your rack for yourself is another story. a side project I'm doing now is using the frac-rack from Paia to build a modular guitar fx rack. The metal is really cheap, and I have no intention of selling that stuff.

Thanks for the input though!

 

[Handcrafted Tone]

[quote author="TomWaterman"]Nice work Handcrafted! The olimex boards look good, how did they take to soldering?[/quote]

They solder great, they use immersion gold process. High quality stuff. A little tough to unsolder, but that is expected from 2 sided board.

 

[TomWaterman]

Thanks Rob - good to hear. If you don't mind me asking, how much did they quote you to make non-euro card sizes and de-panelize the opamp boards? Or did you cut them up yourself?

PM me if you wanna answer, if not no worries.
Cheers Tom

 

[Handcrafted Tone]

no problem,

They don't charge for panelization. I fit all those projects on their DSQ, 320mm x 200mm for about $150 after shipping. They do not make cut outs on this prototype board, so I cut out the edge connector and output xformer myself. This is the best price/quality I've seen yet, and makes me regret the etch tank I bought. You can save even more with a single sided design.

 

[TomWaterman]

Thanks again Rob - I wondered if you did the cut-outs. While we are on that subject whats the cleanest way to do that without it being a time consuming drill and saw process?

Anyone know what PCB houses use, a CNC router? Maybe something cheaper...

Cheers Tom

 

[Handcrafted Tone]

I used a dremel with a little circular saw bit for the output xformer, and a jig saw for the edge connector.

Advanced Circuits - http://www.4pcb.com/index.htm - has CNC router, but it's expensive. They have decent price breaks when you buy in bulk.

 

[SSLtech]

[quote author="Ptownkid"]Kiss my ass dude, you have NO CLUE as to how much effort went into it.[/quote]
Thanks for paying attention.

I didn't mention effort, I just said I coult teaxch in intern to do it, and I stand by that. -Pay attention.

And no, I won't kiss your ass, thanks.

Design something ORIGINAL yourself, then tell me to kiss your ass.

Dipshit.

Keith

 

[Handcrafted Tone]

intermission:

:sam: :sam: :sam: :sam:
:guinness: :guinness: :guinness: :guinness:

 

[Ptownkid]

[quote author="SSLtech"][quote author="Ptownkid"]Kiss my ass dude, you have NO CLUE as to how much effort went into it.[/quote]
Thanks for paying attention.

I didn't mention effort, I just said I coult teaxch in intern to do it, and I stand by that. -Pay attention.

And no, I won't kiss your ass, thanks.

Design something ORIGINAL yourself, then tell me to kiss your ass.

Dipshit.

Keith[/quote]

What you said champ, was that I "shouldn't flatter myself", as if to say I didn't work my ass off getting them together.

It's of little consequence anyhow, I'm not the one that has to live with you being an *******.

 

[dshay]

we're not talking about which caps you prefer, fellas.

everybody, install hoods, you're huffing too much flux.