Recommended Osciloscope
- Thread starter opacheco
- Start date
Help Support GroupDIY Audio Forum:
Iamkimosabi
Member
- Joined
- Mar 5, 2019
- Messages
- 17
S.Samuelsson
Active member
Hi.
That's more of a collectors item.
And a pretty "recent" one at that
.
With a quick glance, the price is about what those go for.
That said, I still occasionally use my first one I bought in ~90 or so single trace Telequipment s54a, from roughly the same era.
A friend of mine has the dual trace version, and occasionally uses it as well.
While these 10MHz scopes are still perfectly adequate for audio, especially tube audio, the absence of a second trace makes troubleshooting for example phase, gain and amplification related issues a bit of a hassle.
Both the accuracy (if the advertized 200KHz bandwidth is correct) and reliability (to a degree) will probably be improved, but I'd look for a dual trace scope instead.
Makes life a whole lot easier.
OTOH, if that RCA works well, the probe is included (for testing if for nothing else, probes are nowadays cheap), and there's nothing else available locally, IMHO one can't go wrong with these oldies.
The key is to be able to test it, so a signal generator of some sort is a must.
If I'd need/want one, would definitely not by one if I couldn't test it.
Regards,
Sam
That's more of a collectors item.
And a pretty "recent" one at that
.With a quick glance, the price is about what those go for.
That said, I still occasionally use my first one I bought in ~90 or so single trace Telequipment s54a, from roughly the same era.
A friend of mine has the dual trace version, and occasionally uses it as well.
While these 10MHz scopes are still perfectly adequate for audio, especially tube audio, the absence of a second trace makes troubleshooting for example phase, gain and amplification related issues a bit of a hassle.
Both the accuracy (if the advertized 200KHz bandwidth is correct) and reliability (to a degree) will probably be improved, but I'd look for a dual trace scope instead.
Makes life a whole lot easier
.OTOH, if that RCA works well, the probe is included (for testing if for nothing else, probes are nowadays cheap), and there's nothing else available locally, IMHO one can't go wrong with these oldies.
The key is to be able to test it, so a signal generator of some sort is a must.
If I'd need/want one, would definitely not by one if I couldn't test it.
Regards,
Sam
iampoor1
Well-known member
Nope, that's about 65$ too expensive
I wouldn't buy a scope with a single channel these days. Too much stuff you can't do without a second channel.
How is this one? It's a bit out of my price range, but maybe i can offer a lower price
https://www.ebay.com/itm/3639731557...4TQfKAf+U1qnoM0Y0ZEUxw3w==|tkp:Bk9SR4rNn5GHYg
https://www.ebay.com/itm/3639731557...4TQfKAf+U1qnoM0Y0ZEUxw3w==|tkp:Bk9SR4rNn5GHYg
Those were good scopes back in the day. Pretty old now, and the floppy drive for storing means you probably won't be able to share screen captures or raw data with anyone (I'm just assuming you don't still have a computer with a floppy drive and a stash of disks).
Dang it...ok the search continues.
I mostly due 2 channel audio, do I need an oscilloscope with more than 2 channels? Do I really need one in the MHZ range if im only doing 20hz-20khz?
industrialarts
Well-known member
- Joined
- Oct 1, 2020
- Messages
- 130
I have one of those as well. It's not my main scope, I use it mainly o monitor amplifier outputs either into my test speaker or test load. I think it's fantastic for general purpose audio use. What surprised me was how useful it was to track down parasitic oscillations in tube amps. Plus, it has a DVM read out that show RMS voltage so I easily calculate wattage out. For the money, I don't think you can beat it. A lot more features than what I mentioned, if I were still out doing studio repair, it'd be my go to scope.
Probably not, it is convenient to look at things like multiple pins of a device at once, like base, collector, and emitter at once, or +in, -in, and output of an op-amp, or input, output, and control signal of a compressor.
You can usually do the same thing making pair-by-pair measurements, it just takes longer, so a two channel is better than nothing.
Definitely into the MHz range to check for oscillations. Maybe not to 500MHz, 50 MHz would be plenty for most audio circuits.
S.Samuelsson
Active member
Hi.
While a nuisance for anyone that is used to modern data transfer systems between computer equipment, the obvious and understandable lack of floppy drives on modern computers should IMO not hold anyone back from purchasing/using a piece of equipment that has only a floppy drive for external data transfer.
Unless of course the equipment in question uses a disc system that isn't recognized by any modern protocols.
There are workarounds, but those usually means purchasing even more stuff.
USB-floppy drives -and the disks as well for that matter- are nowadays quite a bit more expensive than they were a while before (again, obviously), but still available anyway.
Sometimes swimming against the current and hoarding stuff everyone else sees as crap for decades really pays off.
Agreed.
For a hobbyist, I'd say that 10MHz is better than nothing and ok for crude class A & A/B work, 20MHz has a decent resolution for almost any A & A/B (C,G, H) work, and anything above that is an added convenience when working with those classes of amplifiers.
If Class D amplification or modern RF systems (or the interference those RF systems cause) are high on ones list of the required things to measure, the Herzs start to matter much more.
Regards,
Sam
While a nuisance for anyone that is used to modern data transfer systems between computer equipment, the obvious and understandable lack of floppy drives on modern computers should IMO not hold anyone back from purchasing/using a piece of equipment that has only a floppy drive for external data transfer.
Unless of course the equipment in question uses a disc system that isn't recognized by any modern protocols.
There are workarounds, but those usually means purchasing even more stuff.
USB-floppy drives -and the disks as well for that matter- are nowadays quite a bit more expensive than they were a while before (again, obviously), but still available anyway.
Sometimes swimming against the current and hoarding stuff everyone else sees as crap for decades really pays off
.Agreed.
For a hobbyist, I'd say that 10MHz is better than nothing and ok for crude class A & A/B work, 20MHz has a decent resolution for almost any A & A/B (C,G, H) work, and anything above that is an added convenience when working with those classes of amplifiers.
If Class D amplification or modern RF systems (or the interference those RF systems cause) are high on ones list of the required things to measure, the Herzs start to matter much more.
Regards,
Sam
I can't afford some of these Tektronix 2000+ oscilloscopes. Especially as a beginner/noob/hobbyist. I think my budget is around 150-200. Can anyone suggest me something in that price range for audio? If there is nothing in that range, and you think I should save more money for something better...please let me know. Thanks
warpie
Well-known member
- Joined
- Feb 7, 2009
- Messages
- 1,603
I think it has been discussed a few times but you can find very decent, brand new, 4-ch oscilloscopes for $400-500.
They can do bode plot also.
No reason to buy a 2-ch scope if you can get the 4-ch version for a little bit extra money.
Consider the need to measure and compare the I/Os of a stereo unit for example.
They can do bode plot also.
No reason to buy a 2-ch scope if you can get the 4-ch version for a little bit extra money.
Consider the need to measure and compare the I/Os of a stereo unit for example.
RuudNL
Well-known member
In December 2022 I bought a digital oscilloscope (Rigol DS1102Z-E) and from the moment I unpacked it I regret that decision.
Now I have a real analog (dual trace) oscilloscope. What a relief!
Nice thin line on the screen without any digital jitter...
Now I have a real analog (dual trace) oscilloscope. What a relief!
Nice thin line on the screen without any digital jitter...
Last edited:
Hey Ruud, what brand and model? What was the financial damage?
Both of our shops are equipped with low/mid range Siglent scopes and signal generators. Like some of the other brands from years before the signal generator and scope mate up and can to automatic Bode plots and such.
SCOPE BUYING NOTES FROM AMP-HAUS:
Brand/Type/AGE: If you are not designing new gear - just troubleshooting something or building a kit type thing you really dont need a powerful scope. Get a new scope, I know there are tons of used ones out there, but honestly; if you are just starting out get an affordable NEW one in a KNOWN brand that is readily available at REAL outlets in your country (not Amazon or eBay). The last thing you want is to have your "new" scope to become your new fix-it project. If you are at this stage in your electronics work journey, you do not want to start with troubleshooting and calibration of an antique scope. Plus the equipment to calibrate test equipment is even more costly.
"A DMM is better"?!: I forget who said this above but I will spare your name here... A scope can do everything a DMM can do in the right hands, and much more. A scope IS a DMM (MM), and so much more - it's also your audio probe. Yes those are handy little tools too, but If I had to pick ONE... Scope!
Channels: You need, at minimum, double the number of channels you are working on if you plan on testing/verifying in that way. But a single channel scope can troubleshoot things as well, it can just be tedious. You will need two channels to do a Bode plot with most scopes.
Kajillihertz: to get started with basic work you really do not need a scope that goes way beyond audio, honest. 10-50MHz is more than enough for day to day repair.
Don't forget to get a matching NEW signal generator; or highly serviceable old one if you want to do Bode Plots manually.
I am not saying you don't want a DMM or Audio Probe, those are handy. But a scope can do those things.
What else is in the shop?
Other than the really expensive test equipment, both of our repair rooms have exactly the same day to day test and repair equipment, so anyone can effectible work from either room. We both have a small Fluke Handheld DMM that we use for quick troubleshooting/verifications, most often for checking heavy guitar amps before we lug them into one of the repair shops. Both shops also have 2 tabletop 6 digit DMM's (HP), these get used much more than the handhelds, eventually you will likely want one of those. The downstairs shop also has the R&S UPD Audio Analyzer, and Tekronix 576 Curve Tracer.
BOTH SHOPS ALSO HAVE A COPY OF THIS OLD HANDY BOOK: "Handbook of Oscilloscopes: Theory and application" by John D. Lenk
While very old and dated (many scopes do the tests mentioned in the book automatically now). It does give you some enormously valuable insight as to how to use your scope and why it's doing what it does. (pics attached). Get the second edition if you can find it (1982). With modern scopes the book is most useful form Chapter 8 and beyond. Somewhere before there they go over resistance and capacitance measurements.
Chapter 8: Using Oscilloscopes with Signal Generators (great stuff about filters and input/output impedance here)
Chapter 9: Checking individual components (transistor tests, FET tests, Diode tests, Potentiometers tests, relay tests..)
Chapter 10: Checking amplifiers and amplifier circuits (signal tracing, frequency response, power output, noise, distortion, phase shift, slew rate
Chapter 11: Checking Communications Equipment
Chapter 12: Checking Industrial Devices...
Well worth the couple bucks it normally brings on eBay.
I hope someone finds my Sunday morning ramblings helpful.
SCOPE BUYING NOTES FROM AMP-HAUS:
Brand/Type/AGE: If you are not designing new gear - just troubleshooting something or building a kit type thing you really dont need a powerful scope. Get a new scope, I know there are tons of used ones out there, but honestly; if you are just starting out get an affordable NEW one in a KNOWN brand that is readily available at REAL outlets in your country (not Amazon or eBay). The last thing you want is to have your "new" scope to become your new fix-it project. If you are at this stage in your electronics work journey, you do not want to start with troubleshooting and calibration of an antique scope. Plus the equipment to calibrate test equipment is even more costly.
"A DMM is better"?!: I forget who said this above but I will spare your name here... A scope can do everything a DMM can do in the right hands, and much more. A scope IS a DMM (MM), and so much more - it's also your audio probe. Yes those are handy little tools too, but If I had to pick ONE... Scope!
Channels: You need, at minimum, double the number of channels you are working on if you plan on testing/verifying in that way. But a single channel scope can troubleshoot things as well, it can just be tedious. You will need two channels to do a Bode plot with most scopes.
Kajillihertz: to get started with basic work you really do not need a scope that goes way beyond audio, honest. 10-50MHz is more than enough for day to day repair.
Don't forget to get a matching NEW signal generator; or highly serviceable old one if you want to do Bode Plots manually.
I am not saying you don't want a DMM or Audio Probe, those are handy. But a scope can do those things.
What else is in the shop?
Other than the really expensive test equipment, both of our repair rooms have exactly the same day to day test and repair equipment, so anyone can effectible work from either room. We both have a small Fluke Handheld DMM that we use for quick troubleshooting/verifications, most often for checking heavy guitar amps before we lug them into one of the repair shops. Both shops also have 2 tabletop 6 digit DMM's (HP), these get used much more than the handhelds, eventually you will likely want one of those. The downstairs shop also has the R&S UPD Audio Analyzer, and Tekronix 576 Curve Tracer.
BOTH SHOPS ALSO HAVE A COPY OF THIS OLD HANDY BOOK: "Handbook of Oscilloscopes: Theory and application" by John D. Lenk
While very old and dated (many scopes do the tests mentioned in the book automatically now). It does give you some enormously valuable insight as to how to use your scope and why it's doing what it does. (pics attached). Get the second edition if you can find it (1982). With modern scopes the book is most useful form Chapter 8 and beyond. Somewhere before there they go over resistance and capacitance measurements.
Chapter 8: Using Oscilloscopes with Signal Generators (great stuff about filters and input/output impedance here)
Chapter 9: Checking individual components (transistor tests, FET tests, Diode tests, Potentiometers tests, relay tests..)
Chapter 10: Checking amplifiers and amplifier circuits (signal tracing, frequency response, power output, noise, distortion, phase shift, slew rate
Chapter 11: Checking Communications Equipment
Chapter 12: Checking Industrial Devices...
Well worth the couple bucks it normally brings on eBay.
I hope someone finds my Sunday morning ramblings helpful.
Attachments
Last edited:
Similar threads
