Protests - George Floyd

[JohnRoberts]

Virtually impossible with the strength of the unions and with people like Kroll running them.  This is why  I asked about him in the other thread.  But you implied it's lazy thinking and not constructive.  So it's rather unclear of what your position is.

I am repeating myself but sunlight is the best disinfectant.

A) publish body cam footage... public inspection should help identify serial offenders and provide evidence that can not be ignored.

B) The FBI just started collecting a database about force used in arrests. This database just started a little over a year ago, but this should reveal if there is systematic problems.

Law abiding protests are a protected constitutional right.... rioting and looting are not. The premise that calls for reform have been ignored as an excuse for violence is not supported by evidence.  Truth is a squishy thing and not objective like data... The same people who tell you who to vote for, and what brand of TP to buy, are telling you to hate all police. IMO the police (with a few obvious exceptions) are the good guys and all that is preventing our civilization from collapsing into chaos. In a classic "follow the money" exercise look at who benefits from making America weaker and even more divided.

JR

PS; Maybe ask yourself why the DOJ/FBI is only now collecting data on excessive force (why didn't earlier administrations take action?). Excessive force during arrest is not really a federal crime so it needs to be classified as a "hate crime" for federal statues to apply.  That said a federal database documenting problems will help states and municipalities to take action.  Of course the democratic house will not let this man made crisis go to waste and come to the rescue of would be voters with un-passable legislation to virtue signal, with a presidential vote only months away.  :

 

[living sounds]

No doubt much of his loyal base believe such sh*te but, wtf? 

Trump tweets baseless crap that the  75-year-old guy hospitalized after police shoved him to the ground was possibly  “an antifa provocateur” and that the incident “could be a set-up”!

I realise he only has a limited repertoire and he has been holed up in the bunker but still...

Edit:  Actually, on thinking some more about this, I'm actually horrified.  The White House just  personally discredited an American citizen.  That's dangerous stuff.

This is pricisely why even his loyal base is now showing signs of starting to crumble. There is hope.

 

[living sounds]

I wasn't going to post this and may delete it later .
Speaking with someone I was told a story that it is said when you hear people say "my life flashed before my eyes" in a stressful scenario , it is your mind searching it's memories for a past experience to draw from that can help  instruct how to respond.

When there is nothing there, all bets are off on how people may respond.

It takes a lot of training to upload this data to your brain so that your responses are second nature and not driven by an emotional freak out if that makes sense....

Police not only react, but also act differently in the US from the get go. Maybe this has to do with the blasted gun love in the US, but a routine traffic stop in Britain or Germany tends to go down very differently. There's a huge difference in overall attitude. US police more often appear to act with a general distrust, even hostility. Which is not to say that other countries don't have problems with police and policing, but this was always very obvious to me. Even as a tourist you get warned how to behave in the US when engaging police officers. That just isn't necessary in many other western countries...

 

[living sounds]

https://youtu.be/4rHuinnfVJo

 

[fazer]

My first encounter with a U.S. police officer I was just 18.  Kinda long, sorry:

On tour in Jason Bonhams band, we were opening act forJimmy Page & Paul Rogers'    'The Firm'.  Never mind, you won't remember them. Or know us, not the point.
In some hotel . In Atlanta. 
Jason and I go down to the hotel restaurant for food after the gig.
Jason is recognised down there as some kids had been at the gig and he so he is signing an autograph while
cheekily grabbing a couple of French fries off the kid.  No one is bothering anyone.
Some cop is in there and, I guess?, doesn't like the look of us standing there, still wearing our glam '80's rock hair, makeup, clothes etc.

Walks over and "makes a stance".  Wants to know what the hell trouble we're causing.  We have no idea what he was talking about and  are just being us, kids having fun, pretending we're real rock stars.
Cop tells us to leave.  We say we're staying at the hotel.
He insists then we show him proof.  Jason is getting upset  and I'm trying to explain our passports and stuff are upstairs and we just really wanna eat.

He pulls his 'weapon' out, shoves it in my stomach and says "wanna argue about it?'  I say "no, we're leaving to go upstairs now"  He says "Good.  And wipe that sh*t off your eyes, your mother had a boy!"

Jason is crying in the room for 30 minutes after.  I'm in shock, finally realising that we really could have gotten shot.

Nice one.  Not  :/

That explains a lot of your feelings in this matter.  Thanks for sharing.

 

[john12ax7]

In the US there is definitely an adversarial relationship between police and citizens, much more so than in other western democracies.  Hopefully reform will come.

 

[cyrano]

In the US there is definitely an adversarial relationship between police and citizens, much more so than in other western democracies.  Hopefully reform will come.

Not only police, I'm afraid. It seems averything related to federal or even local government is seen as the enemy by a part of the population.

In France, most people consider their govt to be theirs. After all "La France, c'est nous", n'est ce pas?

 

[manulaudic]

Anybody else reading or listening to Coleman Hughes ?

 

[cyrano]

Fox News stoops to a new low:

https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/politics/fox-news-runs-digitally-altered-images-in-coverage-of-seattles-protests-capitol-hill-autonomous-zone/

Photoshopping together pics from fifferent places and different dates is an error these days?

Were they really hoping nobody would notice these fake photos? I mean, how stupid can you be?

 

[crazydoc]

I mean, how stupid can you be?

As stupid Fox's mentor, President Pants-On-Fire.

And hey, that cardboard gunman with the green mask sure gets around.

 

[scott2000]

I'm confused. Where was the gunman with the green mask taken from?  It's fake?
That's crazy.. Wtf?

 

[crazydoc]

I'm confused. Where was the gunman with the green mask taken from?  It's fake?
That's crazy.. Wtf?

Did you read the article?

'The June 10 photo of an unidentified man with a gun standing in front of a car in CHAZ was taken by Seattle freelance photographer David Ryder, who distributed the photo through Getty Images.

The image, as displayed on the Fox News website, was spliced with other photos, including a photo of a smashed retail storefront in May, making it look as though the scene was all playing out concurrently in the autonomous zone. “It is definitely Photoshopped,” confirmed Ryder. “To use a photo out of context in a journalistic setting like that seems unethical.” '

Seems unethical?  Just more lies - they've learned their lessons well from the Liar-in-chief.

 

[scott2000]

Did you read the article?

'The June 10 photo of an unidentified man with a gun standing in front of a car in CHAZ was taken by Seattle freelance photographer David Ryder, who distributed the photo through Getty Images.

Ok..I was confused because I thought the reports of that guy  in relation to there being armed gunman in CHAZ after police left were not true....

I never saw the spliced homepage photo but yeah...it's clearly a bunch of different events....

 

[desol]

Shoulda stayed home...

 

[desol]

Has anyone seen the newly released footage of George Floyd's arrest. He was clearly caught peddling counterfeit cash. I heard every word between the officers and him while he was being apprehended. He was resisting arrest even though he knew he was guilty. He was clearly having mental problems or something. The officers were fairly calm and cool. He was resisting arrest the officer didn't believe him...and for good reason....he had already been resisting for a while. Officer Chauvin made a mistake in not getting off of him no doubt...and put him on his side.  It was clearly unintended.

Far from the murderous rhetoric all over the tabloids. Nonsense BS.

 

[JohnRoberts]

Has anyone seen the newly released footage of George Floyd's arrest. He was clearly caught peddling counterfeit cash. I heard every word between the officers and him while he was being apprehended. He was resisting arrest even though he knew he was guilty. He was clearly having mental problems or something. The officers were fairly calm and cool. He was resisting arrest the officer didn't believe him...and for good reason....he had already been resisting for a while. Officer Chauvin made a mistake in not getting off of him no doubt...and put him on his side.  It was clearly unintended.

Far from the murderous rhetoric all over the tabloids. Nonsense BS.

That police body cam video was leaked by the Daily Mail .... I watched it (or skimmed it). It does not unilaterally exonerate Chavin, or irrevocably damn Floyd, while he was far from a rational, compliant detainee (IMO). His behavior seems inconsistent with the mainstream media's story (but I guess that depends on where you get your koolaid). 

I will leave it to everyone to draw their own conclusions. This video has already been blocked from mainstream forums, but it is now out in the internet ether and they can't keep that suppressed forever.

I am reluctant to share the video here. While it is arguably an accurate representation of what was recorded on the body cam.  I do not expect the mass American audience to have the patience to watch the full 8:38 (I didn't).

I wish we could just put this ugly incident behind us... A little cinema verit'e may shed some light on this darkness, or just reopen the ugly wound. I somehow doubt that watching the video will change anybody's mind, as usual for such issues.

JR



 

 

[fazer]

Has anyone seen the newly released footage of George Floyd's arrest. He was clearly caught peddling counterfeit cash. I heard every word between the officers and him while he was being apprehended. He was resisting arrest even though he knew he was guilty. He was clearly having mental problems or something. The officers were fairly calm and cool. He was resisting arrest the officer didn't believe him...and for good reason....he had already been resisting for a while. Officer Chauvin made a mistake in not getting off of him no doubt...and put him on his side.  It was clearly unintended.

Far from the murderous rhetoric all over the tabloids. Nonsense BS.

So why did they not release the footage right away.  People are fed up with a lot of things and vented but how much damage is  done over this. And for what.  To many motives and callings to go away now.    I’m glad I dont live in the city.  I’ve got friends trying to move out of Denver that lived down by the capital.  Broken windows graffiti all over city and county building.  Police watching people destroy things in front of them.    Lots of things to fix over a runaway media with peaceful  protest in the day and hoodlums at night.    So many anarchy people that want to destroy not build anything.  And I don’t see this changing after the election.  What affect will this have during the election?  Lots of people silent that do t agree with destruction of their neighborhoods.   

 

[JohnRoberts]

So why did they not release the footage right away.  People are fed up with a lot of things and vented but how much damage is  done over this. And for what.  To many motives and callings to go away now.    I’m glad I dont live in the city.  I’ve got friends trying to move out of Denver that lived down by the capital.  Broken windows graffiti all over city and county building.  Police watching people destroy things in front of them.    Lots of things to fix over a runaway media with peaceful  protest in the day and hoodlums at night.    So many anarchy people that want to destroy not build anything.  And I don’t see this changing after the election.  What affect will this have during the election?  Lots of people silent that do t agree with destruction of their neighborhoods. 

I have suggested before that police body cam videos should be streamed live, or published daily after perhaps editing for privacy issues. They could pixilate faces for general release, to conceal identities.

I worry a little about selective editing to promote competing agendas. I do not expect the public to have the patience to watch hours of raw body cam footage from every officer, every day.

JR

 

[Scodiddly]

Cops aren't supposed to kill guilty people either.

 

[JohnRoberts]

Cops aren't supposed to kill guilty people either.

True...  nobody is saying that they are?

JR