Soliloqueen's k87(k67) and k47 capsules

[tomas.borgstrom]

Well, compared to ribbons, which were the main vocal mics at the time, they were quite sibilant.

Microtech Geffel, who sells mics (or used to) with M7 capsules in PVC, used to say that those mics fall out of spec. and the capsule needs replacement after a while.

Indeed, some people like the lack of bass that is associated with old membranes, for close-up vocals, though.

Just so you don’t get me wrong. I don’t like those capsules at all. I send them for reskin. As I said. I’ve heard two with maintained low end. I’ve also seen and heard twenty year old dried Gefell M7 that sounded very brittle. An expensive product that deteriorates so fast is not acceptable.

I think the PVC debate is an obsession. I don’t work with membranes myself but those who do say it’s a terrible material for that application. Neumann gave up in the 50’s.

I’m sure Arienne can give us a much longer explanation on this topic.

 

[Moby]

Mylar. Drefahl does not do PVC. I've heard a few M7 with the original membrane in good shape. To my ears the M7 reskinned by Drefahl sound the same. Thiersch blue line (PVC) does not sound like Neumann Berlin M7 at all.

Thumb up for the Peter Drefahl work. My experience with his reskins is the same.

 

[Recording Engineer]

So for some of you, Drefahl skinned 3U M7 is where it’s at? If so, got 3U… Mailing is not a problem.

 

[soliloqueen]

So for some of you, Drefahl skinned 3U M7 is where it’s at? If so, got 3U… Mailing is not a problem.

It seems this is difficult though as the capacitance gap is wrong? So it's a high effort reskin for him

 

[Recording Engineer]

It seems this is difficult though as the capacitance gap is wrong? So it's a high effort reskin for him

Hadn’t heard that yet, but I wouldn’t be surprised! I’ve had this 3U for a few years now… Still haven’t tried it in anything yet! But same as your V1 Flat K47 pair of your’s I still have! I did finally put that pair of your V1 K67/87 in 67 types with Moby transformers and Mullard 10Ms from Christian. Definitely brighter/extended as you had mentioned they’d be. I still haven’t used them much, but honestly, they’ve already grown on me! It makes you realize how rolled-off on the top the original actually is!

 

[thomasdf]

I am doing a lot of A/B tests in a beautiful 47 build, and so far my favorite is a 3U m7 capsule, but to my ears it sounds a liiiittle too flat and lacks a tiny bit of oomph in the low mids to get that smoky / golden era tone. On top of that it sounds great up close, but lacks a bit of that *zing* when backup up from the capsule to a more usual / standard distance.

Would your vintage k47 be a better candidate for oomph and response coherence ?
Any plans of working on m7s or are you def not working with glue and membranes ?

 

[MaxxDM]

M7's were designed with PVC in mind. Originally, I think they used a membrane of some kind of pine resin or something like that. PVC is elastic in all directions, so it adapts to the capsule, so to speak. On the other hand mylar is quite stiff and does not stretch as much.

As you can imagine, because of the glue process, an elastic membrane is more forgiving than one that is stiff. With the mounting ring, you make the job a lot easier when using Mylar, I think.

Also M7's presence peak (not the 10Khz) was more pronounced on early M7's. Perhaps the more rubbery-sounding PVC (when new), had a sound that was a bit deeper and 'vocal' than with the mylar membrane. I certainly noticed that switching from Mylar to PVC made the capsule more dynamic-sounding in the low mids. Maybe because of the 'stretch' of PVC, I am just guessing here.

I do remember not liking it at first, because things like pick attack sounded a bit dull by comparison. This became a non issue after a year or so, although I always went for the 67 capsule for acoustic, for some reason.

Seems PVC M7 membranes also had a different thickness, and I imagine that the equivalent thickness in Mylar would not work in the exact same way.

The M7 interested me because of the Beatles connection, however, now knowing more about the aging of pvc capsules, I suspect that those u47's had K47's in them by the early 60's. Just guessing.. Sgt Peppers does sound more like K47 were used, to me..

Personally, all things considered, I would rather stick with a good K47 or K67 for the Neumann sound.